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Old 07-26-2015, 12:25 PM
 
4,232 posts, read 6,055,987 times
Reputation: 10095

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So when the stock market crashes in the next year or two year will Obama be able to claim that prize?

A lot of people have a hard time realizing that we're in a major asset bubble right now because of QE.
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Old 07-26-2015, 12:43 PM
 
Location: Billings, MT
9,535 posts, read 7,831,724 times
Reputation: 13276
Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57 View Post
I guess if any of you were president, you'd do a bang-up job. The country would have no debt.

Judging presidents by debt is ridiculous anyway. FDR and George Washington were president when the country was in enormous debt. They're two of our best presidents. Andrew Jackson paid off the debt, and it helped bring about the worst depression the country had seen at that point.

Republicans obsess about the debt too much. They think its like personal debt.
One thing I do not ever have to worry about is what I would do as President. That just won't happen!
As for the National Debt, YOUR share (and mine) is now over $57,000 dollars. Please pay up.
I can't, I would have to declare bankruptcy.
Greece is broke. How long until the United States has to admit that we are too? Regardless of what some may think, the bucket is NOT bottomless. Sooner or later, the debt has to be paid. Where will the money come from?
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Old 07-26-2015, 02:12 PM
 
9,286 posts, read 4,272,124 times
Reputation: 11030
Quote:
Originally Posted by TristramShandy View Post
Well if there's one thing that the Republicans have, it's candidates. None of them are any good, but they sure have a lot of them.


Right, every single one of the (R's) are bad, totally devoid of any executive experience, having records of failure, and above all are untrustworthy.
This in stark comparison to the field of (D) candidates which are loaded with executive experience, have records of accomplishments, and most importantly are trustworthy.

If the (D) frontrunner is any indication, you live in a very deluded and/or partisan world to make such sweeping statements about all the (R's) considering the alternate.

`
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Old 07-26-2015, 02:17 PM
 
7,083 posts, read 4,088,932 times
Reputation: 6206
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
Of course your post is ridiculous in that it tries to point to Obama as some sort of savior. No one believes that, and your figures only show that Obama took over right after the real estate crash - nothing else.

Fact is, fewer people work today, they make less, and more people are on welfare than during the Bush administration.
And that's why the Democrats can't find a candidate to run for president.
We'll see how the Primaries go

Clinton will have a lot of Benghazi talk to deal with, for now Sanders is creating a lot of Ron Paul type hype, we'll see how much that holds up.

As for the Republicans who is really running a good campaign for them?

Scott Walker will have the Koch affiliation used against him
Trump is well... Trump
Jeb Bush lost his campaign already, and who really wants ANOTHER Bush?
Ben Carson lost his campaign with his 'Homosexuality is a choice'
Mike Huckabee's largest campaign contributor is Citizen's United, the party in the lawsuit that created this mess of a political system we operate in
Lindsey Graham lacks charisma and won't last too long and he's too affiliated with McCain and other RINOs which will upset the Republican Primary voting base (The more extreme faction not the Rank and File that vote in the General Election).

Nobody is really shining right now except the buzz around Sanders and Trump
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Old 07-26-2015, 02:25 PM
 
9,286 posts, read 4,272,124 times
Reputation: 11030
Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57 View Post

Republicans obsess about the debt too much. They think its like personal debt.
Wait, what?

How on earth can you make such a statement. You must not realize money does not grow on government tree farms, and instead is supplied by the American public via taxes.
So the national debt is in fact our personal debt, unless you like the idea of passing that debt on to your children/grandchildren. Even then, you must realize that the bill will come due eventually.

I also like how they say every single citizen owes $____ amount, as if every citizen is pulling his or her own weight.
In reality that figure practically would need to be doubled if we consider that almost 1/2 our population are not currently paying federal income taxes.

As an FYI - Don't try being overly partisan because the (D's) scream about the debt when a (R) is in office. However as a general rule, conservatives are always more concerned about fiscal responsibility vs. that of the tax and spend liberals.
I just wish there was some way of making liberals with money live on a micro level with their own money. Then they could see how many strangers could live with them on their dime and do nothing for it, before they would say "enough is enough". How long do you think it would take, 2-3 months?
The only reason they espouse their feel good utopian ideals is because they want to do it with other peoples money.

`
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Old 07-26-2015, 02:30 PM
 
29,352 posts, read 26,306,390 times
Reputation: 10262
No one can argue with the fact that the market loves Obama but he hasn't done diddly about gun safety.
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Old 07-26-2015, 02:51 PM
 
610 posts, read 580,986 times
Reputation: 1299
Quote:
Originally Posted by JGMotorsport64 View Post
We'll see how the Primaries go

Clinton will have a lot of Benghazi talk to deal with, for now Sanders is creating a lot of Ron Paul type hype, we'll see how much that holds up.

As for the Republicans who is really running a good campaign for them?

Scott Walker will have the Koch affiliation used against him
Trump is well... Trump
Jeb Bush lost his campaign already, and who really wants ANOTHER Bush?
Ben Carson lost his campaign with his 'Homosexuality is a choice'
Mike Huckabee's largest campaign contributor is Citizen's United, the party in the lawsuit that created this mess of a political system we operate in
Lindsey Graham lacks charisma and won't last too long and he's too affiliated with McCain and other RINOs which will upset the Republican Primary voting base (The more extreme faction not the Rank and File that vote in the General Election).

Nobody is really shining right now except the buzz around Sanders and Trump
Sanders' record proves he's a corporate stooge. Ron Paul was clean as a whistle. It won't hold up in grassroots form, but he might be able to dupe enough young people that read too much Alternet to actually swing a nomination, considering how terrible Hillary is.
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Old 07-26-2015, 03:05 PM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
88,061 posts, read 3,669,328 times
Reputation: 7494
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
If there was really something there, all the GOP hearings and complaining would have sunk in with the votes before now. The GOP still cares about it, the Democrats don't. That leaves the non-aligned voters, and on that issue they have lost all interest or even the sense that there's anything there.

I'm not thrilled with Hillary, but if you're pinning your hopes on Benghazi, you're living in a fantasyland of GOP nerdism.
The ones who obsess about Benghazi are the ones with the Fox logo permanently burned into the corner of their TV screens.
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Old 07-26-2015, 03:36 PM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
5,450 posts, read 3,755,521 times
Reputation: 9257
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector1 View Post
Wait, what?

How on earth can you make such a statement. You must not realize money does not grow on government tree farms, and instead is supplied by the American public via taxes.
So the national debt is in fact our personal debt, unless you like the idea of passing that debt on to your children/grandchildren. Even then, you must realize that the bill will come due eventually.

I also like how they say every single citizen owes $____ amount, as if every citizen is pulling his or her own weight.
In reality that figure practically would need to be doubled if we consider that almost 1/2 our population are not currently paying federal income taxes.

As an FYI - Don't try being overly partisan because the (D's) scream about the debt when a (R) is in office. However as a general rule, conservatives are always more concerned about fiscal responsibility vs. that of the tax and spend liberals.
I just wish there was some way of making liberals with money live on a micro level with their own money. Then they could see how many strangers could live with them on their dime and do nothing for it, before they would say "enough is enough". How long do you think it would take, 2-3 months?
The only reason they espouse their feel good utopian ideals is because they want to do it with other peoples money.

`
Let me ask you this - did your family pay back the World War II debt? It was much larger. Did the U.S. send cars or oil or gold to some bank to pay it off?

The entire world monetary system is somewhat of a fiction. When you realize that, you realize the debt doesn't matter. The U.S. Dollar is the world's reserve currency, and we control it.

Who is going to call in the U.S.'s debts? Hmmm? Who is this overlord that is more powerful than the most powerful country in the world? Maybe it's the holders of that chunk of foreign debt?


Most of our debt is like your left hand lending dirt to your right. When you need more dirt, you reach down and scoop it up. Maybe it's the holders of that chunk of foreign debt that will call our debt in? Of that foreign chunk - most of that is held by Japanese and Chinese interests who have bought treasury securities. Those are more like investments, they cannot "call in" that debt.

To make a household analogy - we can't compare something like a car loan or a mortgage because that money comes from a bank and the bank's collateral is the house and it's all paid for in currency you don't control. If you take on too many big purchases with someone else's money and you don't make the payments, you're in trouble - because it was never your money.
A more accurate household analogy would be parents issuing coupons that kids get when they do chores. Parents can make new coupons whenever they want. The only danger is if the kids lose confidence in the coupons and refuse to do the chores anyway - if that happens then they lose their value.

I think a lot of people don't quite have their minds wrapped around the fact that the world is not on a gold standard and don't quite realize what that means. The dollars are not fixed, there is not a finite supply on which they are based. Dollars are based on nothing, yet everything's value is based on dollars. It's hard for people to accept that because we're so used at a household level to our dollars representing something "real." It represents our cars, our houses, or TVs, etc... but government debt does not work like that. Even at a household level - the bank doesn't want your car or your house. That's the last thing it wants. It wants your money and will only take the car when several rounds of trying to get you to make the payments has failed. The dollars are ends in themselves, but we think the dollars represent something real. They don't.

Maintaining an "acceptable" percentage of debt and making the payments is all that matters for a country like the U.S. that controls its currency.

There are several downsides to this. One is that the system requires a careful psychological balance to maintain, and what should be small shocks can have big consequences for what is essentially a house of cards, ie: 2008. Our percentage may get out of whack because we cannot solve our health care problem. To be fair, every country in the world struggles with that - but the U.S. system is far worse. Another danger would be if another reserve currency reveals itself. So far, the Euro was the most dangerous competitor to the dollar but the Greece mess has proven that it's not. A big downside is that labor is not particularly valued. In a system where the money is fiction - the fiction-peddlers are going to be the best off and reap most of the rewards. The people that try to work inside the story are going to struggle. If we want labor to be worth something, we need a gold standard.

Ironically this is where liberals and the Ron Paul types converge.

Last edited by redguard57; 07-26-2015 at 03:49 PM..
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Old 07-26-2015, 07:25 PM
 
755 posts, read 534,035 times
Reputation: 1250
Obama is a beast. Thank God he will be President for another year and a half. I am glad I support him, because it would suck to have daily hate in your heart guaranteed for that time period.
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