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Old 08-29-2015, 09:27 AM
 
3,463 posts, read 4,538,222 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldhag1 View Post
S Kentucky is a blood red state with one of the highest percentage of the populous against SSM in the nation.
Given the above, the simple solution for the couple is to just go to another county. Kentucky does not require you be a resident of the county to obtain a marriage license. Rowen county is surrounded by 7 counties whose seats are between 12-30 minutes away. A mere 1 hr, 10 minutes away is the most progressive area of the state, Fayette County, home of Lexington, where a marriage could be obtained without any fanfare.
A common misconception due to McConnell's imbecilities and press like this.
Kentucky is a blue state and since Beshear and Mayor Jerry(Lt, Gov), getting blue'r every election.
Lots of blue in local politics and generally KY politics are the most mixed up I have seen in any state Ive ever lived. That said, she is an embarrassment to our state. That even the local conservative pols arent touching this during an election ramp-up speaks volumes. Her disingenuous and embarrassing grab for 5 minutes of fame will hopefully end soon. Only the very vocal minority dont think so.
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Old 08-29-2015, 09:29 AM
 
Location: Nescopeck, Penna. (birthplace)
12,351 posts, read 7,501,291 times
Reputation: 15950
And I don't have a problem with the legal removal of this self-righteous overgrown child. A little creative thinking by someone in the legal hierarchy who is not ruled by the pretzel-logic that drives the Religious Right could probably come up with a reasonable compromise.

But a reasonable compromise is not enough for the LGBT militants; they want a head on a pike and they've demonstrated their vulgarity and hostility time and time again (then, like some other Nazis I can think of, or like the VFW types who ran the draft boards during the Vietnam debacle -- they'll run to the excuses that "the law is the law" or that "I was only doing my job").
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Old 08-29-2015, 09:37 AM
 
9,182 posts, read 9,265,199 times
Reputation: 28754
Here's how I bet this ends.

The ACLU or some group will file a lawsuit against this clerk and the county she works for alleging she is violating the law by refusing to issue a marriage license. If legal counsel is smart, they will immediately file for summary judgment against the clerk and the county. The court will have to grant the motion for summary judgment because the clerk is clearly refusing to abide by the law. The court will follow its ruling with an order restraining the clerk and all other officials from enforcing unconstitutional state laws that prohibit same sex marriage. It will further order the clerk to issue marriage licenses to gay couples

If the clerk continues on her foolhardy course of action, the next step will be for the court to issue an Order to Show Cause why the clerk should not be held in contempt of court. Personal appearance of the clerk before the judge will be required. The court will determine what is occurring and ask the clerk nicely one more time if she will issue marriage licenses. If the clerk says "no". The court will find her in contempt of court. Possible sanctions include jail time for the clerk. It could include a fine against the clerk and the county that might be thousands of dollars for each day they refuse to issue marriage licenses. More drastic action is available, but I suspect one or both of those remedies will fix the situation.

No one indefinitely resists the power of the courts to enforce laws.
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Old 08-29-2015, 09:55 AM
 
Location: Nescopeck, Penna. (birthplace)
12,351 posts, read 7,501,291 times
Reputation: 15950
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Here's how I bet this ends.

The ACLU or some group will file a lawsuit against this clerk and the county she works for alleging she is violating the law by refusing to issue a marriage license. If legal counsel is smart, they will immediately file for summary judgment against the clerk and the county. The court will have to grant the motion for summary judgment because the clerk is clearly refusing to abide by the law. The court will follow its ruling with an order restraining the clerk and all other officials from enforcing unconstitutional state laws that prohibit same sex marriage. It will further order the clerk to issue marriage licenses to gay couples

If the clerk continues on her foolhardy course of action, the next step will be for the court to issue an Order to Show Cause why the clerk should not be held in contempt of court. Personal appearance of the clerk before the judge will be required. The court will determine what is occurring and ask the clerk nicely one more time if she will issue marriage licenses. If the clerk says "no". The court will find her in contempt of court. Possible sanctions include jail time for the clerk. It could include a fine against the clerk and the county that might be thousands of dollars for each day they refuse to issue marriage licenses. More drastic action is available, but I suspect one or both of those remedies will fix the situation.

No one indefinitely resists the power of the courts to enforce laws.
And that's how the Constitution allows for such actions to work to work, mitigating the stridency on both sides; I couldn't possibly "rep" this post enough.
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Old 08-29-2015, 01:47 PM
 
Location: Minnesota
2,526 posts, read 1,232,403 times
Reputation: 2758
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Here's how I bet this ends.

The ACLU or some group will file a lawsuit against this clerk and the county she works for alleging she is violating the law by refusing to issue a marriage license. If legal counsel is smart, they will immediately file for summary judgment against the clerk and the county. The court will have to grant the motion for summary judgment because the clerk is clearly refusing to abide by the law. The court will follow its ruling with an order restraining the clerk and all other officials from enforcing unconstitutional state laws that prohibit same sex marriage. It will further order the clerk to issue marriage licenses to gay couples

If the clerk continues on her foolhardy course of action, the next step will be for the court to issue an Order to Show Cause why the clerk should not be held in contempt of court. Personal appearance of the clerk before the judge will be required. The court will determine what is occurring and ask the clerk nicely one more time if she will issue marriage licenses. If the clerk says "no". The court will find her in contempt of court. Possible sanctions include jail time for the clerk. It could include a fine against the clerk and the county that might be thousands of dollars for each day they refuse to issue marriage licenses. More drastic action is available, but I suspect one or both of those remedies will fix the situation.

No one indefinitely resists the power of the courts to enforce laws.
Some of us remember the 70s vividly, when even the President of the United States was forced by the SCOTUS to follow the laws

(BTW, I suppose that the recalcitrant clerk is required by the law to follow the laws and the Constitution -- which includes rulings of the SCOTUS So she has NO legal basis for her stance She will be ousted fairly soon or otherwise a replacement clerk will be temporarily appointed and sworn in, since the State has a compelling interest in seeing that licenses are issued according to law ...)
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Old 08-29-2015, 01:55 PM
 
Location: Nescopeck, Penna. (birthplace)
12,351 posts, read 7,501,291 times
Reputation: 15950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teilhard View Post
Some of us remember the 70s vividly, when even the President of the United States was forced by the SCOTUS to follow the laws …

(BTW, I suppose that the recalcitrant clerk is required by the law to follow the laws and the Constitution -- which includes rulings of the SCOTUS … So she has NO legal basis for her stance … She will be ousted fairly soon … or otherwise a replacement clerk will be temporarily appointed and sworn in, since the State has a compelling interest in seeing that licenses are issued according to law ...)
But there are a lot of people out there (on both sides of the issue) who seek a world in which the laws are applied to only one half of those caught up in the nation's present polarization.

Last edited by 2nd trick op; 08-29-2015 at 02:24 PM..
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Old 08-29-2015, 01:57 PM
 
1,826 posts, read 908,417 times
Reputation: 2388
Elections are coming up. Why don't they just vote her out if they feel that way about her?
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Old 08-29-2015, 02:00 PM
 
Location: Minnesota
2,526 posts, read 1,232,403 times
Reputation: 2758
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2nd trick op View Post
But there are a lot of people out there (on both sides of the issue) who seek a world in which the laws are applied to only on half of those caught up in the nation's present polarization.
Yes, of course, there are people who feel free to defy laws with which they disagree and they are free to do so, until the law catches up with them ...
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Old 08-29-2015, 02:23 PM
 
67 posts, read 50,286 times
Reputation: 135
Maybe I should switch profession... Would love a job where I can do whatever I feel like without fear of penalty.

I'm expecting her to be fined and criminally charged. Some people seem to think they're above the laws.
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Old 08-29-2015, 02:30 PM
 
Location: Minnesota
2,526 posts, read 1,232,403 times
Reputation: 2758
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshimori View Post
Maybe I should switch profession... Would love a job where I can do whatever I feel like without fear of penalty.

I'm expecting her to be fined and criminally charged. Some people seem to think they're above the laws.
The clerk's refusal probably can't be charged as a "crime," per se, but is a civil offense, which could however incur jail time, fines, etc. ...
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