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Old 05-20-2016, 01:41 PM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
20,088 posts, read 20,571,510 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
If she had accidentally pushed one of her kids to his death, then I can see your point.

But she poisoned her kids and drowned them. That is planned and cannot be excused on mental problems. Most likely she just got anger problems.
How much do you know about PP psychosis?
My understanding is that it distorts your perception and one is not in their right mind and unable to think and comprehend as a normal person. So her planning was not that of a sound mind. They said Andrea Yates believed God told her to kill her children. Sounds like mental problems to me.
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Old 05-20-2016, 01:44 PM
 
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She also slit her wrists and turned the gas on. She was full blown out of her mind, in my opinion. Still absolutely horrifying what she did to her children. But I think if she'd been diagnosed with postpartum psychosis, she would have been able to be helped and her children might still be alive. It's too bad that someone close to her didn't recognize that she was losing it. That's one of the reasons I did some research on this. I want to be aware of what to look for.
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Old 05-20-2016, 02:07 PM
 
Location: New Yawk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nov3 View Post
Andrea Yates happened in 2001. Eleven years later another lady chooses to do harm. I think in 11 years the nation has saturated the awareness on Post depression. Help was available, she "chose" to end their lives...

I disagree with the sentence.

Compassion and "pity" are not the same thing. I can have Compassion for the childrens' who's lives were ended abruptly and painfully.
It's funny though, even with women being more open about PPD and being mindful about checking up on friends/family who have recently given birth, there is still so much shame attached to experiencing PPD. The stigma that comes with admitting that we're anything less than thrilled with new motherhood (even knowing it's normal hormonal changes), leaves many women to suffer in silence. It takes cases this extreme to get people to start acknowledging just how bad PPD can get.

I didn't have any postpartum issues after my first two babies, but I had it really bad with my third. Trouble was, I didn't realize how far down into depression I had sunk. Thankfully, my husband had seen a documentary about Andrea Yates while I was still pregnant, so (while I was that far gone) he knew to keep a watchful eye and stepped in to get me help. And even then, I cannot begin to tell you just how tough it was to be taken seriously by medical professionals and get some actual help.
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Old 05-20-2016, 02:35 PM
 
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
8,212 posts, read 7,511,307 times
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My cousin had diagnosed postpartum psychosis and didn't kill her children.

She got help.
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Old 05-20-2016, 02:53 PM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
20,088 posts, read 20,571,510 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueherons View Post
My cousin had diagnosed postpartum psychosis and didn't kill her children.

She got help.
Its a good thing she had a support system and was able to get the help she needed.
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Old 05-20-2016, 03:18 PM
 
Location: Tianjin, China
3,063 posts, read 2,565,124 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
How much do you know about PP psychosis?
My understanding is that it distorts your perception and one is not in their right mind and unable to think and comprehend as a normal person. So her planning was not that of a sound mind. They said Andrea Yates believed God told her to kill her children. Sounds like mental problems to me.
Each year there is about 400 cases of people killing their son or daughter in general. Most of the offenders are men, a lot of sons and daughters are adults, and a lot of cases are totally different in nature. Her kind of situation only happens a few times a year.

So why am I dismissing PP psychosis, because if this was a normal effect of PP then we would see a lot more homicide cases. No one here can relate to her, because its 1 to a million scenario.

In addition, this is not a normal effect of psychosis. Many drugs cause psychosis, but they don't make people murderers unless they already wanted to kill someone.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicci6Squirrels View Post
She also slit her wrists and turned the gas on. She was full blown out of her mind, in my opinion.
Actually that seem quite reasonable considering what she did. After she killed her children out of rage, then she realize what she has done. She is thinking about being sent to prison for life, or even death penalty. So the only solution is to kill yourself. She slit her wrist, but that is just too painful. So why not cause an explosion instead, so she turned the gas on.

If she was full blown out of her mind, then I expect her to either go and sleep or take a bath with her kids, pretending they are still alive.
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Old 05-20-2016, 03:33 PM
 
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It's not a "1 to a million" scenario,actually. It's about 1 in 1000. So, rare, but not as rare as you're thinking it is.

Symptoms include:

Hearing voices, and seeing things that aren’t there (hallucinating).
Rapid and extreme mood swings.
Manic behavior, such as cleaning the house in the middle of the night.
Feeling disconnected from reality.
Feeling confused, perhaps not recognizing friends or family.
Having delusions, and believing things that are untrue or illogical.
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Old 05-20-2016, 04:28 PM
 
8,173 posts, read 9,386,742 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicci6Squirrels View Post
It's not a "1 to a million" scenario,actually. It's about 1 in 1000. So, rare, but not as rare as you're thinking it is.

Symptoms include:

Hearing voices, and seeing things that aren’t there (hallucinating).
.......
Having delusions, and believing things that are untrue or illogical.
They find religion?
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Old 05-20-2016, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Tianjin, China
3,063 posts, read 2,565,124 times
Reputation: 1693
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicci6Squirrels View Post
It's not a "1 to a million" scenario,actually. It's about 1 in 1000. So, rare, but not as rare as you're thinking it is.

Symptoms include:

Hearing voices, and seeing things that aren’t there (hallucinating).
Rapid and extreme mood swings.
Manic behavior, such as cleaning the house in the middle of the night.
Feeling disconnected from reality.
Feeling confused, perhaps not recognizing friends or family.
Having delusions, and believing things that are untrue or illogical.
You are missing the point, I am not saying PP in general is 1 in a million scenario.

I am saying that this specific scenario is a 1 to a million scenario. This is backed up by homicide statistics. If this was a common efffect of PP, we would see a lot more cases.

The symptoms you mention here can easily lead to death by accident, but a delibrate death sound unlikely unless you already thought about it. I think she hates her kids, find them annoying and want them dead. Under a normal circiumstance she wouldn't dare to do anything, but anger problems or PP may cloud her judgement.

Last edited by Camlon; 05-20-2016 at 05:01 PM..
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Old 05-20-2016, 05:23 PM
 
5,288 posts, read 2,895,649 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
You are missing the point, I am not saying PP in general is 1 in a million scenario.

I am saying that this specific scenario is a 1 to a million scenario. This is backed up by homicide statistics. If this was a common efffect of PP, we would see a lot more cases.

The symptoms you mention here can easily lead to death by accident, but a delibrate death sound unlikely unless you already thought about it. I think she hates her kids, find them annoying and want them dead. Under a normal circiumstance she wouldn't dare to do anything, but anger problems or PP may cloud her judgement.

But no matter what, the underlining cause is not PP, but that she hates her own kids.

Every person is completely different. There is no "one" textbook postpartum behavior. There are numerous factors that affect a woman after she gives birth.

In my case, I had my baby on the 21st of June. I was sick the whole time I was pregnant... gall stones and appendicitis. On the 21st of July, I had emergency surgery to remove my appendix and gall bladder after I passed out and hit my head on the toilet as I was vomiting. I had a big, open incision on my abdomen and was still healing from that surgery when I fell down a flight of stairs while carrying my newborn baby. I shattered my left ankle bones, ripped all the ligaments and tendons in my leg and needed surgery to repair the damage. As I was healing from these surgeries, we also moved to Oklahoma. I couldn't walk yet and was still going through physical therapy. It took me about a year to be able to walk on my own again. The first week we were in Oklahoma, a tornado passed through and my baby and I had to sit in the bathtub of our puny apartment with a crib mattress over us, listening to the windows breaking in the living room. I was sure we were all going to die in this tornado. I could barely get into the tub due to my inability to walk well. I had to use a walker like elderly people use! My husband had to practically pick me up and put me in the tub and then hand me our baby. It was awful.

I was going through major postpartum depression which was exacerbated by the post-surgical screwiness. I felt like everyone disliked me, I was a burden, I was failing my child and my husband. I would lock myself in the bathroom and cry hysterically, thinking of ways I could end the pain. Thankfully, I had a husband who supported me and cared deeply about me. If I hadn't had that support system, who knows how bad it could have gotten? I never thought of harming my child, but I can see how if a person did not have any kind of support and was feeling this way that she could easily go off the deep end and not even realize it. It's horribly disturbing to go through and my situation was nowhere near as bad as this woman's. However, I have blocks of time that I have no recollection of at all. My parents or husband will say, "Remember that place we went to in Oklahoma?" and I have absolutely no recollection at all. I mean, none. That's not normal. And it still disturbs me. Maybe that's the part of me that has the most empathy for this woman we're discussing.

It would seem that most people thought she was a great teacher and upstanding person. Most people who are decent and known to be good don't just kill their children, so that leads me to think that this woman truly wasn't in her right mind. If there were people lined up to say that she was abusive and they worried for her children, it might put more doubt in my head that she was really going through postpartum psychosis. I don't know if she had any kind of support. I assume she didn't have as much as she needed, obviously. I really do think there needs to be more awareness of postpartum issues. It's not fair that these children didn't have the opportunity to have full lives because their mother, who was supposed to protect them from harm, was out of her gourd. I wish she could have been helped. The whole situation truly makes me sad.

(Sorry for the novel. Just thought it might help people understand why I can have empathy for this woman. If I hadn't experienced what I did, I might very well think she was just a cold blooded killer. But I think I probably have a different perspective because of my own experience.)
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