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Old 05-30-2016, 09:10 AM
Location: Type 0.7 Kardashev
10,577 posts, read 6,908,282 times
Reputation: 37368


There's another interesting aspect to this case.

Brett Sanders was found guilty of driving 39 mph in a 30 mph zone.

“I didn’t hurt anybody, Sanders told NBC Chicago. “I didn’t endanger anybody’s life.”
Well, Brett, the charge wasn't reckless endangerment. The charge was speeding. By your logic it should be fine to blow down a highway at 120 mph, so long as you do it safely. Whatever that means. Because the simple fact is that you didn't know whether or not you would be endangering someone's life. A kid can run out into the street at any time, and I know you probably think you're a perfect driver who can avoid anything and everything, but the simple fact - it's called physics, Brett - is that at 39 mph your ability to avoid suddenly-appearing children (to use just one example of potential dangers) is reduced from what it is at 30 mph. Speed limit laws are designed to avoid - or at least reduce the frequency - of such eventualities as running over little kids.

He tried to fight the ticket but lost. He decided to pay the fine in the most civil disobedient way possible, with buckets of pennies, and posted a video of the payment on YouTube.

“When my fine came due, I just decided I may as well pay with pennies and we’ll make a big spectacle of it,” Sanders told NBC Chicago.


Did you vote in the last local election, Brett? You know, these laws don't come out of nowhere. They're enacted by lawmakers. Have you contacted any members of the city council to get the local ordinance changed?

Does anyone really think he did that?

Look, Frisco has a populace of 117k. It's a community. It holds elections, and laws and regulations are determined by officeholders. No one is going to like all of the laws. That's representative democracy. I don't get my way. You don't get your way. Hey, I don't like some local laws. But you know what? I also don't think the world revolves around me. I know that's a hard concept these days for many people, those who think that if they don't like a law then it means that they're oppressed and they just get to ignore the law. But there's thousands of other citizens who also have their say as well. Sometimes the majority wants to go in a different direction than do I. That doesn't mean I'll necessarily give up believing or working toward something different (though as far as crusades go, the fact that being able to blow through neighborhoods at 39 mph is where you draw your line in the sand says volumes about you, pal). But it does mean that I understand that I am but one voice of many.

Simply put, it's not all about you, Brett.

He hammered $220 worth of pennies from their rolls and shoveled them into five-gallon buckets. Sanders then drove to the Frisco Municipal Court and dumped the coins – all 22,000 – on the counter. "It felt great. It really felt great," Sanders said.
Bingo. This was never about anything other than you getting some petty revenge (even though you were too stupid to target the actual source of your frustrations - your mentality is that of the fool who comes home and kicks the dog because of something that went down at work) because you can't handle driving 30 mph through neighborhoods.

The court's clerks gathered all the pennies and took them to Coinstar locations around town. They said it took about three hours to count them.
Bravo, Brett. What a hero you are. You're a regular Rosa Parks.

Frisco Man Pays Speeding Ticket With Buckets of Pennies | NBC Chicago

The 'most civil disobedient way possible' would be to refuse to pay the fine and take the consequences. But that wouldn't have felt 'really great', right?
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Old 05-30-2016, 09:14 AM
Location: USA
2,580 posts, read 3,458,313 times
Reputation: 2220
Tickets are just money making scams setup by the government.
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Old 05-30-2016, 09:18 AM
2,301 posts, read 1,142,076 times
Reputation: 2802
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Old 05-30-2016, 09:30 AM
Location: Pittsburgh
17,091 posts, read 17,344,460 times
Reputation: 10906
Originally Posted by Jukesgrrl View Post
A jackass who speeds in a residential area endangering his fellow citizens acts like a jackass in paying his fine by taking advantage of a civil servant. Where's the news in that, FOX25? Although I bet there are a lot of his fellow jackasses out there who think he's cool.
Correct. Just another selfish idiot. Lots of them out there with no regard for anyone but themselves. That is WAY over the speed limit.
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Old 05-30-2016, 09:43 AM
4,903 posts, read 2,554,107 times
Reputation: 4381
Originally Posted by katie45 View Post
Do you think the speed limit signs should have stated:

30 mph + 10
I love all these self righteous comments, like you've always driven the exact speed limit yourselves, even the 15 MPH through a parking lot

I didn't say he didn't deserve a ticket. $220 for 9 MPH over is excessive.
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Old 05-30-2016, 09:51 AM
Location: Central Texas
19,960 posts, read 36,617,592 times
Reputation: 21574
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
30 MPH is the speed limit on most secondary roads in the area that I live. There are a few scattered 35 mph zones in Rye Brook, a few 40 mph zones in Harrison, White Plains and New Rochelle but otherwise it's 30, ven on four-lane commercial roads.

It is policing for cash.
Not if you obey the speed limit. I always laugh when I see people making this claim, which translates as "I decided the speed limit shouldn't apply to me because I don't agree with it, and I got caught, and it has to be somebody else's fault!"

An adult works to get the speed limit changed if they disagree with it, but obeys it until it is, OR accepts their own responsibility for their deliberately chosen action of breaking the law. They don't blame others for the predictable consequences of their own actions.
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Old 05-30-2016, 09:59 AM
3,231 posts, read 1,680,474 times
Reputation: 15698
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Not exactly. I looked this one up once. Take a look carefully at your coins. Pennies and nickels don't have little serrations on their edges. Dimes, quarters, and half dollars do. Coins with these serrations are known as "milled coins". The upshot of it is that you have a right to pay any debt in full with "milled coin". With respect to unmilled coin (pennies and nickels) you have a right to pay a debt up to about $25.00.

Just a quirk from the U.S. Code.
Do you have a link that explains this. I believe you're wrong. A "milled coin" is any coin made by a machine, rather than being struck by hand. The US added the serrated edge on all silver coins to prevent "shaving away" bits of silver by the unscrupulous. The serrated edge makes the "shaving" much more obvious. Pennies and nickles were never made of silver, so they didn't get the serrated edge.

And pennies are legal tender in any amount unless the place of business specifies they aren't in advance of payment.
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Old 05-30-2016, 10:12 AM
Location: Texas
42,410 posts, read 50,233,870 times
Reputation: 67483
Originally Posted by Northeastah View Post
I love all these self righteous comments, like you've always driven the exact speed limit yourselves, even the 15 MPH through a parking lot

I didn't say he didn't deserve a ticket. $220 for 9 MPH over is excessive.
Not that it's relevant, but yeah.

Comments like yours are like what a 5 year old would say.
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Old 05-30-2016, 10:39 AM
Location: Texas Hill Country
9,033 posts, read 4,933,503 times
Reputation: 7744
I think this says it well enough about just 9 over the speed limit.

Mind you, that's kilometers, where 5 km/h is 3 mph.

So higher speed, less time to react, longer stopping distance, greater speed at impact if one does hit something.

As far as the form of currency, I believe that some sectors have ordinances and laws in place against this kind of action, but it may vary from place to place.
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Old 05-30-2016, 11:06 AM
Status: "People and tear gas - either it's a border or it isn't." (set 3 days ago)
Location: New York Area
13,612 posts, read 5,355,479 times
Reputation: 10890
Originally Posted by shyguylh View Post
I agree. and this is the thing--I tend to stick up for drivers in terms of these ridiculous speed limits you see sometimes and how the police sometimes (or the city) does much of this just to separate people from their money.
I repped this post. Certainly on secondary roads, such as ones that intersect with limited access expressways or interstates, that function as highways.

Originally Posted by shyguylh View Post
HOWEVER, I also have a huge amount of respect for the "sacredness" if you will of residential areas. I get tired of these "rat runners" who don't live on such roads using them for shortcuts on their work commute, and then griping about joggers and cyclists and children who "have no business playing in the street." My response--the public nature of the road notwithstanding, if you don't live there, you have no business being back there. Those roads aren't designed with the idea of everyone in a 15 mile radius using that road for their work commute. The 4-lane "main" roads are what's meant for that, these road are prioritized towards the residents who actually LIVE there
That I"m not so sure of. I think a "rat runner" should adhere to local speed limits but if they know their way around why not use detours? For example in the Riverdale section of the Bronx where I lived till I was 7 I know the local roads and can detour most of the traffic jam on the Henry Hudson that forms every morning. Or in Westchester when I go to Temple I do most of the Friday night drive to Temple on local roads since the 6 miles of the Hutch can take about 40 minutes.

Originally Posted by shyguylh View Post
They have the RIGHT to walk their dogs, take their babies in the strollers, let their older children ride their tricycles, and just plain take it easy on such roads. Masses of people who don't live there using those roads because it saves them half a mile on their work commute vs sticking the 4 lane highways, they have no business doing that and ESPECIALLY then complaining about people who LIVE there "getting in the way." As I've said in the past when I was the one living on such a road and someone would become mad and blow their horn because I was bicycling on the road and they were trying to zoom through in a quick manner: "I live on this road, what's YOUR excuse for being here?"
I agree that priority goes to the residents. But if the roads are public my gas tax money is helping to pay for the roads. However, courtesy must dictate.

Maybe the governments need to prioritize spending on roads so that accidents are moved out of the way quickly on major highways. Also maybe those roads could have digital speed limit signs so that at rush hour they're set at 35 or 40 so the maximum volume of cars can move without incident, and at 65 or 70 in the middle of the night.
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