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Old 06-16-2016, 10:30 AM
 
3,279 posts, read 3,772,912 times
Reputation: 6149

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Quote:
Originally Posted by reed067 View Post
Even still when you take your child out to any where it is THIER responsibility to make sure they are safe.
Not the park, not the grocery store not the mall.

How many signs do we need for people to understand that no one is responsible for your kids but you?
And how many people need to explain to you that IT IS IMPOSSIBLE to protect your children from every single risk in the world. IT CANNOT BE DONE. I don't care who you are or who you THINK you are, IT CANNOT BE DONE and if you say "well I do it," you're LYING--and even if you WERE doing it, you'd be ruining your kids in the long term by doing so. Enough of this "helicopter" nonsense. I've seen these parents, and their kids are miserable--OK, they may be alive, but so are 99.7% of everyone else's kids who are much happier.

I have, once or twice, seen snakes in our yard. Does that mean I now have to be outside EVERY SINGLE MINUTE my kids are outside? Heck no. Life has some risk. You do what you can to minimize risk, to curtail it (such is why I think alligators should be hunted through FL), so in that vein yes I periodically "scope" the yard to make sure there are no snakes, and also I train my children what to do if they see one. That is where my job ends. IT IS NOT MY JOB to be out there every single solitary second like some guard in a prison in a watchtower protecting them for every single thing in the world. That's WAY more work than ANY parent should be expected to do, I've got other things to do around here, watching them every single minute is just not practical. No one would have EVER expected to find an alligator in an easily-access lagoon IN DISNEYWORLD. The parents are blameless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
Killing alligators just so we could swim in some lakes would damage the ecosystem. With your logic we'd really need to make sure we kill them ALL to ensure they can't and don't reproduce and migrate again to other areas. They have every right to be here as we do, maybe even more. WE humans have encroached on THEIR territory with overdevelopment and putting man-made lakes into areas in the first place. It's ridiculous to say we should kill and and all alligators just because we have an apparent "right" to swim wherever we please as humans.

Guess what warm Florida lakes also have? Brain eating amoebas. Should we kill all those too? You sure you want to swim in any Florida lake?
Please. Before the 70s alligators had sunk to much lower numbers than what are out there now, and people AND the ecosystem all did fine. It's not like wiping out all of the trees and then there being no CO2 for producing oxygen. Hunting was banned via that dumb Endangered Species Act due to "compassion" and all of that, and look where it got us. When a child is killed by a wild animal that way in DISNEYLAND, it should be obvious that things are out of whack and need to change.

No you can't eliminate every risk, but you sure ought not be told to tolerate ones which can be done away with, and this is one of those. I used to live in Tucson AZ, and it amazed me these people who paid for $1.5 million homes to get outside the city and then accepted mountain lions being around which could kill their children IN THEIR OWN YARD. Not me. If I bought such a house, I'd shoot every single mountain lion I see because it's my child's RIGHT, yes RIGHT, to play in their own yard. I'm not about to pay $1.5 million for a home and then let some mountain lion have it. Where is their name on the mortgage? When have they paid for the property taxes on it? Didn't think so. Tough luck kitty--besides, there's plenty of other places where houses don't exist (and never will, based on what I saw when I was there), go live there and you'll be fine.

When it's to the point that you can get it trouble for killing any alligators you find on your OWN LAND, it's gone too far. Understand that I am very firm and unmovable in my firm belief that we humans are THE most important living creature on this planet and we have the RIGHT, yes the RIGHT, to go wherever we darned well please and to take out any risks we encounter along the way. You can call that being a "bully" or "having an entitlement mentality" all you want, I don't care, I firmly believe it. I'd shoot a woodpecker in a minute if it was on my property drilling holes into my house, those laws that say otherwise can shove it. This is MY land, and on my land I am the law. Besides, we have wildlife refuges and alligator farms and such where animals can exist and be "true to who they are" and all that, no one is trying to make anything extinct.

Brain eating amoeba--those are statistically rare (although when you hear a story on an incident it does cause one to be fearful), however, if it became enough of a problem AND if ridding the lakes of it was economically viable and it could not be proven that doing so would cause something drastic such as the elimination of all trees thus the elimination of carbon dioxide and thus the elimination of oxygen, then yes I'd say get rid of it. Places where deer are so huge in numbers that people are always hitting them with their cars, deer season should be all year long.

Anything that causes these problems for humans, if getting rid of it is economically viable and it can't be proven that doing so would cause an ecosystem catastrophe, I say go for it.

Last edited by shyguylh; 06-16-2016 at 10:39 AM..
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Old 06-16-2016, 10:36 AM
 
2,813 posts, read 1,404,352 times
Reputation: 6116
Quote:
Originally Posted by pennyone View Post
Well, two years old, up in the middle of the night, wading into strange water without even holding dad's hand? I would never ever bring a 2 year old to Disney, nor would I keep him up at 1 am, nor will I allow him to wade through water at that time and at that place. It's the parents fault. So sad that the kid and alligators had to pay for their stupidity.
I thought the reports said 9pm?

IMO, on vacation, there is a world of difference between 9pm and 1am.

And if kids are within arm's length in less than a foot of water, why on earth would a parent need to hold their hand constantly?

I haven't followed all the reports, but the parents don't sound negligent to me. Unfortunately, bad things happen. Someone doesn't always have to be at fault.
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Old 06-16-2016, 10:40 AM
 
6,911 posts, read 3,758,289 times
Reputation: 4613
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfternoonCoffee View Post
I thought the reports said 9pm?

IMO, on vacation, there is a world of difference between 9pm and 1am.

And if kids are within arm's length in less than a foot of water, why on earth would a parent need to hold their hand constantly?

I haven't followed all the reports, but the parents don't sound negligent to me. Unfortunately, bad things happen. Someone doesn't always have to be at fault.
Exactly.


Just as the north has a over population of deer that need to be more aggressively hunted, Florida needs to kill way more alligators than they are currently taking out.
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Old 06-16-2016, 10:46 AM
 
23,977 posts, read 31,205,285 times
Reputation: 28633
Quote:
Originally Posted by poodlestix View Post
I don't remember seeing anybody post about it here, but if the signs said 'no swimming', why did the mother get the attention of a life guard to try to save the baby? Why would a lifeguard be close by if you're prohibited from swimming? They've failed to address that question in the articles and video clips I've seen in the news thus far.
The lifeguard was at a pool...not on the beach.
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Old 06-16-2016, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
6,328 posts, read 3,506,449 times
Reputation: 15067
Quote:
Originally Posted by shyguylh View Post
And how many people need to explain to you that IT IS IMPOSSIBLE to protect your children from every single risk in the world.
More to the point, it is impossible to protect your children from a risk YOU DO NOT KNOW EXISTS.

It is impossible to exercise "personal responsibility" and avoid undue risk-taking in the absence of accurate knowledge of the local hazards.

I don't expect Disney to keep Disney World 100% free of venomous snakes and alligators; that simply isn't possible. But it is possible for Disney to warn park visitors who may never have visited Florida before and who are honestly ignorant of the local hazards that there is a small risk of encountering these dangerous animals in the park, and to tell them what to do to minimize the risk of such an encounter. That's not too much to ask.
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Old 06-16-2016, 10:59 AM
 
Location: Rutherfordton,NC
12,235 posts, read 8,145,660 times
Reputation: 8652
Quote:
Originally Posted by shyguylh View Post
And how many people need to explain to you that IT IS IMPOSSIBLE to protect your children from every single risk in the world. Enough of this "helicopter" nonsense.

That's way more work then any parent should be expected to do, I've got other things to do around here, watching them every single minute is just not practical. No one would have EVER expected to find an alligator in an easily-access lagoon IN DISNEYWORLD. The parents are blameless.


It's not helicopter parenting I'm highly against that! You're child should be able to walk/ride their bikes to a friends house or around the neighborhood. However the child in question isn't a teenager, they don't know any better as a parent YOU should!! What if the child would of got in and drowned? Forget the alligator for a moment. Whose to blame then? No, you can't protect your child from every little thing I don't expect that but use common sense but you can lower the risk of things like this happening.


I'm not even going to respond to the bold print it's just to insane.




How dumb does one have to know that Florida has gators in it?????? There have been reports of them in swimming pools too!!!! So it's safe to assume that they MIGHT also get into a man-man pond!
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:04 AM
 
10,536 posts, read 4,133,981 times
Reputation: 14763
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfternoonCoffee View Post
I thought the reports said 9pm?

IMO, on vacation, there is a world of difference between 9pm and 1am.

And if kids are within arm's length in less than a foot of water, why on earth would a parent need to hold their hand constantly?

I haven't followed all the reports, but the parents don't sound negligent to me. Unfortunately, bad things happen. Someone doesn't always have to be at fault.
Bad things happen when common sense isn't used. A foot of water to a two year old is deep water, especially after dark.
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:07 AM
Status: "Even better than okay" (set 19 days ago)
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
51,448 posts, read 50,708,759 times
Reputation: 60403
Quote:
Originally Posted by reed067 View Post
Your first part is pure assumption. It might not of happened.


As to the second part again it comes down to personal responsibility! The parents ignored that sign they didn't follow the rules! Hence their fault!


Even if they didn't read the sign everyone KNOWS that Florida is filled the snakes & Alligators. How can you not know that? Everyone watches the Animal Planet channel.
No, not everyone watches Animal Planet. Be serious.
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:09 AM
Status: "Even better than okay" (set 19 days ago)
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
51,448 posts, read 50,708,759 times
Reputation: 60403
Quote:
Originally Posted by marino760 View Post
Bad things happen when common sense isn't used. A foot of water to a two year old is deep water, especially after dark.
A two-year-old has reached half his adult height, give or take a couple of inches. Unless he's only going to be four feet tall, a foot of water isn't even halfway up his body.
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:11 AM
 
Location: Rutherfordton,NC
12,235 posts, read 8,145,660 times
Reputation: 8652
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
No, not everyone watches Animal Planet. Be serious.


This is true. Odds are they are watching the Kardashians.


Why watch something intelligent?
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