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Old 06-16-2016, 10:41 PM
 
2,813 posts, read 1,402,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reed067 View Post
Once again take away the part that the alligator was even there. It's dark & your TWO-YEAR OLD is playing in the water, how hard is that to grasp? The TWO-YEAR OLD should of been no where near the water.

How in the hell is someone else responsible if the child would of drowned?
How dark do you think it was at a posh Disney resort at 9pm? Where they hold late night family activities? Where the beach is lit with tiki torches? And they hold a glowing boat parade...on the lagoon?
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Old 06-16-2016, 10:50 PM
 
11,106 posts, read 6,611,779 times
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So where exactly are the no swimming signs posted? This article was posted with plenty of pictures of the spot where the incident happened, and I can't see a single warning sign in any of these pictures. The third picture (brown hair girl in a peace tshirt) shows a decent amount of the beach area in the background.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/morganshana...n1Y#.jaP2q1w16


Then there are the pictures from a 2012 Disney hosted event where lots of children are in the water. Why weren't Disney staff (I mean Cast Members) keeping them out of the water? If you go through all the photos, you will see the event lasted past dark, and there were still people in the water.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/5minut...7629620777400/

I'm not saying that Disney didn't think there was a risk, they obviously knew of the alligators, but it just seems like they created an environment where people thought they were safe. I'm also not doubting that there are no swimming signs, I'm just wondering where they are in relation to the beach and water.
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Old 06-16-2016, 10:59 PM
 
23,965 posts, read 31,184,409 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundaydrive00 View Post
So where exactly are the no swimming signs posted? This article was posted with plenty of pictures of the spot where the incident happened, and I can't see a single warning sign in any of these pictures. The third picture (brown hair girl in a peace tshirt) shows a decent amount of the beach area in the background.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/morganshana...n1Y#.jaP2q1w16


Then there are the pictures from a 2012 Disney hosted event where lots of children are in the water. Why weren't Disney staff (I mean Cast Members) keeping them out of the water? If you go through all the photos, you will see the event lasted past dark, and there were still people in the water.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/5minut...7629620777400/

I'm not saying that Disney didn't think there was a risk, they obviously knew of the alligators, but it just seems like they created an environment where people thought they were safe. I'm also not doubting that there are no swimming signs, I'm just wondering where they are in relation to the beach and water.
I am glad to see that people are posting these pics of their kids near/in the water. I am really over the slamming of the parents. Disney should have taken greater precautions, period. They knew alligators were in those waters (I've seen them myself) and never ever should people have been allowed near the edge as they have been. They got complacent, and figured it could never happen. And it did. I am just so sad for those parents.
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:11 PM
 
23,965 posts, read 31,184,409 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the minx View Post
This wasn't a problem animal. He was a gator being a gator in his natural environment. The problem was that humans were allowed to encroach. That, and Disney didn't warn guests of the danger.

There has been at least one other attack many years ago. This is not the first time. While I do think Disney should have taken precautions, the parents needed to do the same by not letting such a young child play in unfamiliar waters that late at night. It's a sad story but what's done is done. Hopefully it's a lesson learned for all.
The gator being in these waters isn't really the problem, and "encroaching humans" definitely isn't either. Disney routinely euthanizes gators from these lagoons. However, there were NO warnings posted, and the parents were clearly clueless about gators or anything else, in those waters. Unless they are locals (and this family was not) they naturally make the assumption that it's Disney World and that any dangerous critters would have been removed. The fault lies with Disney. I have no doubt that there will be a very substantial settlement made, and they will make some changes at the lagoons.

Disney Alligator Attack: Resort 'Routinely' Removes Gators from Area : People.com

The toddler was wading in about a foot of water around 9:30 p.m. on Tuesday when the alligator came out of the Seven Seas Lagoon at the Grand Floridian Resort & Spa in Orlando and attacked.

Nick Wiley, executive director of the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission, says that the resort has been "very proactive" in dealing with the alligators that are indigenous to the area.

"They have a full-time staff observing these waters and they have essentially an open permit system where any time they see an alligator or a complaint is called in, it can be taken out," Wiley said at a press conference Wednesday, reports KETV.

"These alligators are not relocated, these alligators have to be euthanized because if you move them somewhere you're just moving a problem," he continued.

Wiley said that while the resort "routinely" removes alligators from the area, he could not recall of any such removals "recently."
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:24 PM
 
2,813 posts, read 1,402,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
I'm talking about leaving the kid at home altogether, when the couple plans a vacation for themselves. 2 seems like way too young for an amusement park vacation.
That's silly. Absurd. It's DisneyWorld! Toddlers LOVE DisneyWorld! And I believe I read the family also has a 4 year old daughter. Families like to do things together.

How do you know--and why do you care--if this couple did or didn't plan other trips that were kid-free? That would have no bearing on this family trip to DisneyWorld!
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:42 PM
 
2,813 posts, read 1,402,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reed067 View Post
For those of you who keep saying that just maybe they didn't expect a gator to be in water.. it's nature habitat, is it safe to say that someone from say Nebraska doesn't know there are sharks in the ocean?
I honestly did NOT KNOW I wasn't supposed to allow my children to play and swim in the OCEAN anymore!!!

Are we only allowing our kids to play those zero-depth splash pads or spray parks these days? Are backyard pools considered safe enough? Should I just squirt them with a hose and call it vacation?
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:53 PM
 
11,106 posts, read 6,611,779 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the minx View Post
This wasn't a problem animal. He was a gator being a gator in his natural environment.
A theme park is an alligator's natural environment?


Yes, I know... Disney World was built on swamps... Disney World is in Florida...But that doesn't mean alligators need to be sharing the same space as young children.
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Old 06-17-2016, 12:43 AM
 
3,279 posts, read 3,768,252 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AfternoonCoffee View Post
I honestly did NOT KNOW I wasn't supposed to allow my children to play and swim in the OCEAN anymore!!!

Are we only allowing our kids to play those zero-depth splash pads or spray parks these days? Are backyard pools considered safe enough? Should I just squirt them with a hose and call it vacation?
AMEN TO THAT.

Children have the RIGHT, they are ENTITLED, to have a REAL childhood that is fun, adventurous, and not "hospital sterile" perfectly free of all risks. I am tired of hearing of how, for instance, a child shouldn't be allowed to play in the street even if they live on a cul de sac because of people who don't live there who just HAVE to drive through there and do so at crazy speeds like they're on the freeway. I'm tired of hearing about people who don't let their children play IN THEIR OWN YARD because of the neighbor's dogs. I'm tired of seeing parents SCREAM at their kids for daring to go in water more than ankle deep even when it's a pool with lifeguards.

All of that (well maybe not the last one) is like telling a woman that if she was raped she was asking for it. It's like letting the terrorists win.

No. Stand up for yourself, and fix the problem. If you live on a cul de sac, throw a fit and obtain police patrolling if people who DON'T LIVE THERE keep zooming through at crazy speeds like they're on a 4-lane highway, put up signs "SLOW CHILDREN PLAYING" and if you run into such a motorist tell them "stop it, WE LIVE HERE and this is a residential area, show some respect." If the neighbor's dog roams the area, address it with animal control or even call the sheriff's office and get clarification that if it comes to it that you can SHOOT the darned things if they come into your yard and act menacing. If sharks are infesting the ocean, take them out.

And if a lagoon in Disneyland isn't safe due to alligators, hunt the darned things and thin the numbers already.

I recall an instance at our apartment's pool years ago, this one lady in her 20s was watching her sister's kids who were 9-13 or so. She was very firm that they HAD to stay in the 3 ft section. She left them there for a minute and went indoors, they immediately started enjoying the deep end and they were handling themselves just fine. When she came out she was SCREAMING at them hysterically to get out of the deep end. I later saw this woman swimming in the deep end, so clearly it wasn't a case of that she couldn't handle herself in the water. Given that she could swim, and given that the kids were handling themselves OK, why not let them keep on doing it? Why not CONGRATULATE and PRAISE them for how "you're such a big boy, look at you!" and why not ENCOURAGE this (even if you perhaps should nonetheless clarify that such should only occur if an adult is close)?

People are missing it. The problem isn't that the child was near the water, children have the RIGHT to enjoy water. The problem is the water isn't safe, and as much as it can be done economically and practically, it needs to be MADE safe, especially in a place like Disneyworld and especially with all the lounge chairs all over the shoreline and such.
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Old 06-17-2016, 01:46 AM
 
Location: Edina, MN, USA
6,885 posts, read 7,092,933 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundaydrive00 View Post
A theme park is an alligator's natural environment?


Yes, I know... Disney World was built on swamps... Disney World is in Florida...But that doesn't mean alligators need to be sharing the same space as young children.
\\

As long as FL has gators & water - any body of water should be suspect. These critters move from place to place - since they can't read they don't know this is a theme park. The only water in FL I would enter or get near is a pool (look before leaping - gators have been found here) or the ocean (lots of other dangers here). It doesn't really matter how you think things should be - it's how it is that counts.
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Old 06-17-2016, 04:22 AM
 
Location: Rutherfordton,NC
12,195 posts, read 8,131,375 times
Reputation: 8642
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfternoonCoffee View Post
How dark do you think it was at a posh Disney resort at 9pm? Where they hold late night family activities? Where the beach is lit with tiki torches? And they hold a glowing boat parade...on the lagoon?
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfternoonCoffee View Post
I honestly did NOT KNOW I wasn't supposed to allow my children to play and swim in the OCEAN anymore!!!

Are we only allowing our kids to play those zero-depth splash pads or spray parks these days? Are backyard pools considered safe enough? Should I just squirt them with a hose and call it vacation?


We live about 3 hours from Orlando it's dark here by 9pm. Gators blend in really good in the water even in the light they look like floating logs.




You can let your child do whatever you want just be aware has been my whole point all along.
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