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They rented a passenger van to drive from the airport to the port? Who does that?! People either take a taxi, or arrange ground transportation through the cruise line. No one is paying $500 to rent a van to drive it 10 miles, and then pay $22 a day to park it at the port for 6 days, just to drive another 10 miles back to the airport.
I feel like this was a scam for publicity all along.
They had a large group, it was probably cheapest that way. Where on earth does it cost $500 to rent a van???? They could have returned it right at the port for all we know, like at an airport. I highly doubt this many members of a family would go to all this trouble, time and money for publicity, that's actually pretty ridiculous IMO.
What kind of person has two kids with another in the oven while being only 22 years of age?
Me? My three boys were ages 6,4 & 2 & number four was in the oven when I was 22.
I did manage to graduate from college just days before he was born.
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Originally Posted by ocnjgirl
Yes but 25 weeks is still over 2 months from full term. It's an arbitrary number.
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Originally Posted by ClaraC
I'm not exactly sure what they're thinking, but it can't be a coincidence that 25 weeks is considered the age of viability. So if she delivers in a hospital, it's highly likely the baby will survive, but very unlikely if she delivers on a cruise ship.
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Originally Posted by DontH8Me
It is within reason, though. When I was hospitalized before the birth of my firstborn, they checked a woman in at 25 weeks. After just three days, her water broke and she went into labor despite all the hospital's efforts to delay. She lost the child. This was many years ago, in Eastern Europe, where Herculean efforts with severely premature births, and limitless resources, aren't as abundant as in the U.S. Resources on the ship probably do not include neonatal care for premature births, and if she were to have gone into labor it would have required Medevac and god knows what else.
Yes, the legal "age of viability" has changed since 1973, when it was established at 28 weeks during Roe v. Wade.
It is now based on when there is a 50% chance of long-term survival. While 50 to 70 percent of babies born at 24 to 25 weeks survive; only about 25% of babies born at 23 weeks survive.
This would be very important for an industry where there is a reasonable expectation of potential risk due to unstable surfaces to walk on, slippery, wet decks, etc ... because once a fetus is considered viable; they can be liable for the death of a person, vs being liable for an injury resulting in a misscarriage.
In some states, in the case of a homicide; the perpatrator can be held as criminally responsible for wrongful death of a fetus even before the age of viability but there is no such responsibility civilly.
Even for a spontaneously occuring miscarriage; I believe both a Birth & Death Certificate is legally required after 24 weeks.
In 1994, I had PROM (premature rupture of membranes) at only 23 weeks along with my first set of twins. I was rushed to the hospital & they were able to stop my labor & since there was still enough fluid & neither of the babies were showing signs of distress, I was admitted for inpatient observation on strict bedrest.
Everybody was surprised when this resulted in an additional six weeks of pregnancy for them to develop. They were delivered by c-sec after I started to run a fever & they were showing signs of stress. Even at 29 weeks, they required ventilators at first & weighed only 2lbs,14oz & 2lbs, 13oz. They both were in the NICU for another 2 months before being discharged at 4lbs, 14oz & 4lbs, 15oz & required oxygen & cardiac monitors 24/7 at home.
Imagine if this all occured after a slip & fall on a cruise line. Even in the event that mom & babies made it to land & medical facilities; that's still having to pay for 14+ weeks of continuous inpatient admission, including 2 intensive care admits that lasted for 8 weeks, plus all the follow up care?
Last edited by coschristi; 04-02-2018 at 11:59 AM..
Reason: left off letter n
Also it would not take days to get help. People have strokes and heart attacks and other medical emergencies on cruise ships all the time . They get helicoptered off or the coast guard takes them, they don't drive the entire cruise ship into port.
So do they require a medical clearance for the old men, just to make sure they won't stroke out at sea? Of course not. Why should this be different? If she were near term that's one thing but she's still 9 weeks out.
I'd have had a fit like nobody's business.
You're correct, medical emergencies that are NOT foreseen happen all the time and are dealt with according to the procedures in place for the commonality of those events that are NOT foreseen but anticipated. A premature birth that can be preempted by refusing boarding is far more sensible than outfitting every ship in the fleet with NICU suites with fully equipped preemie cabinets.
Yes; old men with pre-existing conditions are vetted. Yes; Dr's pre-authorizations may be required and kept on file to mitigate later liability claims. Yes; insurance companies will require all sorts of assessments and they may deny coverage to those types of conditions.
So no, this little event is not unique to her and therefore discriminatory in nature; regardless of how much she'd like it to be.
This will become readily apparent to you as you age and become a member of any of the other demographics and all of the little niceties that go with them.
Configuring most cruise ships for helicopter landings takes some time and labour as the heli-pads are more often than not utilized for other purposes during normal cruising. I've been on cruise ships that had to lower things like auxiliary radar mast heads and guard rails to allow a landing. Can you imagine if the ship has one or more of those zip lines running over the heli-pad?
All of this adds unnecessary cost that can be easily mitigated or avoided altogether.
They die or suffer permanent disability, if they can't be medevaced off in a timely fashion.
They are kept in bed, immobile, until they can be moved off the ship (which would usually be at the next port).
They get medevaced off the ship ASAP. (if it's not fast enough, guess what? They die.)
Cruise ships are not floating hospitals. They are more like floating Urgent Care clinics. What most people don't know is how little care most cruise ships can actually offer someone with a serious health problem.
They aren't even that. I went on one cruise, got sick, called the nurse. She said she had no medications, no nothing to help me with. I talked to a couple other people who had the same exact experience. Besides a few first aid kids and defibulators, I am not sure they have any medical capabilities.
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
My point was those people are allowed on the ship, those people are allowed to decide to go and this woman is not allowed the same choice Even nine weeks from full-term, and with a doctors note stating she is fine and healthy enough to take the cruise. Sorry it’s arbitrary and IMO has some ugly undertones. .
Your opinion is by someone that has never worked around ships or airlines, and knows the limitations of what kind of medical service they can furnish in case of an emergency or baby delivery.
You have never seen need for unexpected emergency treatment, and it not be available. I have and know the problems involved. When we had a medical emergency on a plane between Hawaii and California where someone had a medical emergency and the plane was 4 hours out. They hooked up the plane by radio with medical staff at the big Naval Hospital, and they kept in constant contact as to what to do, and luckily the passenger was still alive when they got to
our base. Plane landed in the San Francisco Bay as normal, taxied in to the lagoon where it was pulled into a U-Dock (stayed in the water at all times), and the medical crew could get the passenger with problems off the plane before anyone else could get off.
Air Lines also have restrictions on pregnant women flying, more so for International
Travel and flights over 5 hours. And cruise ships also have restrictions just as this woman found out.
When a ship is at sea, we have people on this thread, thinking that they can get a helicopter to a ship to take aboard a pregnant women ready to deliver. This is only true part of the time. The cruise may be where to get a helicopter to the ship and back, would require more time than the range for the helicopter allows. In other words if a woman goes into labor and needs taken to a hospital, there is no way to get her to the hospital. That fact alone, is enough to prohibit pregnant women flying after a certain date. Also, in rough weather, a helicopter is usually not able to pick up people from a ship at sea especially a woman in labor. Another reason for the cut off date.
Flight restrictions for pregnant women, have been in effect as long as there have been airlines. I was in Naval Air Transport squadrons in the early 1950s. I was Air Terminal Chief that meant that I was in charge of all passengers, cargo, and flight attendants for over seas flights at a major base. We had them back then. I was transferred back from the big air transport base in Hawaii, back to my old squadron in California to replace the retiring chief over the air terminal. My wife was pregnant. The Navy would not allow her to fly. If they had, I could have sent her back in the vip area in luxury on the only large flying boats in the world which was the squadron I was assigned to. As the Navy would not allow her to fly, she had to go back by the Airforce, which had 2 weeks later cut off than the Navy. We flew back in strap jump seats, as that was all we could get.
Yes there are rules and regulations for airlines and cruise ships concerning women past a certain date of pregnancy flying or cruising.
The rules are for the safety of the passenger and her future child. Airlines on long haul overseas flights have cut off dates, more lenient ones in US for less than 5 hour flights, just as cruise ships have restrictions that this woman tried to work around, but she lost.
There are no exceptions made for these restrictions. I know as I was once in a position I had to enforce the flight rules for pregnant women, and yes it is for their safety. You don't have the facilities on planes and on ships to handle a sudden baby delivery, especially if there are problems.
Last edited by oldtrader; 04-02-2018 at 12:32 PM..
They aren't even that. I went on one cruise, got sick, called the nurse. She said she had no medications, no nothing to help me with. I talked to a couple other people who had the same exact experience. Besides a few first aid kids and defibulators, I am not sure they have any medical capabilities.
I've worked on a cruise line before, and have been on over 10 cruises as a passanger. They have a medical staff. I've been sick on a cruise ship , I broke out in hives another time, and I dislocated my shoulder while working on one. I was able to see a doctor onboard to resolve each of these problems. My sister became sick with mono during one vacation, was diagnosed by the onboard medical staff and given medication. Other friends and family also visited the medical staff on various cruises, with different cruise lines. I've never once heard of a person being told their is no medication onboard or nothing that can be done.
Cruise lines are always seeking ways to maximize profits and remain competitive. How is it you suppose they do this?
They cut costs across the board and no longer compete en masse by providing more luxury and pampering. The staff are not paid a wage any American would willingly call a career they'd be content with.
Do you really think they're going to maintain a qualified doctor skilled enough to be working at an upscale clinic or first tier hospital and pay him/her commensurately?
I know someone who had a heart attack on a cruise ship. There was a physician who was able to provide a limited amount of treatment, but more importantly, they were able to coordinate the necessary care once the person was off the ship. The ship happened to be close enough to a port that they were able to turn around and get there in less time than it would have taken to be med-evaced off the ship, so they were taken to the nearest port and then med-evaced from there to an excellent cardiac facility in Florida, all of which had been coordinated by the ship's doctor.
I've worked on a cruise line before, and have been on over 10 cruises as a passanger. They have a medical staff. I've been sick on a cruise ship , I broke out in hives another time, and I dislocated my shoulder while working on one. I was able to see a doctor onboard to resolve each of these problems. My sister became sick with mono during one vacation, was diagnosed by the onboard medical staff and given medication. Other friends and family also visited the medical staff on various cruises, with different cruise lines. I've never once heard of a person being told their is no medication onboard or nothing that can be done.
I must have been on a bad cruise. I called more then once...same nurse answered and same nurse told me I couldn't even be seen, let alone be helped out.
Oh well, I survived. Puking for a week sucks though. (I also lost my vision from a sea sickness medication...that's why I called a second time)
I remember one time when my ship was out into the Atlantic 20 hours in heavy seas. Some fool was playing around in a mooring station swinging from the ceiling and fell and hit his head. We had good medical facilities on the ship for the time but he needed more than what we had. Weather was horrible and we were out of range for our or any other choppers to help anyway. We headed for Spain at full speed for 10 hours to get this guy to better facilities and where he could be evacuated. He made it but he only got the care he needed 12 to 18 hours after the incident.
Being on a ship is not what a lot of people think it is. Something goes wrong there are challenges.
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