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There are many people who want to live life out in the world when young, and apparently they had the money to do it. It doesn't mean they are chronic complainers, but many people have wanderlust. He just didn't want to sit behind a desk missing life, that is what he felt. I'm a homebody and can't relate to that period, but I've known people like that. I once worked with a PT who would work all summer, when the hospitals at the shore were very busy and paid very well, then once summer was over she and her husband would live on his sailboat and sail around Mexico and other warm waters. When I used to hang out with my bff at her drop zone in her skydiving days, I met many people who pretty much lived to skydive, and would sleep at drop zones and pack chutes to earn money for jumps. They were young, and they liked living like that.
These two were 30 years old, and judging by the types of careers they had, had worked hard their entire lives as students and then after graduating. I don't see anything wrong with dropping out for awhile to experience some adventure.
I think their choice of adventure turned out to be foolish and I certainly wouldn't do it, but for two 30 year olds to quit their jobs to bike around the world and see the world, I don't think that makes them dysfunctional people.
Here's another way to look at things.
We as humans only exist a moment in the present. Everything else is based on memory. The only thing that is real is what is in the instance of the present.
"Scientifically", I would love to build a system that imparts its experiences into our minds so we know, we have been there. Can you imagine the possibilities such as experiencing miniaturization, being down in the cells, because a device puts that memory in our heads.
Okay, coming back closer to reality, how much imagination does it take to achieve that with what is read in personal quests? Do I need to go to the Outback to "experience" some of what Robyn Davidson went through? Do I need to do everything Robin Graham did on the Dove to live that?
Probably not because for one thing, we humans don't tend to remember every little detail of each day. Secondly, I have enough data in my mind to supplement my imagination to feel something of what they felt.
Yes, we want to have the memories that we did this or that but when it comes down to it, we are reflecting in one instance on something that is only real in our heads.
They weren't "taught" anything by liberals, in any case. Liberals tend to be idealists, which is what leads them to liberalism, not the other way around. In any case, we don't know that these two are anything politically. They were simply new age spiritual hippie type people who wanted to see the world and meet people and believed people are inherently good. Mistake, perhaps, however no one taught them to believe that, most people are born as optimists or pessimists.
I agree with this completely. This wouldn't even be such a big issue if an internet clickbait site hadn't spun it on a slow day. But they weren't so idealistic that they failed to take the precaution of flying over the Middle East rather than biking through them.
Can someone explain what actually happened or what the motive was? I keep trying to read the link in the OP, but it keeps switching to videos about Omarosa and such. It might be my phone, or the site might not be well coded for mobile.
They left one person unscathed, right? Why?
ISIS has claimed responsibility, but given their history of making false claims, that's debatable. Tajikistan officials claim that the acts were carried out by a smaller fringe group called the Islamic Renaissance Party.
Can someone explain what actually happened or what the motive was? I keep trying to read the link in the OP, but it keeps switching to videos about Omarosa and such. It might be my phone, or the site might not be well coded for mobile.
They left one person unscathed, right? Why?
The group pledged allegiance to ISIS, that's on video. The Tajik government is clouding the question, by pointing the finger at a different organization it labels as subversive or terrorist, but that group actually helped bring about a peaceful settlement to the civil war that erupted in Tajikistan after independence. The government of Tajik. now is an authoritarian government with its own agendas, one of which is to denounce and disempower the IRP. which was banned in the last election cycle, in 2015.
So the current view outside the Tajik government is that the people who attacked the bicyclists were tied to ISIS, but most of the members are now dead, as the government was swift in tracking them down and eliminating them as any kind of threat.
The Interior Ministry issued a statement attributing Sunday's attack to the Islamic Renaissance Party, known as IRP or IRPT.
Reuters reported on Tuesday that IRPT leader-in-exile Muhiddin Kabiri denied and condemned the attack
Quote:
Commenting before Sunday's attack, Steve Swerdlow, a senior researcher at Human Rights Watch, said Tajikistan's "authoritarian government was rewriting the country's recent past to sketch the IRPT as a purveyor of evil, when in reality it was a key player in establishing a fragile peace post-civil war."
Last edited by Ruth4Truth; 08-22-2018 at 07:03 PM..
They were 29, probably 28 when they began the planning, but they were burned out on work already? They were lucky to have such good jobs, when many are job-seeking unsuccessfully! They'd missed out on gentle breezes? Isn't that what their weekends and vacations are for? His back was turned during sunsets, so his solution, rather than to turn around and catch the views (which occur after work hours, most of the year) is to quit his job and bike around the world, including through ISIS territory?
I tend to stick up for millennials, but these two strike me as the kind of people who expect all manner of concessions when they're hired on, and expect to be automatically promoted for basically good behavior, after their first year on the job.
I don't know about the Housing and Urban Development Department, but her employer, a university, gives generous vacation allowance, compared to many jobs. It's sad they lost their lives, when their adult working lives had barely begun. I also find it odd that they didn't research the situation in Tajikistan, not to mention Afghanistan. Going on an adventure is one thing, but being careless and putting oneself at risk is quite another thing.
People like that don't research jack-____, Ruth. That's just dumb behavior, that was (unfortunately) lethal but does serve as a very grim object lesson.
Post Modernism, lack of objective good and evil, rejection of social structures, rejection of intellectualism and self-evident norms, other complete horrifying *BS* being taught in universities these days. *That* is the real terror here: this Marxist thinking crap.
Look at their job titles. Little snowflake morons. I've worked 28 years, at this writing, with another eleven or so to go and I'm very grateful to have had great jobs, which are btw "hard", and I've struggled to keep my social status because there are a hundred others below me who would do anything for one mouthful of what I've achieved. That is a FACT. The world is competitive, and can be lethal. Depending on where you are, there are sometimes a few who want you dead on general principles, and/or want what you have at the point of the bayonet. Such people need to be shot dead, their homes burned, and their villages firebombed via drone strikes because often as not it's a clash of civilizations. There is Good, and Evil, and guess what side those scum are on?
My friend Billy W. is a rather famous biker and crusader of various causes. Over simplifying a bit, he *also* takes training with Operators and others who work in known terrorist or anarchic areas. Let's just say: he's more of the Reagan school, "Trust but verify." He's a great guy but has seen...a lot...world over. I've had the privilege to enjoy a little of his travel with him, and I've seen a few things, too, in less-savory parts of the world.
The above enabled him to survive places like Mosul and Afghanistan in the past 24 months. He's always on the road. And, to be clear, when-needed he travels with Operators. Those being guys from Xi, the (former) Blackwater, mostly. Yeah, those big bad guys with guns, who *will* shoot back until the threat is exterminated.
That's life. It isn't fair. There are horrors out there. The real courage is to admit they exist, and willingness to confront it with 10x the firepower where needed.
People like that don't research jack-____, Ruth. That's just dumb behavior, that was (unfortunately) lethal but does serve as a very grim object lesson.
Post Modernism, lack of objective good and evil, rejection of social structures, rejection of intellectualism and self-evident norms, other complete horrifying *BS* being taught in universities these days. *That* is the real terror here: this Marxist thinking crap.
Look at their job titles. Little snowflake morons. I've worked 28 years, at this writing, with another eleven or so to go and I'm very grateful to have had great jobs, which are btw "hard", and I've struggled to keep my social status because there are a hundred others below me who would do anything for one mouthful of what I've achieved. That is a FACT. The world is competitive, and can be lethal. Depending on where you are, there are sometimes a few who want you dead on general principles, and/or want what you have at the point of the bayonet. Such people need to be shot dead, their homes burned, and their villages firebombed via drone strikes because often as not it's a clash of civilizations. There is Good, and Evil, and guess what side those scum are on?
My friend Billy W. is a rather famous biker and crusader of various causes. Over simplifying a bit, he *also* takes training with Operators and others who work in known terrorist or anarchic areas. Let's just say: he's more of the Reagan school, "Trust but verify." He's a great guy but has seen...a lot...world over. I've had the privilege to enjoy a little of his travel with him, and I've seen a few things, too, in less-savory parts of the world.
The above enabled him to survive places like Mosul and Afghanistan in the past 24 months. He's always on the road. And, to be clear, when-needed he travels with Operators. Those being guys from Xi, the (former) Blackwater, mostly. Yeah, those big bad guys with guns, who *will* shoot back until the threat is exterminated.
That's life. It isn't fair. There are horrors out there. The real courage is to admit they exist, and willingness to confront it with 10x the firepower where needed.
Well, to be fair, the thread has evolved quite a bit, since I posted some opening comments based on very limited info. That's why I set about finding more info, to fill in blanks, and get a better understanding of the incident and the bicyclists' thought process.
I fail to see what "Marxism" has to do with any of this. Just saying.
It looks to me now, like the guy got his info from the bike-tourism site he was interacting with on the internet. Probably, that's how the group of disparate nationals coalesced in Tajikistan, or possibly, north of there, in Kazakhstan and Kirgizia. Musing on that, I raised the question earlier: what is a tour company's responsibility to consumers, in terms of vetting the safety of locations?
But also, it wasn't widely known that there had been religious radicalization going on in the area. I think some international travelers assume the former Soviet "stans" are safe, because they were in kind of a bubble, back in the Soviet era.
And I think another poster was right, in speculating that Lauren was more in her element on the bike trip in Iceland, a sefe (and pretty flat) country, than out on the Pamir Highway, at 15,000 feet, overlooking Afghanistan, and trying to bicycle the "roof of the world", as the Pamirs used to be known before Tibet snatched the nickname from them. I think she was mesmerized by her bf, who had all kinds of visionary ideas, and the guts (for better or for worse) to put them into action.
What job titles? Whose job titles? She was a university admissions office staff member. Pretty run-of-the-mill titles in those jobs.
But yeah, one can't help but think, "If only".... they'd researched it, or chosen a different region. Or stuck to taking bike vacations while keeping their jobs. If only.
Last edited by Ruth4Truth; 08-23-2018 at 12:31 AM..
What happened to them sucks, and I'm sure other western tourists have gone through the exact same area with no incident, but sh*t happens and people need to know the risks.
I definitely have a wonderlust, maybe not so strong that I would quit my job and bicycle around most of the world. I like to take one big trip every year aboard and have been to almost 40 countries (none of the 'stans yet), all seven continents, and want to hopefully visit all 190-200 countries, including Iraq, Iran, North Korea, all the 'stans, etc.
There's currently a journalist, Paul Salopek, 56 years old, walking from Ethiopia to Patagonia at the bottom of South America. It's called Out of Eden Walk and he started back in January 2013, and is in India currently.
He's not the first person to walk around the world, and he does have Nat Geo sponsoring him but here's his schedule where he has walked so far:
ETHIOPIA / DJIBOUTI / RED SEA CROSSING
JANUARY 2013 – MAY 2013
SAUDI ARABIA / JORDAN / WEST BANK / ISRAEL
MAY 2013 – JULY 2014
CYPRUS / TURKEY / GEORGIA / AZERBAIJAN
JULY 2014 – MARCH 2016
CASPIAN SEA CROSSING / KAZAKHSTAN / UZBEKISTAN / KYRGYZSTAN / TAJIKISTAN / AFGHANISTAN / PAKISTAN
APRIL 2016 – FEBRUARY 2018
He's walked (an even slower "target" than bicyclists) in 6 on the 'stans and wasn't attacked/killed/kidnapped/injured. Maybe he just "lucked out".
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