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Old Yesterday, 07:13 AM
 
6,384 posts, read 3,415,891 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalExpectations View Post
None of the parents have been indicted for criminal tax evasion. (At least not yet.)



Do you have a source for that? I don't think that is true



The only think I've found is:
I've been trying to figure out what the actual crime is. Not the emotional hate-the-wealthy baggage, but the actual crime. I've seen mail fraud in some of the articles, but no details about how they arrive at mail fraud.
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Old Yesterday, 08:06 AM
 
8,824 posts, read 8,979,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgato View Post
Olivia Jade, Loughlin's daughter, never wanted to go to college, she said her parents forced her to go. She just wanted to be an "influencer" and make videos for youtube. If she had skipped college and if her parents knew their own child, that she wasn't college material, they wouldn't be in the mess they are in today. Olivia Jade would have made a fortune, maybe not as rich as the Kardashians, but she was off to a good start. The girl may not be model material but she has the image of the rich girl and her parents add to her cachet, the house, the pool, and the means to travel around the world many times in a year, taking pictures of herself in fashionable places wearing expensive clothes. The young people are into that sort of thing. The parents really did not know their own daughter. Now, they have lost lots of contracts: Sephora, Hallmark, etc.
I think one of the mistakes that some people make is assuming that going to college is all about earning money. There is a prestige factor in having your child go to some schools that is hard for many--particularly those who have not been to college--to understand. Its a sort of "social capital" that is desirable to many people.

I'm not supporting or condoning what happened here. However, the motivations well-to-do people can have to send a child to college go beyond income on a balance sheet. Often, there is a desire to see the child working in certain fields that require a degree. Many of these parents go to parties and gatherings and they brag about their children. Even if they don't, there probably is a certain inner satisfaction at knowing their child has a degree from USC or wherever. This concept of social status or social capital was very real in my family. I never thought of not going to college because my parents told my sister and I from our youngest ages that we would be going to college and they would take care of the expense. Of course, this was more than forty years ago, but that as example of the value that college has to some people.

Ultimately, it goes to the fact that ours is an extremely status conscious and materialistic society. Its clear from some of the posts that some people seem to think the answer is simply to ignore all that and perhaps people should. However, most don't ignore it. While I cannot condone what these parents did, I understand the forces that drive people to try and get their children into these colleges. I question whether even sending some of these people to prison will stop this. Equality under the law is something most people give lip service too. On a personal level, many of them want their kids to succeed and do better than others no matter what must be sacrificed.

While money is part of it, its about more than money.

Last edited by markg91359; Yesterday at 08:16 AM..
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Old Yesterday, 08:11 AM
 
768 posts, read 263,675 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter View Post
Cute story, but not true.
It is true.

https://people.com/tv/lori-loughlin-...rough-college/

"He didn’t come from a lot so it’s cool to see that he built it all himself,” she said. “He, like, built his whole entire brand and he wasn’t actually, like, I don’t know if I’m supposed to say this, ever enrolled in college. But he, like, faked his way through it and then he started his whole business with tuition money that his parents thought was going to college. That’s, like, such a different time. I don’t know if I was supposed to say that, but it’s okay.”
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Old Yesterday, 08:49 AM
 
Location: Bel Air, California
21,134 posts, read 21,272,709 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundaydrive00 View Post
But she wasn't actually being recruited to the rowing team. The couch was bribed to tell admissions that she was. Who nows how much of the process is known to the kids, but it's not like she had to actually go to some team tryouts or even practices. She was put on the recruitment list, not on the team.

I read the picture was taken in their house. I haven't actually seen the picture, so who knows the exact details.
someone would have likely had to explain to the debutante just what that the rowing machine thing was that she was to pose on, you'd think she might have asked at that point why she had to sit on it and what it was used for.
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Old Yesterday, 09:23 AM
 
4,769 posts, read 3,042,932 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
I've been trying to figure out what the actual crime is. Not the emotional hate-the-wealthy baggage, but the actual crime. I've seen mail fraud in some of the articles, but no details about how they arrive at mail fraud.
I'm not a lawyer, but Mark is a lawyer and probably can explain it better than me.

It seems all of the parents were charged with conspiracy to commit mail fraud and honest services mail fraud.

The 200-page indictment unsealed Tuesday said Huffman and William H. Macy, her husband and Shameless star, “made a purported charitable contribution of $15,000 to participate in the college entrance exam cheating scheme on behalf of her eldest daughter.” That fraud included paying an individual who “controlled” a Los Angeles SAT testing center to fix her daughter’s incorrect exam answers. That effort led to a massive increase in the daughter’s SAT score.

So if Hoffman mailed Singer a check for $15,000 to his shame charity knowing it was fake and in reality it was used to help her daughter get a higher SAT score, she just committed mail fraud, no?

Now, supposed Loughlin paid $500,000 to get both her daughters into USC, now if she did the same thing and wrote various checks over the years, totaling a half a million to Singer's bogus charity, she also committed mail fraud.

Here's a list of all the charges for the various people invovled:

Investigations of College Admissions and Testing Bribery Scheme

You can also read the unsealed indictment as well.

Mail and wire fraud

Honest services fraud
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Old Yesterday, 09:44 AM
 
1,304 posts, read 652,105 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
I had been wondering how the feds caught on. Just read on Huffington Post that another parent who was in trouble with the Feds for Securities fraud, dropped the dime. Apparently a parent who was friends with him confided about it.
Of course...from the mob to main street that's the way it normally goes down....they find a small fish who gets turned for bigger fish.

Good that this charade was exposed and those who gamed the system will be punished but that it all happened proves the old adage that two people can keep a secret only if one of them is dead. "Don't ever tell anybody anything."
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Old Yesterday, 10:03 AM
 
6,384 posts, read 3,415,891 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjseliga View Post
I'm not a lawyer, but Mark is a lawyer and probably can explain it better than me.

It seems all of the parents were charged with conspiracy to commit mail fraud and honest services mail fraud.

The 200-page indictment unsealed Tuesday said Huffman and William H. Macy, her husband and Shameless star, “made a purported charitable contribution of $15,000 to participate in the college entrance exam cheating scheme on behalf of her eldest daughter.” That fraud included paying an individual who “controlled” a Los Angeles SAT testing center to fix her daughter’s incorrect exam answers. That effort led to a massive increase in the daughter’s SAT score.

So if Hoffman mailed Singer a check for $15,000 to his shame charity knowing it was fake and in reality it was used to help her daughter get a higher SAT score, she just committed mail fraud, no?

Now, supposed Loughlin paid $500,000 to get both her daughters into USC, now if she did the same thing and wrote various checks over the years, totaling a half a million to Singer's bogus charity, she also committed mail fraud.
...
I get that, but I'm not getting how that translates into mail fraud. Other than the specific case of the fake charity that may have tax implications, where is the fraud? They didn't obtain something of value without paying for it. IE, whatever education they got from the college they still had to pay for. I understand the ethics (or lack thereof) but can't trace the crime here. The only thing I can think is if someone took a tax deduction for the fake charity. But there are supposedly hundreds of others who didn't use a fake charity so how do they reach mail fraud charges for them?

From the information I've read so far, this is somewhat the equivalent of slipping the hostess a twenty to move ahead of line in restaurant. The meal is still paid for, nothing is gotten for free.


Reading the indictment didn't really clear things up. As a non-lawyer, it reads to me like Singer and a couple of partners were the ones committing the acts and if it were fraud, then most of the parents should actually be considered victims of not participants. In fact it calls the charges racketeering, not fraud. It would be very interesting to sit in a jury on one of these and hear how it gets argued out, assuming these go to trial and don't get bargained down to a fine.
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Old Yesterday, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia/South Jersey area
2,670 posts, read 1,261,298 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalExpectations View Post
Tax exempt status is defined in the IRS code which implements the tax law. All of the schools qualify.

There is nothing in the law that prohibits admissions departments from selecting who they like on any criteria, so long as they are not discriminating against protected classes (race, religion, ethnicity, sexual identity, sexual orientation, veteran status, gender, etc). Even then there are exceptions: HBCU actively discriminate on the basis of race, Theological seminaries actively discriminate on the basis of religion, single-gender colleges actively discriminate on the basis of gender.
HBCU's most definitely do not discriminate on the basis of race. IN fact most HBCU's that I know of are actively trying to recruit Caucasian and HIspanic students to increase their diversity.

lol, I tell many of my white friends to send their kids to HBCU's because they would probably get a free ride for 4 years.
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Old Yesterday, 10:42 AM
 
1,642 posts, read 666,321 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
I get that, but I'm not getting how that translates into mail fraud. Other than the specific case of the fake charity that may have tax implications, where is the fraud? They didn't obtain something of value without paying for it. IE, whatever education they got from the college they still had to pay for. I understand the ethics (or lack thereof) but can't trace the crime here. The only thing I can think is if someone took a tax deduction for the fake charity. But there are supposedly hundreds of others who didn't use a fake charity so how do they reach mail fraud charges for them?

From the information I've read so far, this is somewhat the equivalent of slipping the hostess a twenty to move ahead of line in restaurant. The meal is still paid for, nothing is gotten for free.


Reading the indictment didn't really clear things up. As a non-lawyer, it reads to me like Singer and a couple of partners were the ones committing the acts and if it were fraud, then most of the parents should actually be considered victims of not participants. In fact it calls the charges racketeering, not fraud. It would be very interesting to sit in a jury on one of these and hear how it gets argued out, assuming these go to trial and don't get bargained down to a fine.
They used either the mail or wire to send the money (mail fraud is thrown in as mail and wire fraud). What the crime was they committed was paying bribes which is illegal. When a bribery is illegal is often a fine line. Tipping a hostess probably wouldn't fall into bribery laws.
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Old Yesterday, 10:49 AM
 
1,642 posts, read 666,321 times
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Regarding this whole scandal, it is more obvious of what bad parenting these people did. Instead of either realizing their kids aren't ready for college or getting them tutors to help they chose using their money to influence. You can see this in Lori Laughlin's daughter. Her whole goal in life is to be an "influencer" which she wouldn't even have that opportunity if it wasn't that her mother is famous. Now not only has her mother lost everything, she has as well. Very sad but it has gone on for a long time with trust fund children who float around in life living off their parents or grandparents money.
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