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Old 08-30-2019, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Sugarland
13,806 posts, read 12,896,619 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
I think people who plan crimes do, when debating killing the victim or leaving a witness. People committing violent acts impulsively like the guy in this story donít but there are rapists who plan their crimes and try not to get caught. If you can get the death penalty for rape or for murder, seems to me itíd be in the rapists interests to just kill the victim
So the possibility of the death penalty wouldn't be enough to discourage someone from being a rapist in the first place, but it would be enough to persuade a person to become both a rapist and a murderer, but otherwise they would've been more likely to stop at "just rape" since the death penalty wouldn't have been involved? In the case of not wanting to leave a witness, I would think that's because they don't want to get caught period, but it's not an issue of "I'll let her live as long as I only have to worry about life in prison and not the death penalty."
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Old 08-30-2019, 02:17 PM
 
Location: Riding a rock floating through space
2,180 posts, read 639,085 times
Reputation: 5509
Why do these threads always end up in a death penalty debate? Nobody is going to change anyone else's minds on the issue here, why do the same (mostly opponents of) continue to waste keystrokes reiterating their arguments?
The way the death penalty is administered (on those very rare occassions) the process takes decades to actually end in a pain-free, peaceful lethal injected death. As such, the death penalty may as well not even exist in this country, so there's nothing to debate.
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Old 08-30-2019, 02:39 PM
 
7,961 posts, read 4,510,204 times
Reputation: 11849
Quote:
Originally Posted by SVTLightning View Post
There is no "why" to be found out. It's just horrible.
Hand-wringing is so productive NOT. Examine and address the reasons. They are plentiful and obvious.
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Old 08-30-2019, 02:44 PM
 
21,330 posts, read 16,990,622 times
Reputation: 39791
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet Like Sugar View Post
So the possibility of the death penalty wouldn't be enough to discourage someone from being a rapist in the first place, but it would be enough to persuade a person to become both a rapist and a murderer, but otherwise they would've been more likely to stop at "just rape" since the death penalty wouldn't have been involved? In the case of not wanting to leave a witness, I would think that's because they don't want to get caught period, but it's not an issue of "I'll let her live as long as I only have to worry about life in prison and not the death penalty."
I donít think the death penalty has much bearing on it either way. Iím just saying in the context of the discussion, if killing a victim makes it less likely the person will be caught, which it does, and the penalty is the same either way, it seems like it would make the decision easier. I donít think either way that the penalty makes all that much of a difference though in the end.
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Old 08-30-2019, 02:45 PM
 
21,330 posts, read 16,990,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
Hand-wringing is so productive NOT. Examine and address the reasons. They are plentiful and obvious.
They are? What are they? I thought they donít know anything yet?
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Old 08-30-2019, 02:52 PM
 
21,330 posts, read 16,990,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
Why do these threads always end up in a death penalty debate? Nobody is going to change anyone else's minds on the issue here, why do the same (mostly opponents of) continue to waste keystrokes reiterating their arguments?
The way the death penalty is administered (on those very rare occassions) the process takes decades to actually end in a pain-free, peaceful lethal injected death. As such, the death penalty may as well not even exist in this country, so there's nothing to debate.
There are always though people who post that if the penalties were extra brutal it would deter these crimes. They even say it about crimes where the perp intends to die at the end of crime spree, which makes no sense. I don’t think anyone here is arguing because we oppose the death penalty, I’m posting to say it doesn’t deter crime especially with crimes of impulsivity/drugs/mental illness, and perps who don’t care if they die. I’m not anti death penalty though (although we do not apply it equally here) I just don’t think it’s a deterrent. I find it odd that you’re asking why people are posting opposing viewpoints or responding to posts they don’t agree with, isn’t that pretty much what the forums are, a variety of opinions? If someone posts some silliness that if we had beheadings crime would end, I’m not allowed to respond? Not sure what you’re asking.
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Old 08-30-2019, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Riding a rock floating through space
2,180 posts, read 639,085 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
There are always though people who post that if the penalties were extra brutal it would deter these crimes. They even say it about crimes where the perp intends to die at the end of crime spree, which makes no sense. I don’t think anyone here is arguing because we oppose the death penalty, I’m posting to say it doesn’t deter crime especially with crimes of impulsivity/drugs/mental illness, and perps who don’t care if they die. I’m not anti death penalty though (although we do not apply it equally here) I just don’t think it’s a deterrent. I find it odd that you’re asking why people are posting opposing viewpoints or responding to posts they don’t agree with, isn’t that pretty much what the forums are, a variety of opinions? If someone posts some silliness that if we had beheadings crime would end, I’m not allowed to respond? Not sure what you’re asking.
The way it's administered today of course its not a deterent, it has no teeth. Back in the days of the electric chair, who knows if it was a deterent - it's impossible to prove that some murderers held back because of it. Going on common sense, if the death penalty were much quicker and much more painful, it would make at least a few of these monsters think twice.
But again, this is an issue that's impossible to prove either way. One thing that would definitely improve with a quicker and more frequent death penalty sentences is less trash to feed and take care of for society to pay for. That reason alone is good enough for me. I find it absolutely APPALLING that people like James Holmes and Dennis Rader get free health care for life while over 50 million Americans have no health insurance. Anyone who thinks that makes any sense fits right into this idiotic society.
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Old 08-30-2019, 03:31 PM
 
21,330 posts, read 16,990,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
The way it's administered today of course its not a deterent, it has no teeth. Back in the days of the electric chair, who knows if it was a deterent - it's impossible to prove that some murderers held back because of it. Going on common sense, if the death penalty were much quicker and much more painful, it would make at least a few of these monsters think twice.
But again, this is an issue that's impossible to prove either way. One thing that would definitely improve with a quicker and more frequent death penalty sentences is less trash to feed and take care of for society to pay for. That reason alone is good enough for me. I find it absolutely APPALLING that people like James Holmes and Dennis Rader get free health care for life while over 50 million Americans have no health insurance. Anyone who thinks that makes any sense fits right into this idiotic society.
There are thousands of people who have been convicted of crimes then later found to be innocent. I believe still in the principles this country was founded on (I say ďstillĒ cause a lot of people who call themselves patriots donít seem to at all anymore). The founders of our country made a very deliberate decision to weigh our justice system in the direction of better a murderer go free than one innocent person goes to jail (or dies). Until we can ensure only the guilty are punished in our justice system and until we can ensure itís applied equally regardless of race or the type of lawyer one can afford (right now the poor are put to death at far greater rates) than I canít really be behind it let alone making it harsher. We have a Constitution that prohibits cruel punishment. I find it distressing how many want to ignore it (except when it comes to the second of course).

I do t think in any case the severity of the punishment has much bearing. You get your hand chopped off for stealing in Middle East yet people still steal. A crime like this though especially where the person was out of his mind either because of drugs or mental illness, penalty wouldnít make any difference at all. I highly doubt the guy pre-planned stripping naked and murdering his family, he obviously snapped loose from reality.
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Old 08-30-2019, 04:12 PM
 
Location: colorado springs, CO
5,219 posts, read 2,403,989 times
Reputation: 17329
Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
Only legal ones! An SSRI, no doubt.
Exactly. The prescribing of this crap is so common; people seem to want to protect it.

'Oh but it made such a difference for my depression ...'

Yeah, well; you're not a late adolescent/young adult male, are you? Why can't people see this one common denominator for that one population demographic that is committing mass murder? The adolescent & young adult male brain is a force to be reckoned with & 100+ years ago, if they were not aggressive & violent; they would lose their land & women to invaders.

Now, when their behaviors are out-of control, we put them on the same meds as depressed, middle-aged housewives & tell them to use their 'inside voice'. God forbid we admit there are any differences. We must be equal & willing to die on that hill. Literally.

Wake up, people.
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Old 08-30-2019, 04:38 PM
 
Location: Fuquay Varina
4,738 posts, read 6,766,501 times
Reputation: 11887
Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
Hand-wringing is so productive NOT. Examine and address the reasons. They are plentiful and obvious.
So please inform the rest of us what is plentiful and obvious here? If you really knew an obvious reason i think you would have said so. Now it appears you are just posting for postings sake lol
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