U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Current Events
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 09-09-2019, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
9,538 posts, read 8,528,334 times
Reputation: 20889

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post


As for watchman, I had not known about a "roaming" requirement but there must always be a captain awake and on duty. I crew on a boat and the one job I would not want is night captain because it is dark and quiet and solitary. And typically very limited internet if any, at sea. I think they need to up the requirement to two crew on duty at all times, to minimize the risk of one falling asleep.
In all of my deliveries for Beneteau, we did four hour watches so there was never any single person was 10PM to 6AM or anything like that. It was more like 6-10, 10-2, 2-6. No one person would ever have to stay up all night at the helm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post
What!? Where was this? As crew, we are strictly prohibited from alcohol from the moment we board (and no boarding already with alcohol in the blood) until we step off after the trip. More than once I (along with all crew) have been alcohol-tested by CG.
We never drank offshore. You would always want all your faculties about you.

Once land would come in sight, we'd break out the booze but never when we were so far offshore you could not see land.

The captains I know (I have a lot of yachtie friends) party when the boat is at dock.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-09-2019, 12:21 PM
 
10,163 posts, read 4,761,491 times
Reputation: 13282
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueherons View Post
We never drank offshore. You would always want all your faculties about you.

Yeah, there's really no such thing as off-duty. I've been rousted from my bunk at 2am many times to assist in something.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-09-2019, 02:04 PM
 
Location: Houston area
769 posts, read 825,319 times
Reputation: 1762
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz View Post
I guess that means you don't have any good answer to the question why they didn't stay near the boat and look for survivors. Could they have saved the passengers? Maybe, maybe not. We will never know, because they didn't even try. They just ran away from it.
Cloudy Dayz Negative Dayz?

If you would actually read the article, your questions would be answered.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/06/us/ca...-st=1568058892

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-09-2019, 02:12 PM
 
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
9,538 posts, read 8,528,334 times
Reputation: 20889
Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangaia View Post
Yeah, there's really no such thing as off-duty. I've been rousted from my bunk at 2am many times to assist in something.
Yes, of course this. And often.

Watching the sun rise offshore is a wondrous thing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-09-2019, 02:35 PM
 
Location: Oregon Coast
5,578 posts, read 2,255,227 times
Reputation: 7318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyrallnamestaken View Post
Cloudy Dayz Negative Dayz?

If you would actually read the article, your questions would be answered.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/06/us/ca...-st=1568058892

I have read that article multiple times. Nothing in that article exonerates the crew. 1. Where the hell was the watchman who was supposed to be on duty, for exactly this type of situation? Obviously sleeping. Since the fire was discovered by a crew member who woke up. 2. Why did they not fight the fire? Boats are required to have firefighting equipment for a reason. It's not there just to look pretty.

Yes, I am negative about a crew that was not doing their job to keep their passengers safe, and who abandoned ship and left the passengers to die. I find it deeply disturbing that more people are not negative about this type of incompetence that left a lot of people dead. Just remember that if you don't hold people accountable for their actions, you could be the next person to die due to their incompetence.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-09-2019, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Lone Mountain Las Vegas NV
13,382 posts, read 5,123,687 times
Reputation: 5957
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz View Post
I have read that article multiple times. Nothing in that article exonerates the crew. 1. Where the hell was the watchman who was supposed to be on duty, for exactly this type of situation? Obviously sleeping. Since the fire was discovered by a crew member who woke up. 2. Why did they not fight the fire? Boats are required to have firefighting equipment for a reason. It's not there just to look pretty.

Yes, I am negative about a crew that was not doing their job to keep their passengers safe, and who abandoned ship and left the passengers to die. I find it deeply disturbing that more people are not negative about this type of incompetence that left a lot of people dead. Just remember that if you don't hold people accountable for their actions, you could be the next person to die due to their incompetence.
There are a number of things that may well have been wrong. But virtually none of them would read on the crew.

The placement of the emergency exit for instance. With very little trouble it could have been outside of the salon. Likely all would have escaped.

There should have been smoke or fire detectors that set off a loud alarm at the first minutes of the fire. Nothing there apparently. A couple of cheap cameras in the salon and bunk area might well have saved everyone.

The provisions for charging battery operated devices may have been deficient. Out of the Salon in a fire proof box would have made sense.

There was almost certainly a watch stander who was within 15 or 20 feet of all the critical areas. That likely covers the rover. If the area had been properly alarmed it would have worked fine.

The crew unfortunately did not pick up on the fire until the salon was fully involved. At this point the fate of the passengers was sealed. They did look to see if anyone escaped but they knew that was almost impossible due to the physical layout.

No where is there any sign of the crew being negligent or cowardly. They did their best then saved themselves. One can ask no more.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-09-2019, 09:03 PM
 
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
9,538 posts, read 8,528,334 times
Reputation: 20889
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz View Post
I have read that article multiple times. Nothing in that article exonerates the crew. 1. Where the hell was the watchman who was supposed to be on duty, for exactly this type of situation? Obviously sleeping. Since the fire was discovered by a crew member who woke up. 2. Why did they not fight the fire? Boats are required to have firefighting equipment for a reason. It's not there just to look pretty.

Yes, I am negative about a crew that was not doing their job to keep their passengers safe, and who abandoned ship and left the passengers to die. I find it deeply disturbing that more people are not negative about this type of incompetence that left a lot of people dead. Just remember that if you don't hold people accountable for their actions, you could be the next person to die due to their incompetence.
You didn't read the article or you'd see the crew did everything they could possibly do.

Your anger seems to stem from the anchor watch. Why are you taking this so personally?

FWIW, it isn't a night 'watchman'. It is an anchor watch. You have someone awake to make sure the anchor doesn't drag. That's all they do is maintain position.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-09-2019, 09:15 PM
 
Location: Oregon Coast
5,578 posts, read 2,255,227 times
Reputation: 7318
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvmensch View Post
There are a number of things that may well have been wrong. But virtually none of them would read on the crew.

The placement of the emergency exit for instance. With very little trouble it could have been outside of the salon. Likely all would have escaped.

There should have been smoke or fire detectors that set off a loud alarm at the first minutes of the fire. Nothing there apparently. A couple of cheap cameras in the salon and bunk area might well have saved everyone.

The provisions for charging battery operated devices may have been deficient. Out of the Salon in a fire proof box would have made sense.

There was almost certainly a watch stander who was within 15 or 20 feet of all the critical areas. That likely covers the rover. If the area had been properly alarmed it would have worked fine.

The crew unfortunately did not pick up on the fire until the salon was fully involved. At this point the fate of the passengers was sealed. They did look to see if anyone escaped but they knew that was almost impossible due to the physical layout.

No where is there any sign of the crew being negligent or cowardly. They did their best then saved themselves. One can ask no more.
Again, where was the watchman who was supposed to be on duty, for exactly this situation? That is crew negligence. The other things you mentioned are also crew negligence. It's the crews responsibility to make sure that safety equipment is functioning correctly. If the crew doesn't change batteries, who is going to do it?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-09-2019, 09:28 PM
 
Location: Oregon Coast
5,578 posts, read 2,255,227 times
Reputation: 7318
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueherons View Post
You didn't read the article or you'd see the crew did everything they could possibly do.

Your anger seems to stem from the anchor watch. Why are you taking this so personally?

FWIW, it isn't a night 'watchman'. It is an anchor watch. You have someone awake to make sure the anchor doesn't drag. That's all they do is maintain position.
You accuse me of not reading the article, when it is clearly you who have not read it. Your statement is in direct conflict with what the article says.

Quote:
The Conception's certificate of inspection required a roving watchman, US Coast Guard Capt. Monica Rochester said at a news conference.
"The role of that person is to rove and check on the safety of the area they have been placed in charge of," she said.
Roving and checking the safety of an area would obviously involve more then just watching the anchor.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-10-2019, 07:26 AM
 
Location: NJ
10,991 posts, read 21,627,138 times
Reputation: 9367
Criminal investigation opens into fire aboard California dive boat: source September 9, 2019 / 10:10 PM / Updated 11 hours ago
Quote:
That investigation is proceeding as divers postponed for another day efforts to raise the 75-foot Conception from the ocean floor, citing weather conditions. They hope to find the remains of the final victim inside the charred wreckage of the ship.

“We are conducting a joint investigation. No criminal charges have been filed at this time,” the source told Reuters.
The Los Angeles Times reported that the investigation was focused on possible safety lapses aboard the Conception, including the lack of a night watchman and failure to properly train the crew for such emergencies.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Current Events
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top