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Old Today, 08:45 AM
 
Location: Oregon Coast
5,516 posts, read 2,229,201 times
Reputation: 7191

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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueherons View Post
Why? How would an accidental fire be their fault?

And the locked doors don't make sense. You can latch a door but they don't generally have locks.
Quote:
The captain goes down with the ship

"The captain goes down with the ship" is a maritime tradition that a sea captain holds ultimate responsibility for both his ship and everyone embarked on it, and that in an emergency, he will either save them or die trying.
The captain goes down with the ship - Wikipedia

This gutless pathetic crew did not save their passengers, and they did not die trying. They just abandoned ship and saved their own lives. Just like Captain Francesco Schettino, who is now serving time for manslaughter, they had to be ordered back to the ship by the Coast Guard. That is unacceptable. They must be charged with manslaughter.
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Old Today, 08:54 AM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
7,436 posts, read 4,283,351 times
Reputation: 18763
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz View Post
This gutless pathetic crew did not save their passengers...
Probably because it wasn't possible to save the trapped passengers.

Quote:
And they did not die trying.
Which is a good thing, as it means fewer casualties overall. You DO realize that the crew have families and friends of their own, who would mourn their deaths? Their job description doesn't require committing suicide.

Quote:
They just abandoned ship and saved their own lives.
Saving their own lives was a good thing. The tragedy doesn't become better with more deaths.

Quote:
They must be charged with manslaughter.
Right now there's no evidence that they deserve to be charged with anything. The fact that they couldn't save the trapped passengers and weren't stupid enough to commit suicide is in no way proof that they were in any way derelict in their duty. Their job does not require them to do the impossible, and failing to do so is not a crime.
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Old Today, 08:59 AM
 
Location: Oregon Coast
5,516 posts, read 2,229,201 times
Reputation: 7191
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawk4042C View Post
It's sad, but the passengers were probably already died in the sleep from carbon monoxide or carbon dioxide poisoning.
Better than burning alive.

The dive boat bunk room looks very tight. It small and long enough to funnel the fire & smoke.
Depending on which way the fire started, they never had a chance.

The fire can spread fast and furious.

Dorm room fire demo:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJYC6SOgUig

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUh4rCjuYDA

Backdraft Demo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdEI7g2i1ZU


Hopefully the USCG can determine the cause, so it can be prevented again.
At least a dormitory like that first video, has to have multiple exits. Apparently that is not the case for charter boats.
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Old Today, 09:27 AM
 
Location: Oregon Coast
5,516 posts, read 2,229,201 times
Reputation: 7191
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aredhel View Post
Probably because it wasn't possible to save the trapped passengers.
There is no evidence that they even tried. It was reported that the Coast Guard had to order them to return and try to save the passengers.
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Old Today, 09:47 AM
 
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
9,490 posts, read 8,496,163 times
Reputation: 20763
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnassia View Post

While anchored at night they were probably running equipment (anchor lights, radio, pumps, navigation electronics, etc.) off the battery bank, not the engines. I don't dive but have friends in southern CA who do. When I heard about this I emailed one to ask what they'd heard around the community. From what friends said, the company has a fine reputation. They don't get that with mere lip service, and the USCG does not skimp on safety inspections.
They would have had to had been running the nav lights at the very minimum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soccernerd View Post
Iím waiting for charges for some or all of the crew and possibly the owner. Six out of seven managed to dive overboard while everyone else was trapped below deck. Thereís got to be some sort of negligence.
What are these charges exactly? Saving themselves? Refusing to die in a deadly fire?

And for the third time, by design, crew quarters are not located with guest quarters.
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Old Today, 09:53 AM
 
Location: In the outlet by the lightswitch
1,831 posts, read 1,069,434 times
Reputation: 3356
Quote:
Originally Posted by MechAndy View Post
I am a CA diver.
I’m afraid to hear the victim list.
I’ve been on this boat and her sister ship the Vision at least 8 or so times.
I never liked the tight sleeping quarters.
Other than that this is or was a top notch outfit.
How did this happen?
My guess it was batteries but I don’t know.
Why did the night watch person not have time to shout fire fire fire?
Normally I would easily say he or she might be asleep, but I’ve spent over 30 nights on the Conception and the Vision and I always get up at night, never once did I see the watch person sleeping or act like they just woke up.
Top notch outfit.
Very sad day.
Andy.

I used to dive off a boat called the Encore to the Channel Islands. It's been decades and I don't even know if that boat still exists.

The best way I can figure to describe the setup for those who have never been in such a boat is that it's a lot like the racks one might find in a Navy boat. It's basically just a room full of bunk beds. It's tight (and I remember it being hot too with all the people packed in). Sometimes I would just go on deck and fall asleep there instead.

I found a picture of the Conception's sleeping quarters (it's similar to what I remember from the boat I regularly stayed on). I am not really sure about this "locked in" that I keep hearing. It looks like a regular staircase up. And to get to the head, you'd have to be able to get out of the sleeping arra (I would think... I am guessing the head was not in the sleeping area. I've never seen that before) so why would the crew lock passengers in? I think that's a mistake someone reported somewhere.


There are other pictures here including a diagram of the boat:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...deck-fire.html


I would hold off on judgement on the crew of the boat. If it the fire was that hot, intense, and fast, there is really nothing anyone could have done except abandon the ship and call for help (which they did). Think of it this way, if it was too hot and fast for people who were trapped in it to risk running though the galley to get out, how superhuman would it be to climb down a ladder from the bridge (see the picture) into the fire-filled galley to get in to get to others? I would think anyone going in would quickly be overcome. Not to mention climbing a down a ladder into flames without protective gear is just not something I think I could even do if I wanted to.



Last edited by TMBGBlueCanary; Today at 10:05 AM..
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Old Today, 09:56 AM
 
5,033 posts, read 2,259,318 times
Reputation: 7233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz View Post
There is no evidence that they even tried. It was reported that the Coast Guard had to order them to return and try to save the passengers.



There are limits to everything. At no time is anyone (including first responders, fire fighters, EMS personnel) expected to put their own life in danger in order to save anyone. That is not to say that sometimes people go above and beyond what is expected but if they do not, it is not a crime. It would be expected that if they were capable, to take a dingy back to the general area of the boat to see if anyone was alive, in the water and so on that could be rescued. Would they be expected to get so close to the the burning, sinking vessel to endanger themselves ..... no. Would they be expected to save themselves once they had done what they could with out endangering themselves .... yes.
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Old Today, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Oregon Coast
5,516 posts, read 2,229,201 times
Reputation: 7191
Quote:
Originally Posted by ditchoc View Post
There are limits to everything. At no time is anyone (including first responders, fire fighters, EMS personnel) expected to put their own life in danger in order to save anyone. That is not to say that sometimes people go above and beyond what is expected but if they do not, it is not a crime. It would be expected that if they were capable, to take a dingy back to the general area of the boat to see if anyone was alive, in the water and so on that could be rescued. Would they be expected to get so close to the the burning, sinking vessel to endanger themselves ..... no. Would they be expected to save themselves once they had done what they could with out endangering themselves .... yes.
They should all have gotten fire extinguishers and gone below deck to rescue the passengers. If they died doing that, then so be it. That was their job. You can't have a ship's crew members jumping overboard, and leaving passengers to fend for themselves.
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Old Today, 10:18 AM
 
33,066 posts, read 16,919,978 times
Reputation: 17916
What is it with this pathological "Someone must be punished!" BS?
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Old Today, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
7,436 posts, read 4,283,351 times
Reputation: 18763
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz View Post
They should all have gotten fire extinguishers and gone below deck to rescue the passengers. If they died doing that, then so be it.
Professional firefighters back off when a building is too far gone to safely enter, even if there are people trapped inside. Your expectations are beyond unrealistic!
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