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Old 09-14-2019, 10:16 AM
 
6,494 posts, read 6,589,946 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carrcollie View Post
If Brock Turner had been a young, non-college educated black male, he'd be in prison right now. We have two systems of justice in our country, one for wealthy and whites, the other one for minorities and poor.
You are probably correct. I think it’s pathetic that he got off so lightly.

. I think the judge saw a reflection of himself in this kid and proceeded accordingly.im sure the judge never did anything so drastic, but he probably felt the kids life shouldn’t be ruined for one “mistake” even though it was a terrible and heinous crime. There are even posters on here defending Brock Turner because they blame the girl and think it was an over reaction. People can not just go around and insert their fingers into unconscious peoples genitalia, and no one wants that to happen to themselves.
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Old 09-14-2019, 03:50 PM
 
Location: Central IL
15,440 posts, read 8,842,455 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meyerland View Post
The clear truth is that an unconscious person can not give consent. Anyone that doesn’t understand that has a very big issue with morality and social and legal boundaries. It’s not even up for debate.
Problem is that some folks on here seem to think it's reasonable for two guys from afar to realize a woman is unconscious and that the situation looks odd, yet the guy on top of her is innocently oblivious and therefore gets off the hook for his assaultive behavior.
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Old 09-14-2019, 11:03 PM
 
64 posts, read 12,016 times
Reputation: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by PassTheChocolate View Post
I've addressed those two men and the accuser. They saw mere seconds of an entire night. She said she couldn't remember what happened but decided "he was guilty the moment I woke up".

Her VIS makes a really good case for not convicting, but few people take the time to really examine it. And the truth is no one could prove he did those things in his right mind, with malice aforethought AND with the knowledge she was unconscious or whether or not she was unconscious or fell asleep. But none of that is convenient to hysterical armchair advocates with an ax to grind.
Once again, PTC offers incredible insight.

Compare the VIS versus the police report. Chanel mentioned(more than once) in her VIS that she was wearing a "beige cardigan". From that, I guess, we were supposed to assume she was dressed like a librarian. But reading the police report, we find that she was also clad in a "skin-tight dress".

According to her VIS, Chanel was just planning to stay home and read that night, but decided to go to the "dumb party" just so she could spend more time with her little sister. "Why not"? Ya know, 'make fun of the undergrads with their braces' and so forth... She dismisses her intoxication as a misjudgment of her tolerance which had "significantly lowered since college", though she had only graduated like 6 months earlier. No mention of the fact, noted in the police report, that had she downed four shots of liquor in the 30 minutes prior to leaving for the party...

Her VIS is so disingenuous. She takes ZERO responsibility for her own behavior. If one single journalist had the guts to call her out and expose her for what she is, we wouldn't even know her name.
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Old 09-15-2019, 06:51 AM
 
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There are many people who get drunk or high and pass out in this society. No one deserves to have their clothes removed by a dumpster and have their vagina or anus have things inserted into it.
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Old 09-15-2019, 07:09 AM
 
6,494 posts, read 6,589,946 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whatIfigured View Post
Once again, PTC offers incredible insight.

Compare the VIS versus the police report. Chanel mentioned(more than once) in her VIS that she was wearing a "beige cardigan". From that, I guess, we were supposed to assume she was dressed like a librarian. But reading the police report, we find that she was also clad in a "skin-tight dress".

According to her VIS, Chanel was just planning to stay home and read that night, but decided to go to the "dumb party" just so she could spend more time with her little sister. "Why not"? Ya know, 'make fun of the undergrads with their braces' and so forth... She dismisses her intoxication as a misjudgment of her tolerance which had "significantly lowered since college", though she had only graduated like 6 months earlier. No mention of the fact, noted in the police report, that had she downed four shots of liquor in the 30 minutes prior to leaving for the party...

Her VIS is so disingenuous. She takes ZERO responsibility for her own behavior. If one single journalist had the guts to call her out and expose her for what she is, we wouldn't even know her name.
This is why many males and females do not report sexual assault or rape. They are often blamed for it because they have engaged in risky behavior. However, as a society many people engage in risky behavior. No one deserves to be assaulted, and the perpetrator deserves to be punished for his crime.
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Old 09-15-2019, 11:38 AM
 
Location: Central IL
15,440 posts, read 8,842,455 times
Reputation: 36376
Quote:
Originally Posted by PassTheChocolate View Post
I've addressed those two men and the accuser. They saw mere seconds of an entire night. She said she couldn't remember what happened but decided "he was guilty the moment I woke up".

Her VIS makes a really good case for not convicting, but few people take the time to really examine it. And the truth is no one could prove he did those things in his right mind, with malice aforethought AND with the knowledge she was unconscious or whether or not she was unconscious or fell asleep. But none of that is convenient to hysterical armchair advocates with an ax to grind.
Right...a few seconds...they saw the most important seconds at the END of the night. What happened earlier in the night that somehow negates the lack of consciousness at the end? Consent can be withdrawn at any point, even if she was conscious - but passing out immediately ends consent.

Are you thinking that you should remember what happened to you when you were passed out? Are you thinking if she was conscious that she consented to having pine needles shoved inside of her and that he was "pleasuring her"?

No, I'm not being hysterical just using reasonable common sense and not twisting myself into knots to come up with how he must be innocent. Remember the definition of guilt beyond a reasonable doubt - that specifically means the case doesn't have to be 100% airtight to convict or else everyone accused would go free.

You don't have to like her...or him.

Last edited by reneeh63; 09-15-2019 at 12:03 PM..
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Old 09-15-2019, 11:49 AM
 
6,494 posts, read 6,589,946 times
Reputation: 9894
What made him guilty of sexual assault was the fact that she was unconscious and there were abrasions in her vagina. To top it off there were eyewitnesses that saw him assaulting her while she was unconscious. This was not an act of a person trying to pleasure someone. It was assault and he was rightly convicted.
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Old 09-15-2019, 12:19 PM
 
44 posts, read 7,034 times
Reputation: 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by whatIfigured View Post
Once again, PTC offers incredible insight.

Compare the VIS versus the police report. Chanel mentioned(more than once) in her VIS that she was wearing a "beige cardigan". From that, I guess, we were supposed to assume she was dressed like a librarian. But reading the police report, we find that she was also clad in a "skin-tight dress"..
Irrelevant. What a woman wears doesn't matter and doesn't give someone an excuse to rape/attack/sexually assault her. These beliefs that it's okay to rape due to what someone wears, died many years ago. You don't get to use what they wore as an excuse.

If a man was wearing tight pants do you think it would be okay for someone to rape him?
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Old 09-16-2019, 03:34 PM
 
64 posts, read 12,016 times
Reputation: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by carrcollie View Post
Irrelevant. What a woman wears doesn't matter and doesn't give someone an excuse to rape/attack/sexually assault her. These beliefs that it's okay to rape due to what someone wears, died many years ago. You don't get to use what they wore as an excuse.

If a man was wearing tight pants do you think it would be okay for someone to rape him?
You've created a strawman. No one has suggested that "it's okay to rape" anyone. What I said, and I stand by, is that Chanel's VIS was disingenuous, and that's borne out by the discrepancies between it and the police report.
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Old 09-16-2019, 06:18 PM
 
Location: Central IL
15,440 posts, read 8,842,455 times
Reputation: 36376
Quote:
Originally Posted by whatIfigured View Post
You've created a strawman. No one has suggested that "it's okay to rape" anyone. What I said, and I stand by, is that Chanel's VIS was disingenuous, and that's borne out by the discrepancies between it and the police report.
The police report stated one perspective and she stated her own....was she wearing both articles of clothing? Alrighty then.

Actually, I have to wonder about a police report using the phrasing of "skin tight" - the term "fitted" would have been more objective.
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