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Old Today, 06:58 AM
 
10,893 posts, read 4,415,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giesela View Post
Well I'll take the first question on - why would someone have sex with an animal? Why would someone have sex with a dead person? Why would someone rape their wife? Why would someone........I mean the list goes on and on. That question doesn't even begin to apply. The rest sounds like cherry picked fake news to support your own beliefs that nothing will ever change.

Doubting that.
He wasn't having sex with her, is the thing. He was attempting to pleasure her. He wasn't pleasuring himself.

That's so key here, and it deserves a lot of focus. He wasn't doing something for his own pleasure, as in all your examples in this post.

Which would make it appear, IMHO, that he believed she was conscious.
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Old Today, 06:59 AM
 
76 posts, read 20,041 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
The more I think about it, the more really concerning the title "Know My Name" and the desire behind writing this becomes. What is this unquenchable desire some have for fame, at any cost and for any reason?

For a woman who is claiming to be terribly humiliated, why is it so important to her that we all know exactly who she is, and what she looks like so that we would likely (hopefully?) recognize her in public after she makes the rounds of interviews on news shows?

And a follow up question - what was her personality like, before this incident happened?


Welp you know its the Me2 madness going on behind her being this way. Its the "in-thing" to do now. Smh. Such a very sad way things have become over something that is so extremely sensitive, private and emotional. Usually something so bad and traumatizing you would NOT want to make rounds on tv shows and other forms of media to constantly talk about it.
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Old Today, 07:09 AM
 
76 posts, read 20,041 times
Reputation: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by mascoma View Post
She's a pathological liar. Her statement went on and on about how she was found behind a dumpster, but there was no dumpster anywhere in the vicinity. The incident occurred next to a basketball court. Then she told the probation department that Turner didn't need to be locked up. Then when the judge gave him a short jail sentence she objected and claimed she never said that. She's nothing but a promiscuous drunk. There is plenty of reasonable doubt in this case. The story was fake news. There was no dumpster, she was not unconscious and no rape occurred. Turner also did not get a light sentence - he got life on the sex offender registry.


Was this story what that Law and Order, SVU episode was about? I forgot what it was called but there was one where the girl's parents and his were fighting over the accusation. They both were well to do families. They even dressed him up more preppy to make him look innocent. The boy got sentenced tho, yet the girl was basically sorry for the whole thing because as he was being taken away she was acting as if she wanted to go over to him. They liked eachother but due to their parents she 'had' to do that to him. I saw it a year or 2 ago.
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Old Today, 07:30 AM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
20,383 posts, read 10,577,532 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PassTheChocolate View Post
Why do you resort to personal attacks when the narrative doesn't align with yours?

The difference is this is not a doctor/patient relationship. The difference is they were both drunk. Yet, somehow, alcohol renders her unable to consent and not responsible for her actions while making him completely sober and responsible, not just for his actions but for her safety.

You also have to establish intent for rape. You have to establish that HE was able to discern HER level of inebriation. No one actually has. He was only a few points behind her on the BAL, and that was AFTER he was arrested and tested. That means he was MORE drunk when they met and ended up on the ground next to an OPEN BASKETBALL COURT.

It's unfortunate that you don't know the difference between saying someone deserved to be rape and saying it wasn't rape. Not being raped is a GOOD thing. But the idea that she wasn't really upsets some of you. Bizarro.
She is responsible for her action, which was getting drunk and passing out. That action didn't hurt another person.
He is responsible for his actions, which were getting drunk, and digitally penetrating a woman who was passed out. His action harmed another person.
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Old Today, 07:40 AM
 
10,893 posts, read 4,415,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
She is responsible for her action, which was getting drunk and passing out. That action didn't hurt another person.
He is responsible for his actions, which were getting drunk, and digitally penetrating a woman who was passed out. His action harmed another person.
It's more complicated than that.

I'm presuming she gave consent when she was conscious, and then passed out. Passing out can happen VERY quickly - in a matter of seconds - and wouldn't appear all that dramatic in the dark when a woman basically falls asleep on the ground during a sex act. She may have been asleep for 15 seconds, a half minute, whatever, and that wouldn't be all that noticeable to anyone until two strangers rode up on bikes and began shouting, and she didn't move. THAT would be noticeable, and unmistakable. That she was lying there, still, would not be that noticeable, especially to a man who was more than .17 BAL.

That's what's critical here.

Would he have known that she fell asleep after having given consent? I'd say, no. When you toss in the fact that he wasn't raping her, he was working on foreplay it seems quite obvious he didn't know.
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Old Today, 08:34 AM
 
Location: Central IL
15,341 posts, read 8,756,888 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by City Guy997S View Post
It was a weird case, the "rape" was fingers only and the sentence was a few months in jail, kicked out of school and sex offender for life.
The definition of rape is penetration - if you were penetrated with a broom handle how would you feel? I really wanna know.
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Old Today, 08:40 AM
 
8,016 posts, read 11,773,443 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
He wasn't having sex with her, is the thing. He was attempting to pleasure her. He wasn't pleasuring himself.

That's so key here, and it deserves a lot of focus. He wasn't doing something for his own pleasure, as in all your examples in this post.

Which would make it appear, IMHO, that he believed she was conscious.
Pleasuring himself? OMG. No. Thats a very warped idea
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Old Today, 08:45 AM
 
Location: Central IL
15,341 posts, read 8,756,888 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bondaroo View Post
It boggles me when people pull out this line. In situations like this one a drunk woman who passes out is not using being drunk as an excuse for raping someone. The woman just passes out. The man actively chooses to hurt another person. It's not a man drunk=woman drunk situation, it's apples and oranges - it's a "laying down and passing out" vs. "choosing to rape" situation.

If a drunk man passes out and wakes up to a drunk woman sexually assaulting him, then he deserves the same consideration.
Exactly - the person doing the assaulting is the ACTIVE person and is actively choosing to act in a certain manner. The actor is the responsible party. If someone is passed out or passes out you don't do sexual stuff to them (male or female).
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Old Today, 08:51 AM
 
Location: Central IL
15,341 posts, read 8,756,888 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
The judge was very concerned for his future.

Registering as a sex offender for life, IMHO, should be reserved for people who violently grab strangers off the street, or rape children.

Murderers don't have to register for life. A man who tortures his girlfriend's small child to death doesn't have to serve as harsh a sentence as this.

This young man, who got very drunk - apparently .17ish, and was fingering a woman who had slightly less alcohol in her system who had fallen asleep during this little escapade, now has no life. It's like in Iran, when people are declared "nonpersons". Brock Turner is now a "non person" and can't live a normal life.

I do think future generations will judge us very, very harshly for this. Guys who are 20 years old with a 17 year old girlfriend, named sexual predators for life.

Couples like this who get dizzy drunk and engage in naughty behavior, and the man ends up paying for it with his entire future.

This is madness. This isn't like a predator who drugged her and waited for her to become ill, or a 30 year old man who watched a 14 year old drinking herself into confusion and then swept in to kidnap her.

This is a college guy, and a slightly older woman, behaving vulgarly in public. First drinking themselves into a stupor,
and then deciding to go back to his dorm when she stumbled and fell and they continued their groping on the ground.
And she just happened to fall asleep out of drunkeness where he was still awake.

At least, the public now has her name. And men can make a decision about whether they want to risk a relationship with her.

My guess? There will be no takers.

I remember when many laws were changed to lengthen mandatory sentences for rape and the reaction was that juries more often failed to convict - not because they thought the defendant was innocent but they thought the punishment was too severe so they were totally let off.

Perhaps this is what's happening with "the registry". I agree with the intent because people convicted of these kinds of crimes have been too quickly forgotten even though recidivism rates are very high. However, if they get off scott-free "just because" we don't want them to be branded for life (I'm actually fine with it) then let's come up with something else that is just as effective but doesn't stop justice from being done.

And ClaraC - no need to trot out that "stranger" rape is more valid than acquaintance rape - surely you can try to make a case without resorting to that! Seriously, not many rapes are committed by complete strangers because that's not how life works.
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Old Today, 08:53 AM
 
Location: Central IL
15,341 posts, read 8,756,888 times
Reputation: 36030
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
He wasn't having sex with her, is the thing. He was attempting to pleasure her. He wasn't pleasuring himself.

That's so key here, and it deserves a lot of focus. He wasn't doing something for his own pleasure, as in all your examples in this post.

Which would make it appear, IMHO, that he believed she was conscious.
Haha - that's an interesting interpretation I've not heard before - you should be a criminal lawyer! But just because an argument can be made doesn't mean it is even plausible, much less accepted unless the jury is full of idiots, so there's that.
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