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Old Yesterday, 11:23 AM
 
Location: NNJ
10,014 posts, read 5,580,751 times
Reputation: 10913

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Quote:
Originally Posted by KCZ View Post
Propylene glycol is a primary ingredient in anti-freeze and used in chemical manufacturing. In its infinite wisdom, the FDA has approved it for use in foods, cosmetics, and medications. It's used to prevent caking of dried foods like dry soup mixes, keeping foods like shredded coconut and marshmallows moist, and in flavorings in all kinds of foods from soda to ice cream. One extra drop of flavored PG in a quart of ice cream makes it inedible, and I won't even use it. It's thoroughly disgusting and needs to be banned from human ingestion.
There is a logic flaw here. An ingredient in a toxic product doesn't mean the ingredient itself is toxic. Clorox bleach is primarily made of water.. you know... the stuff we drink every day. Just because water is in Clorox doesn't immediately mean the ingredient, water, is toxic.

https://www.bestfoodfacts.org/is-pro...as-antifreeze/

The primary ingredient of most anti-freeze is Ethylene glycol which is indeed toxic.

The rest of the post is drama. However, I will protect your right to make decisions for yourself.. You should have the right to eat and consume (or not) whatever you wish. After all this is about properly informing the public and empowering them to make informed decisions; not to outlaw legislate things people do that others might object to.
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Old Yesterday, 11:29 AM
 
Location: NNJ
10,014 posts, read 5,580,751 times
Reputation: 10913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jowel View Post
Another issue that I don't think has been studied like traditional tobacco smoke is what effect the secondhand smoke from these things has on innocent bystanders. And like the OP was talking about they emit a pretty large cloud of "fog".
If it were a concern, it stage fog should also be banned. As OP says, they are essentially the same thing...

I do agree though, smokers (of any type) should be respectful to those around them and only smoke in acceptable locations... primary location being in their home or in designated areas. I do object to the government telling businesses how to run their business. A business should decide if it is in their best interest to determine if they will allow or not allow smoking on their private property. A while back, the owner of a cigar shop/smoking bar went out of business due to laws that prevented customers from smoking inside... a business that existed for over a decade... gone. His rights as a business owner trampled. He recently reopened but is officially a private club of sorts.. with a membership... he can't sell cigars, doesn't sell alcohol either, and cannot advertise.... all part of the membership and by word of mouth. He moved his cigar sales to a convenience store he owns in a neighboring town... so his customers stop over there beforehand.

Last edited by usayit; Yesterday at 11:38 AM..
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Old Yesterday, 11:31 AM
 
Location: NNJ
10,014 posts, read 5,580,751 times
Reputation: 10913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javacoffee View Post
It is odd to me, however, that flavors are banned while nicotine in any form goes on and on and on.
Its worse... they are not banning Tobacco flavored e-cigs... now think about that for a second... where are they trying to lead customers in the absence of e-cigs?
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Old Yesterday, 11:31 AM
 
1,008 posts, read 269,239 times
Reputation: 2278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrician4you View Post
Or you can just quit. I did. It takes a few days for the nicotine to come out of your system. After that itís all psychological. As a former smoker I can tell you that if you want to quit I mean really want to itís doable. Iíve gone through the ďI want to quitĒ stage but didnít really so the gum didnít work. When I actually wanted to quit I literally put out my cigarette gave my pack of smokes away and never touched it again. I never had the cravings. It was like turning off a switch. Itís been 15/16 years and I never felt the craving.
I donít care if people smoke. Just donít smoke in my house or my car. I donít enjoy the smell of cigarette smoke. When you smoke you really canít smell it. But now? The smell is horrible
Conversely, I have a couple of friends who smoked for 15 years and quit 20 years ago. They tell me they still get cravings from time to time.

So, maybe step off the holier-than-thou soapbox as we're all unique in mental makeup and how things effect us, eh?
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Old Yesterday, 11:32 AM
 
Location: NNJ
10,014 posts, read 5,580,751 times
Reputation: 10913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrician4you View Post
Or you can just quit. I did. It takes a few days for the nicotine to come out of your system. After that it’s all psychological. As a former smoker I can tell you that if you want to quit I mean really want to it’s doable. I’ve gone through the “I want to quit” stage but didn’t really so the gum didn’t work. When I actually wanted to quit I literally put out my cigarette gave my pack of smokes away and never touched it again. I never had the cravings. It was like turning off a switch. It’s been 15/16 years and I never felt the craving.
I don’t care if people smoke. Just don’t smoke in my house or my car. I don’t enjoy the smell of cigarette smoke. When you smoke you really can’t smell it. But now? The smell is horrible
Sure.. but in the end the issue is people have a right to make a choice of when and how to quit or change behavior. Glad you quit... but you can stop making it out as if you are better than others by doing so....
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Old Yesterday, 12:03 PM
 
86 posts, read 16,593 times
Reputation: 82
Propylene glycol is not used in antifreeze--that's diethylene glycol. Propylene glycol is approved as a food additive and it's still considered neurotoxic.

If actors were lying in propylene glycol stage fog for hours a day, there might be a hazardous workplace complaint. Propylene glycol vaping fog is routed directly into the lungs in greater concentrations per unit volume.

As more information is being collected on this, it turns out there is a history of lung illness that goes back several years that is anecdotally attributable to coincident vaping that predates the recent collective recognition of the problem.
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Old Yesterday, 12:07 PM
 
Location: NNJ
10,014 posts, read 5,580,751 times
Reputation: 10913
Quote:
Originally Posted by eastriver View Post
Propylene glycol is not used in antifreeze--that's diethylene glycol. Propylene glycol is approved as a food additive and it's still considered neurotoxic.

If actors were lying in propylene glycol stage fog for hours a day, there might be a hazardous workplace complaint. Propylene glycol vaping fog is routed directly into the lungs in greater concentrations per unit volume.

As more information is being collected on this, it turns out there is a history of lung illness that goes back several years that is anecdotally attributable to coincident vaping that predates the recent collective recognition of the problem.
Does PG's side effects as a neurotoxin match up with the symptoms of the reported lung illnesses? Doesn't sound as convincing to me than the other argument that VG is resulting in fatty build up in the lungs....
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Old Yesterday, 12:21 PM
Status: "Make Orwell fiction again" (set 1 day ago)
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
31,769 posts, read 14,154,679 times
Reputation: 22749
Quote:
Originally Posted by eastriver View Post
Propylene glycol is not used in antifreeze--that's diethylene glycol. Propylene glycol is approved as a food additive and it's still considered neurotoxic.

If actors were lying in propylene glycol stage fog for hours a day, there might be a hazardous workplace complaint. Propylene glycol vaping fog is routed directly into the lungs in greater concentrations per unit volume.

As more information is being collected on this, it turns out there is a history of lung illness that goes back several years that is anecdotally attributable to coincident vaping that predates the recent collective recognition of the problem.
huh? Propylene glycol has been used in asthma inhalers and nebulizers for over 50 years, are you sure you're not confusing it with Ethylene glycol?
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Old Yesterday, 12:28 PM
Status: "Make Orwell fiction again" (set 1 day ago)
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
31,769 posts, read 14,154,679 times
Reputation: 22749
Quote:
Originally Posted by eastriver View Post
Over 500 pulmonary injuries on record right now that are serious enough to land people onto vents in the ICU.

It happens suddenly. They're saying all of a sudden from out of nowhere the chest of a vaper tightens and every breath becomes a struggle. Lung biopsies reveal alveolar tissue coated with what appears, as some doctors have described, to be "bacon grease," and what others describe as "hardened e-liquid oil."

Aside from the oily substances, and fatty deposits known as lipoid (it means fats) pneumonia, glycols are solvents. Lungs weren't designed to breathe propylene glycol, nor glycerin. (Propylene glycol is also a neurotoxin.) Lungs were designed to breathe air.
Vegetable glycol does not contain lipids and can't metabolize into lipids. Oil does that, i.e. mineral oil, vitamin d oil, but not PG or VG it's chemically impossible for either to leave fatty deposits.
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Old Yesterday, 12:37 PM
 
Location: southern kansas
8,627 posts, read 6,025,274 times
Reputation: 19408
Quote:
Originally Posted by djsuperfly View Post
Conversely, I have a couple of friends who smoked for 15 years and quit 20 years ago. They tell me they still get cravings from time to time.

So, maybe step off the holier-than-thou soapbox as we're all unique in mental makeup and how things effect us, eh?
I agree. I smoked for over 50 years, and I quit 3 years ago the hard way. But I go out of my way not to preach to others about their habit. I have nothing to brag about, because I should have done it long ago. In the end I quit because I had to if I wanted better my chances to keep on living. As another poster said, you have to want to quit and make that commitment totally. Everyone is different, and what works for one person may not for the next. Being judgmental & lecturing is not the way to get people to quit.
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