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Old Yesterday, 03:34 PM
 
21,727 posts, read 17,200,322 times
Reputation: 40490

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TenderFrost View Post
Why not ? If it's proven beyond any reasonable doubt that he executed mass murder, why should he still have any rights whatsoever ?


Of course, for the purpose of effectiveness of the experiments, it's critical there's a 24/7 medical help available to him so he actually doesn't just kick the bucket.




If, for military purposes, it's fine and legal to torture - then how come we draw the line and say - "it's a Good Boy, he's merely a mass murderer" ?


Note that I'm not talking about intentional physical torture here, merely investigating new interrogation techniques based on his psychological profile. I'm sure military has a lot of ideas here, but those experiments would definitely help with mapping the brain under FMRI, too.
If you’re going to say that, why is it important to stick to the constitution for anything? Let’s take away gun rights, let’s take away voting rights, let’s take away free speech. Once you start saying it’s OK to make exceptions to our democratic system, you might as well just put up the sickle flag right now.

The founding fathers knew very well there were evil people on the earth. There were evil people back then too. They very deliberately created a justice system for our country that is humane even when the crimes committed were not, one that was based on things other than vengeance. Boggles my mind when people who would otherwise consider themselves patriotic Americans say things like “no Miranda rights for him”. If you say something like that you really don’t love our country at all.
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Old Yesterday, 04:00 PM
 
Location: British Columbia ☀️ ♥ 🍁 ♥ ☀️
7,730 posts, read 6,856,590 times
Reputation: 15423
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
Lack of romance, but more typically just not fitting into society (article said he has Aspergers) . And then you combine that with Internet forums that encourage and egg on this rage and tell them that they have every reason to be full of rage, and before you know it you’ve created monsters out to get revenge.

In the article, he went on and on explaining how he would go to parties and try to flirt with girls and they didn’t want anything to do with him even though he was a perfect gentleman, and chose the muscular guys who I guess he assumed we’re not gentlemen just because... Without any understanding that he’s not compatible with a cheerleader types he was going after and has nothing in common with them socially. I think all of these incels could’ve had girlfriends if they were willing to settle for girls that were gettable for them, but it seems they all aspire to the beautiful, popular ones. And then rage at society because they can’t have them. My guess is he was just as unpopular with the guys as the girls.

I agree with everything that you've been saying except for one thing, about how incels could have girlfriends if they were willing to settle for women who they consider to be less than or not meeting their standards of what the incels call Traceys. No, they cannot get other girls, even if they're willing to settle for "less" (by their standards) because most women recognize them for what they are.

The biggest problem of all with incels, regardless of their weak characters, weak minds, mental illnesses (being an incel IS a mental illness) is that they truly believe and are encouraged by other incels to believe that sex is owed to them. They believe that it's their god given right and that all women are just sex objects who were put on earth strictly for their pleasure and that they should have a right to own women as things to be used for sex. Women aren't people to incels, they are just things to be owned.

Sounds familiar, from the not too distant past, doesn't it?

Their objectives are Traceys because those girls' beauty is more of a sexual turn on for them, but in today's western society no intelligent woman in her right mind and with any self respect, whether she's a beautiful Tracey or not, is going to lower herself and her hard-won standards and subject herself to any man with that kind of antiquated, barbaric, misogynistic attitude that makes him no better than a wild animal in rut looking for a female animal in heat.

It wouldn't be hard for most women in today's society to be able to recognize an incel for what he is, for his weird mental illness or mental disability and for his attitude and belief system about sex and women being the "right" of incels to have.

Soooo ...... incels can't get girlfriends of any kind. Incels can't get women for themselves, they can't get sex with women unless they visit prostitutes and pay for something that they believe they should have a "right" to for free, and they hate women because it's all the women's faults for not acceding to their wishes.

.
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Old Yesterday, 04:06 PM
 
Location: California
30,950 posts, read 33,928,791 times
Reputation: 26448
"incel" is not a word that should be used the way everyone is using it. It actually makes light of serious issues that people can't wrap their head around and leads to all sorts of incorrect thinking.
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Old Yesterday, 04:11 PM
 
Location: in my mind
4,791 posts, read 6,674,387 times
Reputation: 9618
For those interested in a deeper exploration of the topic, there is a podcast about the incel community. You can listen via podcast app, search for title "incel" - or listen directly through this link: https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/pod...the-past/incel
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Old Yesterday, 04:18 PM
 
21,727 posts, read 17,200,322 times
Reputation: 40490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
I agree with everything that you've been saying except for one thing, about how incels could have girlfriends if they were willing to settle for women who they consider to be less than or not meeting their standards of what the incels call Traceys. No, they cannot get other girls, even if they're willing to settle for "less" (by their standards) because most women recognize them for what they are.

The biggest problem of all with incels, regardless of their weak characters, weak minds, mental illnesses (being an incel IS a mental illness) is that they truly believe and are encouraged by other incels to believe that sex is owed to them. They believe that it's their god given right and that all women are just sex objects who were put on earth strictly for their pleasure and that they should have a right to own women as things to be used for sex. Women aren't people to incels, they are just things to be owned.

Sounds familiar, from the not too distant past, doesn't it?

Their objectives are Traceys because those girls' beauty is more of a sexual turn on for them, but in today's western society no intelligent woman in her right mind and with any self respect, whether she's a beautiful Tracey or not, is going to lower herself and her hard-won standards and subject herself to any man with that kind of antiquated, barbaric, misogynistic attitude that makes him no better than a wild animal in rut looking for a female animal in heat.

It wouldn't be hard for most women in today's society to be able to recognize an incel for what he is, for his weird mental illness or mental disability and for his attitude and belief system about sex and women being the "right" of incels to have.

Soooo ...... incels can't get girlfriends of any kind. Incels can't get women for themselves, they can't get sex with women unless they visit prostitutes and pay for something that they believe they should have a "right" to for free, and they hate women because it's all the women's faults for not acceding to their wishes.

.
I’m talking about when he was in high school and actively trying to date one of those girls. I don’t know that he was an angry misogynist then or his red pill forums turned him into that.

I used to lurk on a men’s forum for so called “Nice Guys” (I say so called because they really weren’t nice at all). Even when a man would join the forum and say my behaviors have damaged my relationship and I want to improve myself as a person and fix my marriage, the men with all gang up on that person and tell him it’s all her fault He’s an idiot if he can’t see how he’s being used and manipulated. The guy would argue no I’ve done this and that and this terrible thing, but the guys would dismiss it. They wouldn’t my opinion bully the guy until he came around to their side or left the forum. And this was supposed to be a self-help forum!

So then you take a guy with a social communication disorder like aspergers, and he is even easier to get to drink the Kool-Aid then a guy without those problems. It is easy to add fuel to the fire until the guy is an explosion waiting to happen.
There’s no reason to think that at 14, 15, 16 years old he was already that angry.

We had a poster here who has Aspergers and he had a gf, but she had special needs too. Amy Schumer married a man who has aspergers. If that man had held out for Jennifer Lawrence, he’d probably be an Incel too.

Even I knew where my league was in high school. For instance I would never have tried to date the captain of the football team, because I know that person is not going to wanna date me because he has many more beautiful girls to pick from. And also we would not have that much in common because I’m not that social or popular. But these guys for whatever reason judge the pretty, popular girls as shallow for rejecting them in favor of equally good looking and popular guys, while they are just a shallow for insisting only on a girl that looks like that and rejecting the ones they actually might be compatible with.

But I think that’s going on forever. When I was in junior high and high school, I remember Geeky, quiet guys silently pining over one of the most beautiful girls in school for the entire four years of our high school education. Go throughout high school never having a girlfriend because they had a crush on the head cheerleader. Go throughout high school never having a girlfriend because they had a crush on the head cheerleader. But they did not attack people over it. And I think the difference today is the Internet and these red pill forums.

Last edited by ocnjgirl; Yesterday at 04:31 PM..
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Old Yesterday, 04:40 PM
 
Location: Riding a rock floating through space
2,238 posts, read 673,940 times
Reputation: 5699
Lots of young people don't have sex, I guess this word "incels" is to describe those who are angry as hell about it? Anyway, mowing down a bunch of random people, none of which fit the profile of a young attractive woman who has rejected this freak doesn't seem to me to make one bit of sense. To me, he's nothing more than an evil scumbag who should be strapped to a rocket and shot into space. Wgaf why he did this anyway? there is nothing to even waste time pondering, the why.
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Old Yesterday, 05:25 PM
 
Location: British Columbia ☀️ ♥ 🍁 ♥ ☀️
7,730 posts, read 6,856,590 times
Reputation: 15423
Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
Lots of young people don't have sex, I guess this word "incels" is to describe those who are angry as hell about it? Anyway, mowing down a bunch of random people, none of which fit the profile of a young attractive woman who has rejected this freak doesn't seem to me to make one bit of sense. To me, he's nothing more than an evil scumbag who should be strapped to a rocket and shot into space. Wgaf why he did this anyway? there is nothing to even waste time pondering, the why.
Incel is short for 'involuntarily celibate'. And yes, they are angry about it.
.
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Old Yesterday, 05:28 PM
 
5,985 posts, read 2,455,375 times
Reputation: 6266
Damn. Is this actually becoming a thing?

Maybe I'm behind the times or live in a small world but how in the hell did this ever become a trend? I don't know any "Incels", it's never been an issue for me. I can't think of one person i have known or known of that this can be applied too. I know one guy who has slept with one woman his entire life (religious, 6 kids) and is in his early 60s and they've been married for 45 years or so. I have worked with a guy who according to the ladies is "A" sexual much to a couple of them who find it totally frustrating as he is a very desirable specimen. There are different people out there.

Incels?? Are we sure this isn't just a label we're putting in a run of the mill nut case? Because it's trendy or something?
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Old Yesterday, 05:29 PM
 
Location: Southwest Washington State
22,931 posts, read 15,000,487 times
Reputation: 32969
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenderFrost View Post
Why not ? If it's proven beyond any reasonable doubt that he executed mass murder, why should he still have any rights whatsoever ?


Of course, for the purpose of effectiveness of the experiments, it's critical there's a 24/7 medical help available to him so he actually doesn't just kick the bucket.




If, for military purposes, it's fine and legal to torture - then how come we draw the line and say - "it's a Good Boy, he's merely a mass murderer" ?


Note that I'm not talking about intentional physical torture here, merely investigating new interrogation techniques based on his psychological profile. I'm sure military has a lot of ideas here, but those experiments would definitely help with mapping the brain under FMRI, too.
Because he is a fellow human being! Once you decide it is OK to torture a really bad person, you probably will feel empowered to torture someone who you disagree with. We are supposed to have evolved beyond tribal vengeance. Our justice system is supposed to aim for justice.

I would not object to capital punishment in this case. I have no idea about Canada’s justice system. But it seems to me that death in this case would be just.
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Old Yesterday, 05:34 PM
 
5,985 posts, read 2,455,375 times
Reputation: 6266
Nevermind.

Last edited by Scrat335; Yesterday at 05:57 PM..
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