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Old 10-06-2019, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Riding a rock floating through space
2,276 posts, read 691,122 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallysmom View Post
You’re being pedantic.

When someone commits suicide, it affects everyone in their lives. Trust me. There is a thing called survivors guilt, where are you spend a great deal of your time thinking if only I had done whatever, maybe this person wouldn’t have killed herself.

Also being a widow I am considered “his survivor” since I survived him — it’s a common usage of the word survivor.
People need to get over themselves and stop believing they can "save" everybody from whatever. Just because someone close to them commits suicide, doesn't mean it's a reflection on them. It's typically a personal decision that has nothing to do with those around them, but the egos of those around them cause all kinds of havoc. Why can't so many people understand such a simple concept?
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Old 10-06-2019, 09:52 PM
 
12,121 posts, read 20,709,705 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
People need to get over themselves and stop believing they can "save" everybody from whatever. Just because someone close to them commits suicide, doesn't mean it's a reflection on them. It's typically a personal decision that has nothing to do with those around them, but the egos of those around them cause all kinds of havoc. Why can't so many people understand such a simple concept?
But it still affects everyone. Itís not ego driven, itís grief driven. Itís a natural part of grief.

I got why my friend committed suicide. I read the note. It was clear.

I still felt guilt that maybe if I saw what was going on, a 26 year old wouldnít have eaten a gun because she was embarrassed and afraid. Thatís grief. And then I got angry because of what she did. Thatís grief.

Itís all very normal, whether you like it or not. We, the people left behind, were the ones who had to clean up her mess. We were the ones who had to face the customers who were reading in the newspapers about a huge embezzlement at the bank. We were the ones getting grilled by the FBI to see if anyone else was involved. There was a lot of anger, there was a lot of sadness, there was a lot of tears...there was a lot of grief. All normal.

If something like happens in your life and you DONíT react this way, please seek help. Because that ainít normal.
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Old 10-06-2019, 10:32 PM
 
Location: Toronto
1,733 posts, read 1,682,851 times
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I know the Skywalk is in another place, but close enough.

I remember on the tourist information centre, they had a couple MISSING posters on one of the walls.

I'm not sure why. I think it's pretty clear....

I'm actually surprised more people don't fall. The view is great and an amazing walk around but the people dangling over the edges for pictures had my palms sweating. One loose rock...
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:06 AM
 
Location: California
1,816 posts, read 532,419 times
Reputation: 3432
Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie53 View Post
Yes, it is sad.

The thing is, in cases of horrific illnesses that entail much suffering before the release of death, which is worse?.......watching a loved one suffering and dying slowly or watching them being euthanized peacefully, painlessly?

Either way, the survivors are going to suffer dealing with the death.

My father suffered a skull fracture in WWII, much like football players, this caused Alzheimer-like deterioration when he became elderly. {His identical twin brother lived to 91 without suffering dementia, my father died at 81.}

The last few months of his life were horrific, he was like a rabid animal, hitting and biting {he still had most of his teeth} anyone who came near him. He could no longer talk, he was completely incontinent, ate with his hands. Keeping him heavily drugged was the only way they could deal with him.

To this day I regret that I couldn't have him euthanized at that point. With every fiber of my being I KNOW that is what he would have wanted. A once proud man reduced to a snarling animal. It breaks my heart and I am thankful that my mother died years earlier and didn't have to witness what happened to him.
Yes that would be horrible, that poor man.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:12 AM
 
Location: California
1,816 posts, read 532,419 times
Reputation: 3432
Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
Family members and friends of someone who kills themselves are not "survivors." Where did this term come from to apply here? what have they survived? The connotation of using this word in this context puts an unfair responsibility on each individual to stay alive for the benefit of others. While I think parents have such a responsibility to minor children, in all other situations when someone wants out of this life it's ok. They weren't given any say in being born so it's fair play.
There are so many things wrong with the way society views suicide, and this is a perfect example.
The term survivor is used in most obituaries. So and so is survived by ..... However in the term of suicide the remaining family or friends are still survivors to that persons life and their untimely death. Even a natural death affects people but when itís suicide it does carry over to family as they wonder often what they missed or if they couldíve done more. Itís one thing when 85 year old Grandpa dies in his sleep . Itís quite another when your nineteen year old son blows his brains out. There is a difference.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:18 AM
 
Location: California
1,816 posts, read 532,419 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallysmom View Post
But it still affects everyone. Itís not ego driven, itís grief driven. Itís a natural part of grief.

I got why my friend committed suicide. I read the note. It was clear.

I still felt guilt that maybe if I saw what was going on, a 26 year old wouldnít have eaten a gun because she was embarrassed and afraid. Thatís grief. And then I got angry because of what she did. Thatís grief.

Itís all very normal, whether you like it or not. We, the people left behind, were the ones who had to clean up her mess. We were the ones who had to face the customers who were reading in the newspapers about a huge embezzlement at the bank. We were the ones getting grilled by the FBI to see if anyone else was involved. There was a lot of anger, there was a lot of sadness, there was a lot of tears...there was a lot of grief. All normal.

If something like happens in your life and you DONíT react this way, please seek help. Because that ainít normal.
Exactly, itís a mess in more ways than one. The grief can linger for years. Perhaps one day thereíll be more places to assist with suicide if thatís what someone wants to do.
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Old 10-07-2019, 07:32 AM
 
Location: SW Florida
11,178 posts, read 5,236,884 times
Reputation: 23250
Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
Family members and friends of someone who kills themselves are not "survivors." Where did this term come from to apply here? what have they survived? The connotation of using this word in this context puts an unfair responsibility on each individual to stay alive for the benefit of others. While I think parents have such a responsibility to minor children, in all other situations when someone wants out of this life it's ok. They weren't given any say in being born so it's fair play.
There are so many things wrong with the way society views suicide, and this is a perfect example.
Exactly - what about those who are just tired of living but are healthy and not suffering from mental illness. If abortion is legal because it's the woman's body with no thought given to the life inside of her, then why can't people opt out of this life? It's their body no? Seems hypocritical to me.
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Old 10-07-2019, 08:53 AM
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
57,853 posts, read 56,055,728 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
It all depends, that's the problem with a suicide method like this. Some die pretty quick, some suffer terrible injuries and drown - the autopsies prove this because some have water in the lungs. There's no guarantee things will go swimmingly (pun intended). I never have to worry about it because there's no way I'd ever muster the courage to jump from any height, just the thought of it makes me dizzy. I can't see myself even being able to jump like those on the twin towers did to avoid burning to death - it's just too terrifying a thought for me to jump from a height and splat on the ground. Jumping into water is even scarrier to me because surviving the fall is too likely then you will die in agony.
I worked in the WTC and was inside on 9/11. I got out relatively early--I was in One and got outside right after Two was hit.

I worked on various floors--72 at the time of the attacks (but was down on 43 when the plane hit), but 82 the previous year. I used to sometimes stand on the HVAC vents that ran around the perimeter of the floors just below the windows and look straight down to scare myself. You don't know how many times since that day I've thought about the jumpers standing at that edge and having to make that decision. Watching them jump from below, knowing that they were as alive as I was but would be dead in a few seconds in my worst memory of the day.

At least their deaths were instant. Upon impact, their bodies were reduced to, as a coworker put it, "ketchup stains with clothing", so the destruction of the brain and central nervous system could not have had time to register any pain.

I have read stories about people who survived jumps from bridges. Most of them had broken bones at the very least and usually internal injuries as well.

The George Washington Bridge that connects Fort Lee, NJ, to Manhattan is a popular suicide bridge. One of the worst horror stories I ever read was that of someone who apparently jumped but got caught in some of the steel structure beneath the bridge and apparently survived the fall but couldn't free himself and died of exposure. They estimated he had died about two months before they found the body.

Another time I was at a barbecue in a park just north of the bridge. A cop showed up and said someone witnessed a jumper and asked if anyone saw anything. We were eating, drinking, had a DJ, etc. This poor soul had to have seen everyone having a grand old time before he jumped, and no one even noticed. Very sad.
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Old 10-07-2019, 12:00 PM
 
Location: Riding a rock floating through space
2,276 posts, read 691,122 times
Reputation: 5806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post

The George Washington Bridge that connects Fort Lee, NJ, to Manhattan is a popular suicide bridge. One of the worst horror stories I ever read was that of someone who apparently jumped but got caught in some of the steel structure beneath the bridge and apparently survived the fall but couldn't free himself and died of exposure. They estimated he had died about two months before they found the body.
That sounds like an absolutely horrific way to die. Pretty close to the worst way I can imagine, which would be to be buried in rubble from a collapsed building unable to move, but have to wait to die of thirst over several days.
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Old 10-07-2019, 06:24 PM
 
Location: California
1,816 posts, read 532,419 times
Reputation: 3432
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
I worked in the WTC and was inside on 9/11. I got out relatively early--I was in One and got outside right after Two was hit.

I worked on various floors--72 at the time of the attacks (but was down on 43 when the plane hit), but 82 the previous year. I used to sometimes stand on the HVAC vents that ran around the perimeter of the floors just below the windows and look straight down to scare myself. You don't know how many times since that day I've thought about the jumpers standing at that edge and having to make that decision. Watching them jump from below, knowing that they were as alive as I was but would be dead in a few seconds in my worst memory of the day.

At least their deaths were instant. Upon impact, their bodies were reduced to, as a coworker put it, "ketchup stains with clothing", so the destruction of the brain and central nervous system could not have had time to register any pain.

I have read stories about people who survived jumps from bridges. Most of them had broken bones at the very least and usually internal injuries as well.

The George Washington Bridge that connects Fort Lee, NJ, to Manhattan is a popular suicide bridge. One of the worst horror stories I ever read was that of someone who apparently jumped but got caught in some of the steel structure beneath the bridge and apparently survived the fall but couldn't free himself and died of exposure. They estimated he had died about two months before they found the body.

Another time I was at a barbecue in a park just north of the bridge. A cop showed up and said someone witnessed a jumper and asked if anyone saw anything. We were eating, drinking, had a DJ, etc. This poor soul had to have seen everyone having a grand old time before he jumped, and no one even noticed. Very sad.
Glad you got out. How awful for you and all involved. Iíve often thought of those jumpers and I can see why they jumped. As for the bridge thatís gruesome. If someone botches it they can end up suffering more than they ever have.
My grandfather botched it and ended up surviving in total agony for almost 3 weeks in the hospital u til he finally succumbed. Because the cause was suicide at the time his health insurance wouldnít pay the bill, and my grandma didnít get any life insurance. It was a mess.
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