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You must have attended UNT a long time ago because the administration is not pro-student. The roads are terrible, the traffic is terrible, and the campus can get crowded. It isn't too friendly because people gather in massive cliques of their own race or color and then segregate. The culture is shallow and at times anti-intellectual.
Professors in general are very good.
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Originally Posted by ocean2026
I received an MPA from UNT and I really liked it, so no problem with that -friendly campus and an administration that was pro-student.
One thing you're forgetting ACE is the difference in faculty and facilities that a place like Berkeley offers. I was interested in law and Earl Warren was teaching there after he retired from the US Supreme Court. He had graduated from Cal and came back in old age. Some in Texas might not like it but his Brown v Board of Education decision probably had more effect on our society than anything any other person did this century. Warren worked hard to get a 7-0 decision. My undergraduate was psych and I got to see Festinger - Maslach who did the famous experiments involving peer pressure to get people to actually electrically shock people. Cal has 17 specialized libraries on campus, and the Livermore National Science Library with its colored lights eminating into the street - was surreal.
Perhaps you are correct - for the average student - it doesn't matter where one goes to school. For the exceptional student its different. Another difference is the fascinating student body at Cal. The guy I used hang out with at Sproul between classes was a prince of Saudi Arabia and eventually assassinated King Faisal who ruled for many years. another although I only met him maybe once was in the run-off for President of Costa Rica when I was there. My roomate's dad was Cal Democratic Chairman and we got to go to DC, for the summer. Finally the semester after I left Patty Hearst was abducted and I remember looking at her grade slip ( duh I should have known -all incompletes).
Of the three Dallas area schools I think UNT has the nicest campus, the most authentic college feel and in most areas the best programs.
Well, thanks for your compliments about the UNT campus... I also think it's particularly savory as a college environment.
The real question and the real issue.. is the teaching going to be better at one place or another. The presence of exceptional people says nothing about the quality of the teaching.
Ace i was about to disagree with you on the comment that" exceptional professors mean nothing about the quality of teaching" and use the example of preferring to ask Earl Warren what went on behind the scenes at the US Supreme Court when he taught at Cal as opposed to asking some average professor who may have just read about.. but it seems from ARTSYGUY's response to you about UNT that there just isn't any topic concerning this area where we can all come to an agreement. Let me try one more time to find common ground - Is it fair to say of GW Bush moving to the area that "there goes the neighborhood!" ? lol I am outta this thread!
^ we can agree that UNT has really good professors. All the professors loved their field of study and practice. Some professors are rude and selfish but hey nothing is perfect.
Ace i was about to disagree with you on the comment that" exceptional professors mean nothing about the quality of teaching" and use the example of preferring to ask Earl Warren what went on behind the scenes at the US Supreme Court when he taught at Cal as opposed to asking some average professor who may have just read about..
Whatever Earl Warren may have done, that does not qualify him as an instructor. What matters to a potential student is how facile the teacher is at supervising a course of study and bringing a student to an understanding of a conventional subject... this is a very separate profession and has nothing to do with someone's life experience.
I might be interested in listening to a prominent individual deliver a lecture on his experiences, but if I want to develop a marketable skill, I want the assistance of a professional teacher. Yes, I might be in the company of one of the world's experts in Superstring Theory, but I'm not trying to understand Superstring Theory, I'm just trying to master basic Physics.
Yes, there are people who, by virtue of chance or God or whatever else you ascribe it to, have developed an exceptional expertise on a subject. In most cases, they are unaware of exactly how they did it, and cannot impart the technique to others. Einstein was not qualified to train others to be Einsteins, for example, at least not routinely and systematically. Instead, he was given an office at the Institute for Advances Study near Princeton and told to just come up with the next earthshaking discovery.
As far as I'm concerned, a "good" college is one that best suits my needs, not one that specializes in an extreme segment of the population.
You must have attended UNT a long time ago because the administration is not pro-student. The roads are terrible, the traffic is terrible, and the campus can get crowded. It isn't too friendly because people gather in massive cliques of their own race or color and then segregate. The culture is shallow and at times anti-intellectual.
Professors in general are very good.
I graduated from UNT last year and never experienced anything you are talking about. If a very small minority of students congregate with others of their race(white,black, asian, hispanic, whatever) then it is not something unique to UNT. Overall it is a very diverse and liberal University where people of all races and nationalities mix and mingle easily.
The roads are fine except for those under some sort of construction. That is unavoidable usually they were paved and opened within a few weeks. None of my classes were ever overcrowded and the people are anything but anti-intellectual.
You are telling me you did not see the massive amounts of Asians all hanging out together in mass in front of their dorm? Or the massive amounts of black people all congregating in mass in certain dorms? Am I missing something?
What was your major? How long were you there? Did you stay in dorms?
Or were you part of a frat? Because frat people all congregate together and support each other very well....better than family.
I was there ALONE with no frat buddies to back me up ever and people were really shallow and at times extremely unfriendly and strange. That was not the minority but the majority.
True it is one of the most liberal universities but that doesn't mean the people were of quality. Everybody already had too busy of a schedule to make new friends. That is why it was extremely rough for me to make new friends. Not to mention the judgment.
If you are straight and white. Then you have no idea what I'm talking about.
I didn't say the classes were overcrowded. I said the campus can get overcrowded with people and traffic.
Sure some of the students were extremely intellectual even more so than some of the top tier universities I've been too; however, that didn't make up for lack of social grace and high culture.
I liked the professors. Some of them were amazing.
Tell me about your perfect and blissful experience please.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambassador
I graduated from UNT last year and never experienced anything you are talking about. If a very small minority of students congregate with others of their race(white,black, asian, hispanic, whatever) then it is not something unique to UNT. Overall it is a very diverse and liberal University where people of all races and nationalities mix and mingle easily.
The roads are fine except for those under some sort of construction. That is unavoidable usually they were paved and opened within a few weeks. None of my classes were ever overcrowded and the people are anything but anti-intellectual.
You are telling me you did not see the massive amounts of Asians all hanging out together in mass in front of their dorm? Or the massive amounts of black people all congregating in mass in certain dorms? Am I missing something?
What was your major? How long were you there? Did you stay in dorms?
Or were you part of a frat? Because frat people all congregate together and support each other very well....better than family.
I was there ALONE with no frat buddies to back me up ever and people were really shallow and at times extremely unfriendly and strange. That was not the minority but the majority.
True it is one of the most liberal universities but that doesn't mean the people were of quality. Everybody already had too busy of a schedule to make new friends. That is why it was extremely rough for me to make new friends. Not to mention the judgment.
If you are straight and white. Then you have no idea what I'm talking about.
I didn't say the classes were overcrowded. I said the campus can get overcrowded with people and traffic.
Sure some of the students were extremely intellectual even more so than some of the top tier universities I've been too; however, that didn't make up for lack of social grace and high culture.
I liked the professors. Some of them were amazing.
Tell me about your perfect and blissful experience please.
I didn't live in a dorm or join a fraternity. In fact I never joined one social club or organization. My major was Political Science.
I made many friends while there...all from my various classes. Others from the local hangouts. My friends consisted of people of various races, even nationalities. And I have no problem with gays. In fact I was always the one defending them against the typical Texas conservative...you know what I mean. So if I ran into you I would have treated you very nicely. So would every single friend of mine.
Sorry you had a bad experience. But please realize that what happened or didn't happen to you is not the norm for UNT. I actually found the University to have no cliques of any kind. Keep in mind that a large group of friends hanging out together does not constitute a clique.
If you consider taking 15 to 18 credit hours every semester while flight instructing full time a "perfect and blissful" experience then please inform me of your drug dealer because he is really good.
My time at UNT was a busy and fast paced one. In the process I learned more than I ever did before in my life, made lifelong friends including with some of my professors, and had an all around great experience.
How are you friends with your professors? Do you go out to eat with them, get invited to their social gatherings, and talk with them over the phone? I've NEVER had a professor that ever wanted to be my friend. lol That sounds so rare and unusual. Do you come from an affluent background or affluent family?
A large group of friends is not a clique?? How so? What do you mean local hangouts? Denton doesn't really have any local hangouts except for about three popular bars.
I didn't major in political science. So I knew nobody in that major.
Did you think there were some negative judgments against gay and ethnic minorities there and was it pretty common place?
Also you sounded very busy during college? How did you manage to make so many great long term friends? What did you do with all those friends? When did you have time to spend quality time with your buddies?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambassador
I didn't live in a dorm or join a fraternity. In fact I never joined one social club or organization. My major was Political Science.
I made many friends while there...all from my various classes. Others from the local hangouts. My friends consisted of people of various races, even nationalities. And I have no problem with gays. In fact I was always the one defending them against the typical Texas conservative...you know what I mean. So if I ran into you I would have treated you very nicely. So would every single friend of mine.
Sorry you had a bad experience. But please realize that what happened or didn't happen to you is not the norm for UNT. I actually found the University to have no cliques of any kind. Keep in mind that a large group of friends hanging out together does not constitute a clique.
If you consider taking 15 to 18 credit hours every semester while flight instructing full time a "perfect and blissful" experience then please inform me of your drug dealer because he is really good.
My time at UNT was a busy and fast paced one. In the process I learned more than I ever did before in my life, made lifelong friends including with some of my professors, and had an all around great experience.
As a university UNT is not even close to being top tier though.
I thought the professors were great though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambassador
I haven't been keeping up with this thread and therefore have no idea what the current argument/debate is...BUT:
I graduated from the University of North Texas and can say without a doubt that it was a GREAT school. Many of the undergraduate and graduate programs are ranked number one or in the top three in the state and nation. Off the top of my head I know that UNT's Public Administration program is ranked number one in the state ahead of UT Austin, A&M, Tech, etc... Other programs are also highly ranked. The Univeristy is also the 4th largest in the state.
UNT has for the past 14 years been ranked as one of the nation's "Best Buys" meaning the best education for the most affordable price. So while there may be schools that are cheaper they are not as good educational wise. Just as there are other schools with comprable academics but with astronomical tuitions. UNT is one of the nation's best Universities for realistic tuition costs combined with great academics.
I could have attended any one of the metroplex's Universities including UTD, SMU, and TCU..in addition to schools like Texas Tech, Houston, and UT Austin. For a variety of reasons including academics, proximity to home, academic prestige, and number of PhD and nationally recognized professors I chose to attend UNT. I am very happy that I did.
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