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Old 07-03-2013, 12:39 PM
 
581 posts, read 921,209 times
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After reading this article here in the Dallas Business Journal-

Puckett: Why Dallas' office market is set for ?unprecedented? growth (Video) - Dallas Business Journal

-I am left to assume this means that every office building planned in the central Dallas area will most likely get built.

From memory, I can remember seven office buildings planned with two of them already being build to suit for clients.

It is interesting how spread out the office market has become in central Dallas, an area that once incorporated just downtown, with one office building planned in the Spire development east of downtown (390,000 square feet within 21 stories), two more planned in the Dallas Art's District by Hall (454,500 within 16 stories) and by Billingsley (I don't know), and another across the park in Uptown within the Crescent development (470,000 Square feet in 20 stories). To the west of these, a 'pencil highrise is planned within the Harwood development (140,000 square feet within 22 stories), right next to that in the Victory Park development is a fatter building (400,000 square feet within 25 stories), and, finally, another one is about to get under construction within the part of Uptown Dallas often referred to as CityPlace or the West Village area (250,000 square feet within 15 stories).

What is incredible about all this construction is how it is all happening outside of what is commonly thought of as the traditional downtown Dallas. Indeed, downtown Dallas continues shrinking as an office market, but it is quality shrinkage if there ever was such a thing as lots of development continues in the area.
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Old 07-03-2013, 01:44 PM
 
Location: plano
7,885 posts, read 11,352,959 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by binkyman View Post
After reading this article here in the Dallas Business Journal-

Puckett: Why Dallas' office market is set for ?unprecedented? growth (Video) - Dallas Business Journal

-I am left to assume this means that every office building planned in the central Dallas area will most likely get built.

From memory, I can remember seven office buildings planned with two of them already being build to suit for clients.

It is interesting how spread out the office market has become in central Dallas, an area that once incorporated just downtown, with one office building planned in the Spire development east of downtown (390,000 square feet within 21 stories), two more planned in the Dallas Art's District by Hall (454,500 within 16 stories) and by Billingsley (I don't know), and another across the park in Uptown within the Crescent development (470,000 Square feet in 20 stories). To the west of these, a 'pencil highrise is planned within the Harwood development (140,000 square feet within 22 stories), right next to that in the Victory Park development is a fatter building (400,000 square feet within 25 stories), and, finally, another one is about to get under construction within the part of Uptown Dallas often referred to as CityPlace or the West Village area (250,000 square feet within 15 stories).

What is incredible about all this construction is how it is all happening outside of what is commonly thought of as the traditional downtown Dallas. Indeed, downtown Dallas continues shrinking as an office market, but it is quality shrinkage if there ever was such a thing as lots of development continues in the area.
Dallas's historic pattern of growth to the N, E and W while not so much the south hurts DT. Missing 1/4 to 1/3 of the land mass near down town means longer commutes to jobs DT from the N, E and W. So offices move outward from the traditional DT center toward the residential growth radiants. This is one factor impacting DT among many. DT appeals to some workers as a location but not all, schools are one reason for the push further out as well I suppose traditional flight to the sururb factors by some..

A pencil high rise? I had not heard that term but assume it means a smaller base floor size for a building which drives up the cost of construction. It is not by accident that traditional high rises tend to be 20-25k sf base plates.

Nice post topic!
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Old 07-03-2013, 02:06 PM
 
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There's really something happening in every quadrant of downtown. SE - Farmer's Market renovation and new townhome and apartments, SW - new hotel and construction plus plans by Woodbine on the old Reunion site/streetcar to Oak Cliff/new I-30 bridge, NW - Victory Park and West End coming back, NE - Arts District/Hall/Spire/Two Arts etc...and now that's starting to spread up Ross Ave into East Dallas...
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Old 07-03-2013, 04:30 PM
 
Location: plano
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When driving South on I45 compared to driving North on NDT or US75, the city center development is much sparse south vs north. The commute to DT is not just within a few miles of DT for jobs to pop in that location IMHO
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Old 07-03-2013, 04:32 PM
 
19,576 posts, read 17,852,956 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnhw2 View Post
Dallas's historic pattern of growth to the N, E and W while not so much the south hurts DT. Missing 1/4 to 1/3 of the land mass near down town means longer commutes to jobs DT from the N, E and W. So offices move outward from the traditional DT center toward the residential growth radiants. This is one factor impacting DT among many. DT appeals to some workers as a location but not all, schools are one reason for the push further out as well I suppose traditional flight to the sururb factors by some..

A pencil high rise? I had not heard that term but assume it means a smaller base floor size for a building which drives up the cost of construction. It is not by accident that traditional high rises tend to be 20-25k sf base plates.

Nice post topic!
Unless you can convince the Army Corps to allow office towers in The Trinity Basin.....why would anyone build nice office space in quantity just south of The Trinity?
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Old 07-03-2013, 04:57 PM
 
Location: plano
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Originally Posted by EDS_ View Post
Unless you can convince the Army Corps to allow office towers in The Trinity Basin.....why would anyone build nice office space in quantity just south of The Trinity?
I did not realize that flood way or that basin? Is that why there are no office parks of significance as I drive south of DT?
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:37 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Johnhw2 View Post
I did not realize that flood way or that basin? Is that why there are no office parks of significance as I drive south of DT?
Well the basin is flood plain for sure. I think the issue is the TRB is wide enough that it serves as a southern boundary to DTD - IIRC The Margret Hunt Hill bridge is almost 2,000ft. long. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but the bank building just west of "Dead Man's Curve" along 35 is maybe the only building south of DTD but close to DTD that is over 10 stories. The area just sin't ready for high rises. It's too poor, not safe enough, too much petty crime and there is just no need.
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:18 PM
 
Location: Dallas,Texas
6,652 posts, read 9,872,195 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EDS_ View Post
Well the basin is flood plain for sure. I think the issue is the TRB is wide enough that it serves as a southern boundary to DTD - IIRC The Margret Hunt Hill bridge is almost 2,000ft. long. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but the bank building just west of "Dead Man's Curve" along 35 is maybe the only building south of DTD but close to DTD that is over 10 stories. The area just sin't ready for high rises. It's too poor, not safe enough, too much petty crime and there is just no need.
Hey, all of Southern Dallas isn't poor or just downright dangerous. There's a lot of solid middle class neighborhoods in Southern Dallas. People tend to believe what they hear than to check it out themselves. Chicago's Southside and New Orleans Lower 9th Ward make Southern Dallas look like Highland Park. Yes, you are right the Bank of America Tower is the only building above 10 stories in this area.

This area tends to get a bad rap by people saying things that isn't true. This area is the best area geographically in the city. You don't see acres of trees and hills in North Dallas. Developers are starting to gain interest in this area and the City of Dallas know the only way to grow, is to grow south.
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Old 07-05-2013, 07:05 PM
 
581 posts, read 921,209 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnhw2 View Post
Dallas's historic pattern of growth to the N, E and W while not so much the south hurts DT. Missing 1/4 to 1/3 of the land mass near down town means longer commutes to jobs DT from the N, E and W. So offices move outward from the traditional DT center toward the residential growth radiants. This is one factor impacting DT among many. DT appeals to some workers as a location but not all, schools are one reason for the push further out as well I suppose traditional flight to the sururb factors by some..

A pencil high rise? I had not heard that term but assume it means a smaller base floor size for a building which drives up the cost of construction. It is not by accident that traditional high rises tend to be 20-25k sf base plates.

Nice post topic!
The pencil high rise is how Harwood referred to it.
In Dallas, because retail is king, the most important district isn't downtown, but it is the approximate 23 square miles within the area of Dallas Parkway (platinum office corridor) and Preston Road (golden retail corridor), with these being the boundaries on the west and east sides, and downtown Dallas and 121, with these being the boundaries south and north at the bottom and the top of it.
Figure office developments are going to have a more difficult time when built elsewhere outside of this district.
Downtown Dallas becomes the abrupt end of this retail district I am referring to.
Think of a tree. At the bottom of its trunk, the roots of it dig into downtown spreading out to west of it into the Dallas Market Center, into the Dallas Design District, to the south into Uptown, and to the east into CityPlace.
At the heart of this tree are located Lemmon Avenue which connects Love Field to Uptown, and Highland Park Village Shopping Center a little further north at Mockingbird and Preston Road and Mockingbird station located towards the east of that.
Proceeding north, the tree starts branching out with limbs one proceeding westward into Inwood Shopping Center at Lovers Lane. Further north of that is located the shops at Preston Village within Preston Center with Northpark Mall and the shops at Parklane branching off from that.
This goes on and on.
I think the city of Dallas markets itself all wrong. Most outsiders don't realize this aspect about the city of Dallas. For many years now, this district here has grown to take precedence over downtown Dallas as it is the leading cause for the department stores closing in the central city which ended downtown's designation as the prime commercial shopping district for the area.
Something similar has happened in Atlanta with the name Peachtree. What the name Preston is to Dallas, Peachtree is to Atlanta. It just seems to go on forever in the Dallas area while there seems no end to it. Consider how Preston Road (289) already runs to the Oklahoma border ending at Lake Texoma?
Westheimer in Houston could be said to be similar, but its designation doesn't share a relationship with a nearby corridor as Preston Road does with Dallas Parkway.
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Old 07-05-2013, 07:57 PM
 
Location: NE Atlanta Metro
3,197 posts, read 5,354,140 times
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I could see a retail boom for the Lemmon Ave corridor between Uptown and Love Field. The area looks ripe. You have a massive amount of development in the Medical District to the west, we all know what's going on in the nearby Uptown and Oaklawn areas. Then there's Love Field to the north, with hopefully a growing amount of O&D traffic once the Wright Amendment is lifted.
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