Feels like I'm being priced out - where can I buy in DFW? Single 30M, work remotely make 200K (Dallas: low income, renting)

[Pilsn3r]

Originally Posted by EDS_

In Texas as incomes increase relative state and local tax burdens tend to fall. That plus work and business opportunities are chiefly why Dallas (Houston too for that matter) has a very high number of both very rich people and high earners (per Wealth-X top 10 in the world in both categories).

I know and included top choices like FL (no state income tax and lots of wealth) which includes top walkable cities Tampa and Miami (higher walkable score than DFW or Houston), with major airports (short and cheap hops to the Caribbean for a week or two workation!)

For OP - just know there are other places that meet some/most of your criteria, but if you are set on DFW, enjoy and good luck on house hunting!

[WorldKlas]

Knoxville, TN is getting the next wave of newcomers….. check it out, too!

[CoastieOnTheMove]

Originally Posted by Leonard123

No, it is most definitely not reasonable even for a professional career in tech. Even six figures would be hard to come by without significantly more experience. Management and senior roles with well over ten years of experience may come close. Yes, there are people making that much but not very many.

There are plenty of very nice homes in the $300K-$400K range. They may not be in the exact neighborhoods you are looking or fit your lifestyle, but there are nice and convenient areas where that will buy a decent house.

You'd be surprised. Go checkout teamblind.com. Pretty common for individual contributor engineers to make 200-300K total compensation/year at big tech firms when you factor in their base, performance bonus, and RSUs. Most likely just have a BS in CS as well. Product Management is such a desirable role for people who are non-technical because it pays as much as engineering.

I'll have to keep looking in that range with an experienced realtor. I'd love walkability of course, but I also want to protect myself against rising rents and build equity. Thanks for your advice

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by Wittgenstein's Ghost

A few thoughts/responses:


3. My wife and I (I'm 36) are into the outdoors and wanted a mid-sized city. We moved to Colorado Springs, and it was one of the best decisions we've ever made. If you're a city guy, you'd hate it. You might feel differently about Denver, but it isn't a city in the way that NYC or Chicago are. If I'm imagining myself in your shoes, I'd go to Chicago, Seattle (getting pricey, though) or San Diego. The sleeper would be Kansas City (yes, KC...great, underrated city where you could live like a king). I'd live in a place with bad schools but cool stuff around me. I'd be in a neighborhood where I could walk to a lot of things and avoid using a car as much as possible.

KC is cheap for a reason, it is generally a very fragmented messed up city on many levels, and much too spread out. It has the worst elements of the South and North with none of the advantages of either geographical region, closed off social culture, awful weather most of the year, and far from anything scenic (airport isn't a hub, and has limited direct connections).

[TX Rover]

Rather than critique your salary or choice to live in Dallas...

I'd say take a look at the North Richardson/South Plano-ish areas. The housing stock is a little older, but often renovated nicely or you can do the reno yourself. I just recently took some equity from selling my "big" house in Austin when I moved up here, and bought a duplex (both sides 3/2 1500 sqft), and renovated both units. I live in one side and get $2000/mo rent on the other.
The neighborhood is solid, the schools are "good" maybe not the 100% "best" (I zone to Plano Senior), but good enough to protect investment and since I'm on site, being a landlord isn't that bad. That layout works perfect for me, one bedroom is really small so it's my office, I'm only 30 mins from each airport, there's restaurants and bars I can walk/bike to.

It might be something to consider. I bought the duplex for $440 and put about another $80 into it, in the past two years it's now probably appreciated a good deal (maybe high 5's low 6's?) and I've been cash flow positive on the rental side.

It could be a little bit too suburban for you, but it's worth taking a look at.

[Wittgenstein's Ghost]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

KC is cheap for a reason, it is generally a very fragmented messed up city on many levels, and much too spread out. It has the worst elements of the South and North with none of the advantages of either geographical region, closed off social culture, awful weather most of the year, and far from anything scenic (airport isn't a hub, and has limited direct connections).

I really couldn't disagree more. It doesn't matter how spread out it is if the OP lives in the Plaza area. DFW is incredibly spread out, but does the fact that Prosper is way out in BFE affect someone living in Bishop Arts?

I think the weather is at least no worse than DFW's weather. I've lived in both Missouri and Texas for at least 14 years each, btw.

And I don't know how you can say KC isn't scenic. Compared to DFW, well, there's no comparison. It may not have mountains or beaches, but it's a pretty place. And it's a quick, nonstop flight to Denver.

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by CoastieOnTheMove

I don't consider myself 90th percentile household income either tbh. ~200K for a single person is perfectly reasonable for someone in a professional career - especially tech. There are people working in tech/law/medicine/finance pulling in double or even triple of my current salary within DFW.

You’re a little out of touch with how many other people are actually making more than you. There are a lot of them in sheer #’s but not as a percent of the population. I think these are 2019 incomesModerator cut: link removed, competitor site so bump it a bit but here is where you stack up in Dallas:

$231k HHI is 95% percentile in Dallas. The 95th percentile makes 512% more than the median 50th percentile household. The mean of the top 5% is making $445k. So roughly around 4-5% of the entire DFW population is making up to double your salary, and then 2.5% of households on top of that are making more than double your salary.

You make the same or more as the median HHI in EVERY SINGLE suburb that is considered to be wealthy:
Southlake $189k
Colleyville $162k
Heath $150k
Highland Village/ Double Oak: $138k
Lucas $133k
Sunnyvale $126k
Flower Mound $123k
Prosper $120k
Frisco $118k

The mean of the top 5% of HHI in those places:
Southlake $1.2M
Colleyville $800k
Heath $700k
Highland Village/ Double Oak: $500k
Lucas $1.1M
Sunnyvale $500k
Frisco $500k

Drilling down to specific Dallas neighborhoods, here is how your $200k stacks up to the mean income in the most expensive parts of Dallas:
University Park: > $250k
Highland Park: > $250k
Old Preston Hollow - bordered by Northwest Hwy/ Walnut Hill/ Midway/ Preston: $250k
Preston Hollow - bordered by Preston / Hillcrest / Royal / Northwest Highway: northern tract $221k, the souther tract that includes condos is $102k
Devonshire: $214k
Lakewood proper: $153k
Bluffview: $113k
North Oak Cliff: $99k

And here is how you stack up to the mean of the top 5% HHI in those same tracts:
University Park: $1.2M
Old Preston Hollow: $2.15M
Preston Hollow: $1.1M - $1.3M
Highland Park: $1.6M
Devonshire: $1.6M
Lakewood proper: $728k
Bluffview: $909k
North Oak Cliff: $454-581k


Just to give you some perspective….you make the mean income of some of absolute most expensive places to live in all of Dallas. The people you’re comparing yourself too - “all those professionals easily making $400-600k per year” are IN REALITY the top 2-5% of earners in the absolute most expensive places to live in the DFW metro.

[TX Rover]

Originally Posted by Wittgenstein's Ghost

I really couldn't disagree more. It doesn't matter how spread out it is if the OP lives in the Plaza area. DFW is incredibly spread out, but does the fact that Prosper is way out in BFE affect someone living in Bishop Arts?

I think the weather is at least no worse than DFW's weather. I've lived in both Missouri and Texas for at least 14 years each, btw.

And I don't know how you can say KC isn't scenic. Compared to DFW, well, there's no comparison. It may not have mountains or beaches, but it's a pretty place. And it's a quick, nonstop flight to Denver.

Definitely off-topic but I agree to a point. My old company had a major contract with a company based in KC and I was there rather often - I wouldn't equate the two (DFW/KC) too much as DFW is by far larger and has a more diverse and robust job market, but KC isn't a bad place at all, I'd equate it to Colombus,OH maybe? something like that... OKC-ish?

It definitely gets colder more often though in the winter, which was always a ball-buster for me. DFW definitely offers more on the air travel side though. NS flights out of KC are tough, between DAL and DFW you can pretty much get anywhere in the US within 3-4 hours of parking your car.

[EDS_]

Originally Posted by TurtleCreek80

You’re a little out of touch with how many other people are actually making more than you. There are a lot of them in sheer #’s but not as a percent of the population. I think these are 2019 incomes Moderator cut: link removed, competitor site so bump it a bit but here is where you stack up in Dallas:

$231k HHI is 95% percentile in Dallas. The 95th percentile makes 512% more than the median 50th percentile household. The mean of the top 5% is making $445k. So roughly around 4-5% of the entire DFW population is making up to double your salary, and then 2.5% of households on top of that are making more than double your salary.

You make the same or more as the median HHI in EVERY SINGLE suburb that is considered to be wealthy:
Southlake $189k
Colleyville $162k
Heath $150k
Highland Village/ Double Oak: $138k
Lucas $133k
Sunnyvale $126k
Flower Mound $123k
Prosper $120k
Frisco $118k

The mean of the top 5% of HHI in those places:
Southlake $1.2M
Colleyville $800k
Heath $700k
Highland Village/ Double Oak: $500k
Lucas $1.1M
Sunnyvale $500k
Frisco $500k

Drilling down to specific Dallas neighborhoods, here is how your $200k stacks up to the mean income in the most expensive parts of Dallas:
University Park: > $250k
Highland Park: > $250k
Old Preston Hollow - bordered by Northwest Hwy/ Walnut Hill/ Midway/ Preston: $250k
Preston Hollow - bordered by Preston / Hillcrest / Royal / Northwest Highway: northern tract $221k, the souther tract that includes condos is $102k
Devonshire: $214k
Lakewood proper: $153k
Bluffview: $113k
North Oak Cliff: $99k

And here is how you stack up to the mean of the top 5% HHI in those same tracts:
University Park: $1.2M
Old Preston Hollow: $2.15M
Preston Hollow: $1.1M - $1.3M
Highland Park: $1.6M
Devonshire: $1.6M
Lakewood proper: $728k
Bluffview: $909k
North Oak Cliff: $454-581k


Just to give you some perspective….you make the mean income of some of absolute most expensive places to live in all of Dallas. The people you’re comparing yourself too - “all those professionals easily making $400-600k per year” are IN REALITY the top 2-5% of earners in the absolute most expensive places to live in the DFW metro.

All that matters and I get your specific point but it's important to note that active income does not describe wealth particularly well, especially in the short term.

The OP makes really good money. However, given his age and other bits he hasn't done so for very long. He's likely not old enough to have been though a form 83b event, he hasn't been in the broad markets long, he clearly does not have a rental portfolio etc.

[EDS_]

Originally Posted by TX Rover

Definitely off-topic but I agree to a point. My old company had a major contract with a company based in KC and I was there rather often - I wouldn't equate the two (DFW/KC) too much as DFW is by far larger and has a more diverse and robust job market, but KC isn't a bad place at all, I'd equate it to Colombus,OH maybe? something like that... OKC-ish?

It definitely gets colder more often though in the winter, which was always a ball-buster for me. DFW definitely offers more on the air travel side though. NS flights out of KC are tough, between DAL and DFW you can pretty much get anywhere in the US within 3-4 hours of parking your car.

I like KC but the airport is a grand disaster. Too far out and awful once there. Also per the weather it's instructive to note that KC is a little more northerly than St. Louis.