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Old 08-17-2014, 06:18 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Ohio
11,834 posts, read 9,789,318 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yakscsd View Post
The case could not be any clearer. Man enters store and points, what any reasonable person thinks is a gun, at them. Police get called and they to see a man with a gun. Not a man with a toy, but a man with a gun. They told him to stop put down the gun or something like that. He doesn't and gets shot. Textbook police procedure in any city in the US.

Lesson to learn, don't ever point anything at a cop and do exactly what you are told when a gun is pointed at you. Would have solved all problems in this case and in the recent Ferguson shooting.
It's not clear because the facts of what happened in that store have not been made public.
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Old 08-17-2014, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Five Oaks
430 posts, read 449,794 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hensleya1 View Post
The same reason there was a specific focus on the shop owners in Ferguson (who seemed to be all white): they were from another race.

The fact that so many of these things are turned into racial issues when it's really a thug issue sickens me.
Nope. Latasha Harlins, my friend.
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Old 08-18-2014, 04:17 AM
 
3,515 posts, read 3,805,953 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hensleya1 View Post
The same reason there was a specific focus on the shop owners in Ferguson (who seemed to be all white): they were from another race.

The fact that so many of these things are turned into racial issues when it's really a thug issue sickens me.
You bring up a good point - the issue of thug vs. race.

Are more African Americans really "thug" and therefore more likely than other races to commit crimes? Or are we culturally biased to notice their crimes more than the crimes of other races?

Because you have an excellent implied point that this guy could have looked "dangerous" and been perceived as a thug. And that probably played into his death if that were the case. And how much of that perception of him being "dangerous" was based on his race?


Thugs are everywhere in society in all races. I'm worried some people see thugs as a black and white issue. That's the mentality that needs to stop, anyone can be a thug. Bernie Madoff was.
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Old 08-18-2014, 01:11 PM
 
Location: Beavercreek, OH
2,194 posts, read 3,028,208 times
Reputation: 2334
Quote:
Originally Posted by OHKID View Post
You bring up a good point - the issue of thug vs. race.

Are more African Americans really "thug" and therefore more likely than other races to commit crimes? Or are we culturally biased to notice their crimes more than the crimes of other races?

Because you have an excellent implied point that this guy could have looked "dangerous" and been perceived as a thug. And that probably played into his death if that were the case. And how much of that perception of him being "dangerous" was based on his race?
Unfortunately, the answer is yes - a black man is eight times more likely to commit murder than a white one. There are a number of theories as to why this is (cultural differences, backgrounds, breakdown of the families, disparity in the criminal justice system). But regardless of the reason this is a well known fact. Combine that with a little suburban fear of the city and you'll get people predisposed to act hostile towards each other... because all a Beavercreek/Centerville/insert your suburban resident here needs to do is turn on Channel 7 and hear about another shooting off of Gettysburg, Salem, or James McGee... and that's all they ever hear about the area.

As to why I maintain it is a firmly thug issue however, is because there are thugs of every race. It doesn't matter if the guy has his ball cap on backwards and pants sagged to the ground.... or if it doesn't look like he's shaved or worn a shirt in a couple months. A thug is a thug regardless of race, and I'm going to be on alert any time I see them around, especially in groups.
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Old 08-25-2014, 03:43 PM
 
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^Good points hensleya1, sorry about the late response. I don't disagree.


More news on the Beavercreek case, this time there is a timeline of events.

A look at fatal shooting of John Crawford III by Beavercreek cops | www.mydaytondailynews.com

(behind the paywall - sorry!)

I understand why the police were called, I just don't understand the procedure used to take him down. I especially don't understand why he was tackled after he was shot. They might have been able to still keep him alive if they didn't jump on him and lodge the bullets further into his body. And if they were able to get 4-5 police officers there in three minutes (which is awesome IMO), why couldn't they figure out a way to not shoot to the point where he was killed?


Additionally, the way the police handled the store crowd sounds horrid. Cause a panic for 30 minutes after the man was shot? Couldn't they have been more calm? That alone might have saved the other woman who died.
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Old 08-28-2014, 03:37 PM
 
Location: Beavercreek, OH
2,194 posts, read 3,028,208 times
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I've posted this picture before, and feel like I should do it again:



This illustrates exactly what the Hell is going wrong with this country today.

While I have the utmost respect for the ordinary police officer [and will likely be at Sunday's rally supporting the Beavercreek Police Department if I can find the time], I have a hard time respecting police when they show up dressed like the picture above.

Police officers are there to protect and serve. Not arrest, not put in jail, not suppress. A police officer in my book gets points when he helps bring a lost person or even a pet home. Or if they help when you're broken down on the side of the road and help you fix your car or call a tow truck. That's the kind of thing that motivates me to wave to one as I drive by, or perhaps even stop and thank them for their service.

I've been broken down on I-75 before in plain sight of a Moraine police officer who was sitting in the median running a trap for speeders. I was going northbound and watched him not move an inch. For fifteen minutes or so as I fished around in the trunk for the tire jack so I could put the doughnut on. Until he hared off southbound, lights blazing, presumably after someone who was probably doing 72 in a 55. Clearly his priorities were not protecting and serving but instead filling the hole in Moraine's general budget left when GM left town.

That was irritating.

And I'll certainly have a harder time thanking a police officer for his service if he pulls up next to me in a Humvee or a MRAP at a traffic light.
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:33 PM
 
3,515 posts, read 3,805,953 times
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"You must spread some reputation around before giving it to hensleya1 again"

I couldn't agree more. Your post is excellent and hits the nail exactly on the head with what is wrong with policing today.


Don't get me wrong though, I do support the police and what they do, but I do not support police-as-militia.
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Old 09-11-2014, 08:15 AM
 
3,515 posts, read 3,805,953 times
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Good "article" from the DDN from what you can / cannot do with a gun in Ohio:

Quiz: Do you know Ohio's gun laws? | Dayton, OH News | www.mydaytondailynews.com
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Old 09-11-2014, 10:57 AM
 
Location: Beavercreek, OH
2,194 posts, read 3,028,208 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OHKID View Post
Good "article" from the DDN from what you can / cannot do with a gun in Ohio:

Quiz: Do you know Ohio's gun laws? | Dayton, OH News | www.mydaytondailynews.com
I got 8 out of 9 correct, and the one I got wrong is when I said something wasn't okay when it actually was.

One thing I don't get about Ohio though, is you have these signs everywhere:



While I completely respect the private business owner's decision to ban his customers from exercising their right to bear arms on his premises (private property and all), I will respect his decision by patronizing someone else.

It simply isn't safe to erect that sign, as almost every massacre in American history has occurred in what was ostensibly a gun free zone - malls, courthouses, and most egregiously college campuses and other schools. You never hear about a massacre at a police station or a shooting range.

***

There are times where I am more afraid of what police may do than what criminals may do - because the law is on my side if I use deadly force in self defense against a criminal. But what is to say this whole Wal-Mart thing wasn't fabricated by a trigger happy police officer? Or was John Crawford III going nuts and waving the gun around like the guy on the phone said? We just don't know the facts yet. I assume the Attorney General's office will get it figured out before long, and anything we say or do until then is pure speculation.

I may have meandered a bit so I'll summarize:

1) People carry guns because police officers are too heavy to carry around
2) Police officers are human beings, and aren't perfect either. Things can and do go wrong in the line of service, sometimes negligently, sometimes deliberately. That's what the Attorney General's office has to figure out.
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Old 09-24-2014, 12:27 PM
 
Location: Beavercreek, OH
2,194 posts, read 3,028,208 times
Reputation: 2334
Well, for weeks now Al Sharpton and the other race baiters have been bellyaching about getting the surveillance tape released. Here it is.



Grand Jury: No Indictments Against Beavercreek Officers

Quote:
Special prosecutor said the grand jury considered charges of murder, reckless homicide and negligent homicide.

Vince Pope, attorney for the officers involved in the shooting, released the following statement: "I believe the grand jury's decision, it's absolutely the right decision, that the officers acted well within their training."

Surveillance video from inside Walmart shows John Crawford III holding the air rifle on his shoulder and walking around the store.
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