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Old 03-18-2018, 06:28 PM
 
Location: Lebanon, OH
5,685 posts, read 5,888,940 times
Reputation: 12037

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Maybe downtown Dayton could develop a SoDoSoPa district complete with the Villas at Kenny’s house then they will get a Whole Foods.

If the younger people who work downtown lived closer to their jobs and rejected the notion of commuting 35-40 miles each way to their jobs just to live in a McMansion in a gated community things would turn around fast.

Most of my working years were spent in jobs only 1 or 2 miles from my house and I could not be paid enough to sit in traffic 2 hours a day but there are people where I live that work in downtown Cincinnati that do exactly that.

I was on the WOXY board with a guy known as Drexel Dave, real name David Sparks, he ran for the state house and barely lost, he did a blog back in 2005 and I contributed a few photos for it. He also had a band that played at the Canal Street Tavern, I tried to find the blog he did but I can’t find it, I screenshoted this post years back.

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Will the DTDayton Residential Boom Continue or Flatline Into the 2020s?-943d46fb-991c-4ac1-8122-f28ec43821cb.png  
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Old 03-18-2018, 08:24 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Ohio
11,796 posts, read 9,715,656 times
Reputation: 10799
Drexel Dave's blog was awesome. I think it was called "Real Dayton" or something like that. I've seen him at local gatherings and protests, etc. He's a pretty funny dude, too.
My favorite bit on that blog showed a pic of a group of East Dayton fellas hanging out with the caption: "Every boy in East Dayton is given a BMX bike and wife beater shirt for his 13th birthday. This special day is called BriarMitzvah."
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Old 03-19-2018, 09:32 AM
 
Location: Lebanon, OH
5,685 posts, read 5,888,940 times
Reputation: 12037
Glad to see someone else is familiar with the blog, he had a lot of witty captions for his photos that made it all that much more interesting.

His state house opponent had a smear campaign against him and a website called creepydavidsparks or something like that.
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Old 03-21-2018, 05:04 AM
 
Location: Dayton, OH
504 posts, read 198,828 times
Reputation: 2121
It would be interesting to see what that house in the above photo looks like today.
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Old 03-21-2018, 04:44 PM
 
Location: Covington, KY
1,879 posts, read 2,122,462 times
Reputation: 590
I followed Drexel Dave, too, and was really sorry when he disappeared.
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Old 03-21-2018, 06:10 PM
 
Location: Lebanon, OH
5,685 posts, read 5,888,940 times
Reputation: 12037
Dave was a great advocate for the city of Dayton, shame there is not more like him.
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Old 04-05-2018, 10:48 PM
 
Location: Beavercreek, OH
2,194 posts, read 3,013,856 times
Reputation: 2334
Been a while since I posted, so I'll play:

The downtown housing boom will continue so long as the tax abatements run. That's 5-10 years remaining in most cases with some places already having the time toll on some of the earlier developments. You've got to remember that as a whole Dayton hasn't stopped the decline from 2008 or earlier... the deck chairs are merely being reshuffled downtown right now and they will continue to do so until businesses return, and in large numbers, to the city.

That won't happen until taxes and regulations are cut and businesses can run a detailed market analysis and conclude that the cost of doing business in the city is low enough to gain the benefit of having concentrated population and services downtown. Currently that isn't the case when Montgomery County has the highest commercial property tax rate out of all 88 Ohio counties and Dayton ties with Oakwood to have the highest income tax rate.

The reason you see construction downtown currently is because 90% of downtown property isn't paying tax. Either it's government (Sinclair, Montgomery County), nonprofit (Premier Health, CareSource), or tax abated (all the Charles Simms condos). That should be a loud and clear message to city leaders. Lower the burden, and business will return.
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Old 04-29-2018, 11:47 AM
 
1,614 posts, read 596,891 times
Reputation: 1537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natural510 View Post
Yep, the urban Whole Foods in downtown Newark and Midtown Detroit have been very beneficial for those cities. Unfortunately, they decided to build their first Dayton store in the south suburbs, which is already overrun with a plethora of grocery options.
I would almostvbet some suburban Dayton banker or businessperson was behind that decision. It isn't as bad as it was a few years ago...but there is a degree of antipathy toward the center city by many suburbanites here that us difficult for me to fathom. They absolutely revel in running down and hating on the center city. It is an emotional hot button for many of them. This is why I think a city-suburban/county merger would never work here...a large portion of the suburbanites have little to no knowledge of the inner city beyond what they see on WHIO or hear from like minded neighbors but nevertheless hate the inner city with a passion and would vote down absolutely any and all initiatives designed to benefit the inner city areas.
Businesspeople interested in investing in projects in Dayton have complained for years that this description fits many of the local bankers that they have had to deal with...and if you notice a very large percentage of Dayton's rebirth is being driven by out of towners...who may not share the biases many of the locals have...and who are now laughing all the way to the bank.
There have been notable and very praiseworthy exceptions...Charlie Simms, Jeff Samuelson on Brown Street a few years ago, and a number of others, but I think in the main the overly negative and poorly informed attitudes toward the city by much of Dayton's suburban population has held it back tremendously.

Last edited by robertbrianbush; 04-29-2018 at 12:03 PM..
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Old 05-01-2018, 06:20 PM
 
Location: Covington, KY
1,879 posts, read 2,122,462 times
Reputation: 590
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertbrianbush View Post
I would almostvbet some suburban Dayton banker or businessperson was behind that decision. It isn't as bad as it was a few years ago...but there is a degree of antipathy toward the center city by many suburbanites here that us difficult for me to fathom. They absolutely revel in running down and hating on the center city. It is an emotional hot button for many of them. This is why I think a city-suburban/county merger would never work here...a large portion of the suburbanites have little to no knowledge of the inner city beyond what they see on WHIO or hear from like minded neighbors but nevertheless hate the inner city with a passion and would vote down absolutely any and all initiatives designed to benefit the inner city areas.
Businesspeople interested in investing in projects in Dayton have complained for years that this description fits many of the local bankers that they have had to deal with...and if you notice a very large percentage of Dayton's rebirth is being driven by out of towners...who may not share the biases many of the locals have...and who are now laughing all the way to the bank.
There have been notable and very praiseworthy exceptions...Charlie Simms, Jeff Samuelson on Brown Street a few years ago, and a number of others, but I think in the main the overly negative and poorly informed attitudes toward the city by much of Dayton's suburban population has held it back tremendously.
After World War II, the government wanted to back the veterans who wanted to own a home (hence, VA loans), however, the government wasn't going to guarantee a bunch of money for anything near a state of collapse. The loans naturally readily went to new housing that needed little or nothing in the way of rehabbing, but there was no open space within the city limits to do a lot of new building. It had to be something like farmland. Thus, suburbia was "the place to be" even if one didn't qualify and even if there was a good house just down the block.

Those that wanted to be in "the place to be" needed reasons for choosing same, the city income tax being one. The trouble was, the income tax provided city services, like the fire department, and when the insurance companies got wind of things like "all volunteer fire department," the person's insurance payments sky-rocketed. Maybe the real "kicker" was city water. My aunt visiting from Indiana once asked where the "fabulous" water on the table came from. Well it came from the kitchen faucet through some 70-year-old pipes. Meanwhile suburbia was cautious over every drop of drinking water since it came in a bottle from a retail store.

In the Dayton area, suburbanites had to reassure each other they did the right thing in moving there. Now if a town is/was a crime-ridden dump with incompetent services, there'd be no reason to hang onto it or say much.
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Old 05-03-2018, 07:15 AM
 
1,328 posts, read 1,045,412 times
Reputation: 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by hensleya1 View Post
Been a while since I posted, so I'll play:

The downtown housing boom will continue so long as the tax abatements run. That's 5-10 years remaining in most cases with some places already having the time toll on some of the earlier developments. You've got to remember that as a whole Dayton hasn't stopped the decline from 2008 or earlier... the deck chairs are merely being reshuffled downtown right now and they will continue to do so until businesses return, and in large numbers, to the city.

That won't happen until taxes and regulations are cut and businesses can run a detailed market analysis and conclude that the cost of doing business in the city is low enough to gain the benefit of having concentrated population and services downtown. Currently that isn't the case when Montgomery County has the highest commercial property tax rate out of all 88 Ohio counties and Dayton ties with Oakwood to have the highest income tax rate.

The reason you see construction downtown currently is because 90% of downtown property isn't paying tax. Either it's government (Sinclair, Montgomery County), nonprofit (Premier Health, CareSource), or tax abated (all the Charles Simms condos). That should be a loud and clear message to city leaders. Lower the burden, and business will return.
Exactly.
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