Dayton Ohio: Does it still suck there? (Columbus, Cleveland: appointed, apartment)

[JefferyT]

I would have to say that Santa Clara is well on it's way unless something turns the area. There are entire blocks in that neighborhood that are vacant. But not Dayton View. Though I will concede that some of the blocks in Dayton View are gritty.

Dayton View, the district between Wolf Creek, Grand, Broadway and Salem, has more board-ups and vacancies on the south and west edges, closer to Wolf Creek and Broadway and nearby streets (like Riverview and Audubon Park or Court). The blocks closer to Salem have lost a lot of houses so more a vacant lot situation vs an empty house situation.

The bright spot here is that HOPE project has went beyond replacing the public housing and is building new houses on nearby vacant lots, so the neighborhoods is actually being re-constructed in parts. But there is going to be ongoing abandoment and demolition there as the remaining housing stock goes vacant.

Yet there are some islands, like restoration work on Superior and Grand and the little pocket of Jane Reece Terrace...heres' a link:

Jane Reece Terrace

...a bit of gay & bohemian history here that you wouldn't know about unless you were clued-in to that scene.

University Row is a very nice area. It is very well maintained and it seems the residents do a good job of keeping on top of things. If you haven't driven through there lately you may want to.

The Salem cooridor has some good examples of "mid century modern" (MCM for short) , which was a popular retro thing during the last decade, more on the west coast than here. Here is a thread starting out with these MCM houses (and some offices) off Salem, including some art deco/art moderne things from maybe the 1930s or 20s, then moving to a collection in Harrison Township just across the city limits (one or two might actually be in the city):

Provincial Midwest MCM in Dayton

[Daytonnatian]

^Cool stuff.

As always, thanks for the read, Jeffery!!!!

[willabee]

Originally Posted by JefferyT

Dayton View, the district between Wolf Creek, Grand, Broadway and Salem, has more board-ups and vacancies on the south and west edges, closer to Wolf Creek and Broadway and nearby streets (like Riverview and Audubon Park or Court). The blocks closer to Salem have lost a lot of houses so more a vacant lot situation vs an empty house situation.

To me, it's tragic to see something like that happen to such an old neighborhood. I really hate seeing old homes demolished. Once they sit for too long that really is the only viable option. Which brings up the obvious. It really sucks that various parties let them sit vacant.

Originally Posted by JefferyT

The bright spot here is that HOPE project has went beyond replacing the public housing and is building new houses on nearby vacant lots, so the neighborhoods is actually being re-constructed in parts. But there is going to be ongoing abandoment and demolition there as the remaining housing stock goes vacant.

Are the homes being sold? or utilized for HOPE's needs?

Originally Posted by JefferyT

Yet there are some islands, like restoration work on Superior and Grand and the little pocket of Jane Reece Terrace...heres' a link:

Jane Reece Terrace

...a bit of gay & bohemian history here that you wouldn't know about unless you were clued-in to that scene.

Cool stuff. Again, the history is just too cool. I appreciate the clue-in. When I've said I like parts of Dayton View, considering these parts, they are really in the Dayton View Historic District and on the south edge of University Row. Even though the area is a bit run down on some blocks I can still see the potential for the area.

Originally Posted by JefferyT

The Salem cooridor has some good examples of "mid century modern" (MCM for short) , which was a popular retro thing during the last decade, more on the west coast than here.

Now ya got me googling MCM...lol. Interesting, Dayton, at times, is full of surprises.

Originally Posted by JefferyT

Here is a thread starting out with these MCM houses......

Provincial Midwest MCM in Dayton

Thanks, I'll go do some homework. Great stuff. All this info and history really brings a new level of appreciation for Dayton.

[SmartGXL]

Originally Posted by firefightermom

I'd like to hear your examples of how Dayton has always been considered dangerous and poor. Specific examples, please.

Hi FFM,

Even tho your post is over a year old, I would like to comment on this.

Im white, 36, and now live in Chicago, but I was born in Dayton (at good sam) and lived my first 25 years in Englewood. There was ALWAYS this attitude or vibe that Dayton was a "dangerous" place, relative to other towns. I believed it growing up, as I had relatives that lived in the "bad parts" of Dayton, but when I got older and started attending Wright State, I started to change my mind.

Until 1993, when I was working evenings at what was then, Society Bank on N Main St downtown. I left work around 8PM and walked to my car, and headed up Riverside Dr to go back home to Englewood (I refused to take the interstate, I like driving thru the older, more interesting neighborhoods).

Well, right after driving across the bridge, I noticed a car, with three black males in it, throwing things at my car, and yelling at me. For no apparent reason!! They followed me up Riverside Dr to where it dead ends at WBP.

When I reached that intersection, there were cars boxing me in. I (unknowingly) had my window down, and one of the guys from that car got out and approached me. He startled me, as he stood there at my car, and asked me, "Do you got a light?" I said No, he said, "Well why not?" I said I dont smoke, and then he punched me right in the face, thru my open car window!! He laughed and went back to his car. Other people were watching this and didnt say anything. I sped off when the light turned green! I went home and never reported this to the police.

Now, I normally did not read the paper at all, but several months later, I was sitting at my parents house and was bored, and picked up the Dayton Daily News, and turned to a random page, and saw a news article that 3 black men had been arrested and convicted for the kidnapping and murder of one white guy, for his car. They kidnapped him from the parking lot of the Ponderosa restaurant, in Forest Park Plaza (which was near the intersection where they attacked me) and killed him, then kidnapped someone else, tied him up and left him in the woods somewhere, for his car, as well. As I read the article, and saw their photos, I realized that it was the SAME THREE GUYS!!

They went to prison, I dont know what happened to them since then.

The point of my story, is that even tho most cities have a "bad area" of town, Dayton was one of the few cities I have ever visited or lived in (and I have traveled all over) where I never felt safe (the other cities are Gary IN and Allentown PA), or where there was just an overall creepy vibe to the city. Dayton just has a weird, creepy vibe. There are some small, nice neighborhoods, but it is one of the few places where anywhere you go, it feels like people are watching you, or where you go somewhere and people are staring at you with a look of rage on their face. I wish it wasn't like that.

[willabee]

You were getting attacked and waited for the light to turn green before speeding off?

[SmartGXL]

Originally Posted by willabee

You were getting attacked and waited for the light to turn green before speeding off?

No, I was boxed in by the other cars. As I approached the intersection, the light turned red, and cars in front of me stopped, as well as did cars to my left (I was in the right hand lane), and cars stopped behind me as well. i could go no where. The attackers were behind me, several cars back. My window was down, but did not realize it, and then out of no where, the attacker (I assume a carjacker wanna be) was there and after asking me that question, he attacked me. This happened in Spring, 1993. I was just looking for the DDN article on their website about the guys who went to prison but could not find it.

EDIT: I can only assume that their intent was to carjack me. But they could not successfully do so, as I was boxed in.

[willabee]

uhhh, sorry that happened. This makes Dayton....what exactly?

[Daytonnatian]

Carjackings USED to be a big thing in Dayton. Ancient history now, as no events are ever really reported anymore, and we have the lowest car theft rate for the largest 7 cities in the state.

To be honest, I had a relative who got carjacked about 20 yrs. ago in Wright-Dunbar. Scary stuff, and they stole his watch. Fortunately, no injury occured

[willabee]

Oh, I see. Wasn't sure where we were going here. I was living in LA when carjackings became popular. It was happening all over the place and everyone was talking about it. I guess we are desensitized to it now?

As for the perception of angry folks in Dayton, it's pretty much a world wide trend. I was in the LA riots in 92. In the months leading up to it you could feel the tension and once the verdicts hit the airwaves the place exploded. I really don't get that creepy vibe in Dayton that you get SmartGXL. Then again, I've lived in places where things are a lot worse. I like Dayton just fine.

[SmartGXL]

Originally Posted by willabee

Oh, I see. Wasn't sure where we were going here. I was living in LA when carjackings became popular. It was happening all over the place and everyone was talking about it. I guess we are desensitized to it now?

As for the perception of angry folks in Dayton, it's pretty much a world wide trend. I was in the LA riots in 92. In the months leading up to it you could feel the tension and once the verdicts hit the airwaves the place exploded. I really don't get that creepy vibe in Dayton that you get SmartGXL. Then again, I've lived in places where things are a lot worse. I like Dayton just fine.

Hi Willabee,

Well, Im not totally trying to rip Dayton completely, as I do sometimes miss Dayton on some level. I was trying to respond to FFM's post, mainly. Im not trying to talk anyone out of living there or insult anyone, after all, I was born there and lived there for 25 years.

But I guess to answer the original question in thread, "Does Dayton still suck", my answer is that it is not as good as it once was, and is not as good as it could be. Part of this is because of the economy, part of it is because of lack of vision on the part of the city leadership, and A LOT of it is because of government. Let's face it, the ONE THING that killed man North American cities, was the forced busing and integration (I'm not against integration, but the govt forcing it to happen, was disastrous). This, combined with a simultaneous rise of the automobile, caused white flight out of cities, for the suburbs, which DESTROYED many of our beautiful, walkable neighborhoods, and we are just now reversing that trend. For me, and my dollar, there are better places to live, that offer better, walkable neighborhoods and better weather. There are some nice neighborhoods in Dayton, and some things that are moving in the right direction. But I remember things like, going to the Oregon District on Friday nights, back in the early to late 90's. But then, when I went there a year ago with my GF, the place was a ghost town. When I was downtown a few weeks ago, the entire downtown was like a ghost town; it made me sad.

Maybe things are shifting in different directions. But it does make me sad to see what has happened to that place.