Why I'm leaving Dayton. (Youngstown, Beavercreek: unemployment, schools, universities)

[wrightflyer]

The last several posts have made my Friday, and perhaps my weekend! Thanks everyone!

As far as locals go, I'd generally agree. I beat myself over the head reading people's posts on the DDN site. Positive attitude people, positive attitude!

[Daytonnatian]

Originally Posted by Crew Chief

Why would I want a stable job? I don't know a DARN thing about horses and I'd REALLY hate dealing with the manure... (Sorry; it's been THAT kind of day...)

LOL!!!!!!!!!!

Hilarious, man!!!! Rep points for sure

[Clevelander17]

Dayton is simply going to have to retool its economy. I think a lot of great things are happening at UD, MVH, WSU, and WPAFB and that's going to have to be the future of the region. I'm still bullish on Dayton, but it's going to look different than what it did in the last century. Eds, meds, and government is the future.

[willabee]

Originally Posted by Clevelander17

Dayton is simply going to have to retool its economy. I think a lot of great things are happening at UD, MVH, WSU, and WPAFB and that's going to have to be the future of the region. I'm still bullish on Dayton, but it's going to look different than what it did in the last century. Eds, meds, and government is the future.

Great points. I think you are very right about it's economy looking different too. The institutions you mentioned are part of what, I think, gives Dayton a fighting chance. If we were solely based on manufacturing comparisons with Detroit and Youngstown would be more appropriate. So we will see what the future brings. Exciting things are a-brewing, they take a little time but will be obvious when they happen.

[tgasper]

You bring up some good points - but there are so many high tech jobs in the area that are not being filled. We seem to have a skills mismatch. Dayton is in the midst of a transformation and to those of us in the middle of trying to make it happen sooner than later, your words are an unintentional punch in the gut. There is much work to be done, but as my 25 year old son said - he'd rather stay and be part of the change, than move away and let someone else decide what changes.

As for Beavercreek being snubbed when it comes to RTA - it's actually just the opposite. Greene County has fought tooth and nail to limit RTA lines in the region for less than politically-correct reasons. You won't find it in the brochures, but the sentiment is there. The Dayton Mall used to have a lot of problems with unruly teenagers until they implemented the MB16 (must be 16) rule on weekends. The Fairfield Mall wanted to avoid the problem altogether by not allowing bus service to it. So you can get to WSU, but then you have to take your life into your own hands by walking from there across the bridge with 6-8 lanes of traffic and no sidewalks to get to the mall.

If there is one sentiment you hear over and over and over about Dayton it's that it is a great place to raise a family. It doesn't sound like you're in that demographic right now. We have a great cost of living and it's very easy to get around the area - as long as you have a car (we midwesterners do love our cars). The affordability means more discretionary income so you have the $$$ to go to Cincy, Columbus or Indy for entertainment - but we don't have the day-to-day traffic/congestion hassles.

For example, the average aerospace engineer earns $90,000/year no matter where they live in the country. On the coasts, it tends to cost that much or more to LIVE there - but it only costs about $60k/year to live in Dayton - so that puts an extra $30k in your pocket.

I sincerely wish you good luck wherever you end up. Just know that the grass on the other side isn't greener, it's still grass.

[darthredskin]

Wow. I never knew that about the RTA and Greene County. I know they have Greene Cats..which isn't really easily accessible or convenient.

Thanks!

And its not that the grass is greener on the other side...its just my type of grass is on the other side if that makes any sense what-so-ever.

[wrightflyer]

Originally Posted by darthredskin

Wow. I never knew that about the RTA and Greene County. I know they have Greene Cats..which isn't really easily accessible or convenient.

Thanks!

And its not that the grass is greener on the other side...its just my type of grass is on the other side if that makes any sense what-so-ever.

Yeah, I find the situation with public transit in my home county to be rather dismal. Ditto on the Greene Cats system.

No, what you said makes perfect sense, so much so, that I'm giving you some rep. Or I would, if the system would let me.

[Ohioan58]

Originally Posted by tgasper

You bring up some good points - but there are so many high tech jobs in the area that are not being filled. We seem to have a skills mismatch.

If there is any "shortage" in Dayton it is of decent high tech employers, good places for engineers to build their careers, and also of reasonable (not moron level) management personnel. Almost every IT or programming related work environment I have witnessed in the area has been bush league, mediocre, and tending toward abusive.

So please tell me about these unfilled high tech jobs in the area. I have never, ever, EVER seen an abundance of high tech jobs here. I am in IT and I moved back to SW Ohio in the late 80s. It has always been nuclear winter around here for anyone in IT, at least among the people that I know. The damage to my own career has been one huge ongoing sacrifice I made in moving back here.

I have seen an artificial supposed "abundance" of DoD technology jobs. But many of those positions are with DoD contractor companies in the area that insist on stealing each other's cleared employees rather than funding a clearance application process themselves. So the jobs stay open.

In the commercial sector I have seen exorbitant pickiness and absurd levels of cheapness among hiring companies. Never, ever reasonable hiring requirements.

And in both sectors, the working environments I've witnessed for engineers in the computer related fields have been hideous - politically charged and filled with the attitude of hire and fire, scapegoating, or maliciously "reigning in" people that are just doing their jobs.

I've never seen a comfortable electrical engineer or programmer type settled in their career locally. I call the area "Silicon Valley Not" and I advise peers to stay the hell away from the region. Companies here are crap. I always felt that a blue collar person in a union overall does better in Cincinnati-Dayton than an engineering person.

Basically, when "tech" is mentioned in the region, you get told something like Lexis-Nexus (closed shop, mainly hires PhDs, grunt programming work being sent to India), WPAFB (see comments about behavior of base contractors cherry picking each other's employees - closed shop), and P&G (only hires college kids and then grooms them for lifetime careers.)

[Sacheverell]

tgasper, as someone preparing to move to the Dayton region, I've been looking at the local RTA maps and wondering about Beavercreek situation, so thanks for the info. I've always taken public transit to work and I have no intention of stopping now, so I'll be crossing Beavercreek off my list. With all due respect, that your fellow citizens would fight to decrease mobility and options for their own poorer citizens, not to mention the elderly and others who cannot drive for various reasons, out of the fear of poor people actually setting foot in their neighborhoods makes me rather ill. If this is the mentality of the suburbs, I imagine I'll be quite a bit more comfortable in Dayton proper, it's evident problems notwithstanding.

[JefferyT]

^
The sociopolitical situation in suburban Greene County is discussed here:
Political Considerations when moving to suburban Greene County

Greene and Miami County both have public transit systems base on an on-demand concept. These systems are theoretically open to everyone. The Greene system is called CATS and apparenlty (based on anecdote) has a lot of requests but not enough vans and drivers to meet the demand, so they discourage use from the average commuter.