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We are a mid-50's couple looking to relocate next summer from Northern NJ to Southern Delaware. We are active people, and avid golfers. We are not retiring (well, actually one of us is). We have begun a search for a new home in the Rehoboth Beach/Bethany Beach/Millville/Ocean View areas (yes, fairly large area) and while we are amazed by all the options and choices, we are also feeling like the proverbial "kids in a candy store". We are thinking we wanted to live on a golf course in a golf course community, so we began our search there. Our thoughts:
- Bear Trap Dunes: Nice that they have 3 nine hole layouts, and a newly renovated clubhouse. Their one time initiation fees of $5,000 (refundable)/$2,500 (non-refundable), plus $300+ per month for golf membership, it's priced reasonably. However, we aren't finding any listings that give us the "Coastal Craftsman" look we have quickly grown to love about Delaware. Many of the homes we've seen look more like golf rentals.
- Bayside: Large and beautiful golf course (and much more) community, but at $25,000/$15,000 one time initiation fee for golf, it's a bit steep, although the $350/month to actually play golf is reasonable. The new homes being built here, and even some newer re-sales we've seen, are very nice.
- The Peninsula: The "cream of the crop", I guess, but again, at $47,000/$25,000 and $500 per month to play, it's more than we'd care to spend.
- Baywood Greens: Being a public course (as are the first 2 listed here) is okay, and it is certainly beautifully manicured and cared for, but there's no real benefits to join other than a 10% off on greens fees. That, combined with the whole "land lease" issue and we've ruled this development off our list.
- Plantation Lakes: A bit "out of the way" from the beach areas, and only 9 holes open so far? Plus, we were told that if you happen to buy one of the Hovnanian homes here you simply cannot join the golf course. Odd? We thought so. When will the course actually be the full 18? No one seems to be willing to commit to a firm answer.
So here are some thoughts/questions I was hoping to get some experienced insight into....
- What about memberships in Cripple Creek, Kings Creek, or Rehoboth Beach CC? Does anyone have any membership costs?
- With Bear Trap offering the most holes of golf, maybe we should consider living in a non-golf community and simply joining Bear Trap....easy choice? Maybe, but the sheer number of new home developments are DIZZYING, combined with the numbers of different builder and options on the homes, the research is really putting my OCD to the test! (It's good to have options, but sometimes too many just add to the confusion.)
- The prices on the new homes are reasonable going in, but then you find out about so MANY optional upcharges on every single choice (cabinet hardware? appliances? tiles? etc.). Having never purchased a new home before, I have NO IDEA how much the REAL price will be for a REASONABLY upgraded home (upgrades beyond the base just enough to make it nice and livable). I mean, what does $25,000-$40,000 in upgrades really get you? It doesn't seem like a whole lot!
- We do not want to just buy a re-sale on some random street in some random neighborhood. We want to be in a community (preferably new home or gently used and a couple of years old) with an HOA and lawn care and a clubhouse and a pool or two. Can anyone help narrow down the field of contenders?
- Any input from the folks here on the quality of the following builders: Schell Builders? NV Homes? Ryan Homes? Insight Homes? Others??
- Lastly, and this one has to do with us coming from Northern NJ....We are used to seeing a home purchase appreciate by at least 30-40% over 10-15 years. Can anyone offer some historical perspective on home appreciation/depreciation in the southern Delaware housing market? Not looking for a crystal ball here, just some input on past performance. This will likely not be our final move as we are looking to relocate now to Delaware to remain within a few hours of car travel to family (elderly parents and young adult children) and would guess that in 10-15 years the final move would be further south (NC/SC/GA) and I don't mind if I would break even on the home sale at that time, but I certainly do not want to lose money!
Thank you in advance for all who offer input, opinions, and replies!!
I haven't looked in any golf communities so I can't help you with that.. There was one absolutely gorgeous house we looked at with the option to join the golf club. The house was so inexpensive but coming from NY, everything there is inexpensive. But we discovered it was a land lease and and it was so expensive to lease that we eliminated that one. Just make sure it say's 'fee simple'.
As far as resale.. and again I'm not looking in golf communities, just resort communities so it may be different but judging from the homes my agent sends me the resales go down in price and they've been going down slowly but steadily since I've been looking.
There's a lot of brand new communities going up and that's your competition.. but it may be different in golf communities if there's no new building going on.
Check Zillow and see what the house sold for originally, and see what it's priced at now.
Thanks elliedeee, I appreciated your reply. Have you made the move from NY yet, or not?
No, we're still in the 'should we or shouldn't we' mode.. Lol I'd actually prefer to move to Jersey but those property taxes scare me.. Lol..
As far as resales in De. go I checked out some of the golf communities you listed and except for Bear, the other community homes mostly sold at a small profit.
edited.. What NJBoy3 says about NC..
I don't know much about golf at all, but I've heard from golf enthusiasts that NC has terrific golf courses. If you're planning on moving out of De to go to NC eventually anyway, why not move there first? Maybe even rent if you're not sure.
I called the RBYCC and Kings Creek (I live between them) and they are emailing me the info. I know that Kings Creek is more reasonable than RBYCC. Hubby is a golfer and has played both courses. I am not a golfer but the views from the dining room at RBYCC are beyond spectacular. I will post what they send me.
As far as your last paragraph. Not trying to be rude, but what was/is in NJ may/may not apply here in De. It is not like NJ (we are native LI'ers) or NY. If you are going to worry about that, then I would suggest you reconsider moving. I say this especially because you already know that you are planning another move and this is an important consideration. No one can predict the future, this is a popular area with new communities going in left, right and center. While the available land is being gobbled up, what is hot now may not be in time and while I don't think you would lose your shirt, if the housing market collapses, you might not be able to sell so quickly.
As has been pointed out already, fee simple is a better option for you if you want to sell. As far as upgrades, it is impossible to answer for you because we have no what of knowing what you want. Do you want a bonus room, a sunroom, expanded master bath.? or are you talking about a better grad of cabinet for example.
I suggest using the search bar above and to the left of the "Quick Links" and start researching communities and builders. There is a wealth of info to sort through. Some old but it will give you an idea of important things to consider when looking.
I think the real estate in Northern NJ appreciates more because the location is close to high paying jobs. Southern DE on the other hand attracts second home buyers who live and work in other states OR fulltime retirees who do not need to be close to high paying jobs.
The only exception in Southern DE is the high demand for people in the medical profession.
I would not expect home prices in Southern DE to appreciate at anywhere near what you have seen in Northern NJ, just as I expect Northern NJ does not attract many people who want a second home there or plan to retire to Northern NJ. Two very different markets.
Here are the figures for both RBYCC and Kings Creek. I called for them earlier today. I have an email if you are interested in real details, send me a DM.
RBYCC
Social Membership Offering:
Features full access to tennis, swimming, fitness center and Clubhouse dining and entertainment opportunities.
Plus limited access to golf (six rounds per year).
Initiation fee: $4,900 Annual dues: $3,758
Annual food & beverage minimum: $580 Monthly assessment: $0
Regular Membership Offering:
Features full access to golf, tennis, swimming, fitness center and dining opportunities.
Initiation fee: $25,000 Annual dues: $5,422
Annual food & beverage minimum: $580 Monthly assessment: $25
Kings Creek
Full Club Membership
Initiation Fee $10k
➢ $5,305 Annual Dues.
➢ Seven day sign-up privileges to reserve golf starting times and tennis court playing times.
➢ Not required to pay Greens Fees or tennis court fee, but shall be required to pay golf cart fees.
➢ $75: $50 Monthly Capital Assessment plus *$25 Monthly Irrigation Assessment.
$700 Food Minimum. (April – March)
Sports Membership
Initiaton Fee $6000
➢ $3,183 Annual Dues. (Annual Dues to equal 60% of The Current Full Membership Dues)*.
➢ Unlimited use of Clubhouse, dining, fitness, pool and tennis facilities.
➢ Annual Assessments to equal 60% of The Current Full Membership assessments.
➢ Three (3) day advance privileges to reserve starting times for golf and tennis.
➢ Limited to ten (10) rounds of golf per Sports Membership from the Friday of Memorial Day weekend through Labor Day. Note: Tournament play will not count against the 10-round limit.
➢ Unlimited golf play in the off-season.
➢ Must pay Greens Fee for each round of golf. Currently $73/round ($48 golf plus $25 cart). Note: Will not pay Greens fee for tournament rounds.
➢ $45: $30 Monthly Capital Assessment plus *$15 Monthly Irrigation Assessment.
➢ $700 Food Minimum. (April – March)
This thread piqued my interest and I started re-looking at Pinehurst Resort.
At Pinehurst a basic golf membership gives you 6 course to play. And for some more money you can play all 9 (can add later). That's 9 golf courses. To belong to Pinehurst you have to live in the Pinehurst community. If your a golf addict I would think a good thing. Also of note many properties convey a 50% discount on initiation fee. And lots of houses for sale on the actually golf courses, more than when I first looked about a year ago. Lots of nice 3/2 in the 200K-300K range. These are older homes but this is also one of the premier golf communities in the world.
And if you find fault in Pinehurst several newer golf communities in the general area. When searching that area I use a Moore county, NC search on Realtor.com
This thread piqued my interest and I started re-looking at Pinehurst Resort.
At Pinehurst a basic golf membership gives you 6 course to play. And for some more money you can play all 9 (can add later). That's 9 golf courses. To belong to Pinehurst you have to live in the Pinehurst community. If your a golf addict I would think a good thing. Also of note many properties convey a 50% discount on initiation fee. And lots of houses for sale on the actually golf courses, more than when I first looked about a year ago. Lots of nice 3/2 in the 200K-300K range. These are older homes but this is also one of the premier golf communities in the world.
And if you find fault in Pinehurst several newer golf communities in the general area. When searching that area I use a Moore county, NC search on Realtor.com
Tee time!
Some 30 years ago I lived in NC not too far from Pinehurst. I urge you to visit several times before purchasing, just like I urged all to do the same here. I personally could never live there by choice. It is very pretty for sure, but, also for me, I would miss the ocean. It was also a 13 hour car trip home. It is terribly humid and being so far inland there is no relief. That said, everyone has their own likes and dislikes.
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