West Rail Line (Denver, Boulder, Highlands Ranch: sales, neighborhood, sales tax)

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by zenkonami

I do hope they are able to fund the northerly lines (including BRT) and get them done in the next 10 years. Same with the 225 expansion. Will make a far more robust system if they do.

The southern extensions are nice ideas, but at least the south *has* rail. I'm in SE Denver and even I have to drive a couple miles to Park and Ride to catch the train (unless I bus it.) I'm sure those in affluent Douglas County can afford to do the same

The BRT is funded and construction has been ongoing for years. Phase 1 has been completed.
US 36 Bus Rapid Transit Project Home

The 225 expansion from station nine-mile station has been funded and construction has also commenced last year in 2012. I-225 Rail Line Home It will link up with the East Line that is going to the Airport which is also now under construction.

Livecontent

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by zenkonami

Correct me if I'm wrong (you were at the meetings and I'd hate to be spreading rumors) but I heard that at the time Golden didn't *want* the rail coming in to town due to the increased traffic and concerns over population...i.e., keeping the "small town feel." I thought this was also related to how they didn't want 470 crawling through their back yard. Were that the case, I don't blame them...but it still would have been nice to take the train right in to Golden. Would have made those Coors tours all the more convenient

West Line is great news and although I'm nowhere near it, I'm quite excited for it! Lots of progress to show for transit buffs about the East Line as well, though we won't see that line start up till 2016.

The East Line is now under heavy construction to the airport and will open in 2016.East Rail Line It will be the first line completed, under fastracks, which will connect with the Denver Union Station(DUS) complex which is under construction and should be completed in 2015 with the underground bus connections completed in 2014 with the completion of the Downtown Denver Circulator (DDC) http://www.rtd-fastracks.com/dus_10

Yes, I was at many meetings and those meeting go back 20-25 years because all this rail was planned and discussed over many years. My recollection of the discussions was that there was very little opposition to any rail going within the central core of Golden and some people were not happy that commuter rail did not go into the City. After all, there is much rail already existing as Golden is really an industrial town, similar to a steel town of the east with the industry of beer, though some residents will not admit it

However, there was more opposition to any RTD expansion because many in Golden are very conservative car culture and some do believe that their little world should not change. Even in discussion, about having a call-n-ride back immediately back then, there was opposition and consequently Golden never implemented call-n-rides but other cities lobbied for it and got it. It is very curious issue considering that there is a large University located there, The School of Mines, and colleges tend to support public transit. However, the school of mines perhaps lacks that liberal focus.

Livecontent

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by Mike from back east

West line is nice improvement for the metro area, not perfect, not a saviour, but a nice improvement indeed.

Back in Northern Virginia (NOVA) when they built Metro's Orange Line west from DC in the NOVA suburbs, the city of Fairfax, VA turned it down. IIRC that was in the late 1970s. Due to the racism back there, many people said they didn't want "undesirables" to have an easy way in/out of their fair burg. So the line ended up going down the median strip of I-66 with a stop called Vienna-Oakton.

But there's a part of me that also thinks it's wrong to rip your way through fairly dense suburbs to put in transit lines many decades after it should've been done. Such things should be done FIRST, not after your area become gridlocked, as NOVA was even in the late 1970s, and is woefully worse today. They are just now putting in a line to Dulles Airport, which should have done 40 years ago; such is our fascination with the auto, and the power of the oil/auto/road lobbies to control our Congress.

I don't think I'd want to see Golden ripped apart to put in the lines and parking. At this point in the life of the city, I favor bus service that collects up and moves people btw Golden and the nearest stop, at little or no fare as long as you use the rail line. The cost of bus service is a way to avoid the cost of building the line into Golden and may save some more if it holds down the size of parking lots/garages at the stop.

We have the same issues with some people not wanting the less desired having easy access. That issue surfaced with the Park Meadow Mall which was not included in the RTD district. It had no access to the Rail Station, adjacent on County Line. Well, new owners and wiser people prevailed and the mall was included in the district and a connection was built to the mall. It also gave them access to cheaper and part time labor with people who cannot afford to drive, which is not readily available in Lone Tree because the local kids do not have to work! Though, there is some short sighted policies to prevent RTD riders from parking at the mall. If they would allow parking, they would have people who leave work and then spend money at the mall because they are already there.

What I have seen over the years, in all this transit planning, arguments, agendas, my turf, your turf, my money, your money, budgets, greed, environmental rules, lawsuits, government kingdom makers etc. is that eventually the best policy is get something done and built, even if it is not the best because you are never get perfection from all this in the decision mix. Latter we can go back and fix what we can and at least we have a working system. It really takes many decades after initial completion of projects this size to work better and more efficiently. In NYC, they are still fine tuning that transportation system, even over more than a century. Yet when we look at what has been accomplished and what is coming--it is an outstanding accomplishment of men and woman just trying to do their best.

Livecontent

[petedoty]

Great news! For Lakewood and the Federal Center as well! I have many clients who have wondered why no test trains have been seen running on the rails? Any idea there?

[matkaemm]

Originally Posted by petedoty

Great news! For Lakewood and the Federal Center as well! I have many clients who have wondered why no test trains have been seen running on the rails? Any idea there?

There is a train parked somewhere around the Platte River area, I saw it 2 days ago. Here is a schedule of testing though, keep your eyes open if you're in one of these areas:


Crossing
Duration (days)
Start
Finish

Zuni
1
1/3/2013
1/3/2013
Decatur
1
1/3/2012
1/3/2013
Knox
1
1/4/2013
1/4/2013
Perry
1
1/4/2013
1/4/2013
Harlan
2
1/5/2013
1/6/2013
Lamar
2
1/5/2013
1/6/2013
Pierce
2
1/5/2013
1/6/2013
Teller
2
1/5/2013
1/6/2013
Carr
2
1/5/2013
1/6/2013
Estes
1
1/7/2013
1/7/2013
Garrison
1
1/7/2013
1/7/2013
Independence
1
1/7/2013
1/7/2013
Oak
2
1/8/2013
1/9/2013
Quail
2
1/8/2013
1/9/2013
Collins
2
1/8/2013
1/9/2013
8th
2
1/8/2013
1/9/2013
North E.
2
1/8/2013
1/9/2013
North W.
2
1/10/2013
1/11/2013
Ulysses
2
1/19/2013
1/20/2013
Earl Johnson
2
1/19/2013
1/20/2013

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by petedoty

Great news! For Lakewood and the Federal Center as well! I have many clients who have wondered why no test trains have been seen running on the rails? Any idea there?

Test trains have been on this track for a year. Trains have been run back and forth for a requirement to have the trains fully tested with a set mileage before use. Most testing is done and final testing will be done in the next few months.

Livecontent

[Willy702]

I marvel more at how the shopping districts on the west side get bypassed. I thought surely they would have a stop closer to the Mills since there is land and parking there plus you would think good demand, but guess not. It seems to me to expect logic in station decisions is asking for too much.

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by Willy702

I marvel more at how the shopping districts on the west side get bypassed. I thought surely they would have a stop closer to the Mills since there is land and parking there plus you would think good demand, but guess not. It seems to me to expect logic in station decisions is asking for too much.

That is your logic and your comments based on information, you obviously know nothing about.

Many decisions for this rail were made years before the Colorado Mills was even contemplated. As I have said in my previous post, the biggest area that was necessary to serve was the Federal Center. Going South into the Federal Center put the line away east and south from the Colorado Mills location and then it would it was decided to go west into the Jeffco Center with a service to Red Rocks, again South of the Mills.

After all this was done, the Mills owner wanted the rail to go up and service their location. However, that would entail an up and down line, like a roller coaster going up and down, North then South and adding significant run time. I do not recall that there was money proposed by the owners to make a costly change to the plans. Even just the change to the engineering plans would cost millions and we would still have land acquisition and construction costs.

Should the logic then entail servicing a private business and hoping that Mall would stay--it was in financial problems at that time and there is still questions about its viability. Oh, if we built a station near a closed dead mall, would you then criticize that logic and waste of resources? Yea, malls staying in business--that seems to be the trend today, so maybe the planning was prescient.

So, perhaps we should ask you, to learn a little more and use that logic which you decry in others before making cutting and sarcastic remarks. Not all people doing the planning are not stupid; not all city leaders are not stupid; not all government people are stupid. Sometimes decisions have to be made; budgets are tight and not all can be served by a fixed rail line.

Livecontent

[davebarnes]

[quote=Willy702;27594916]I marvel more at how the shopping districts on the west side get bypassed..../quote]
Shopping centers come and go.
What the train needs to do is pick places for stops.
If it is successful, then retail will grow around it.
See the Green Line in Boston. Also, remember that it took 50+ years for the neighborhoods around the line to assume their current shape.

Certain brick and mortar stores are disappearing. Best Buy, for example, will be gone within a few years.
So, you ignore all of that when determining the path of the choo-choo train.

[woob]

Another cool thing about the west line is the bike path which will run from denver to golden- Bicycle/Pedestrian Path

If you are physically able, why pay $4.50 for a train ride when you can hop on your bike?