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Old 10-06-2015, 09:49 AM
 
2,409 posts, read 2,627,228 times
Reputation: 1807

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Quote:
Originally Posted by smihaila View Post
Is it you really OWNING the property that you are renting out, or the Banksters!? Hadn't you taken it with a mortgage, you would've charged more humane prices, I guarantee that to you.

"Leaving money on the table"? Are you kidding me? All of you, the sole proprietors or big rental companies, are understood one with each other, and are hiding yourselves behind "market prices". What market prices? This is not a free market, the market is Y-O-U.

$1,600 for a sub-1000sqft, unmodernized apartment (25 year old with no renovation), in the boonies (crappy suburbs) - yeah, that's super-sustainable. And the price a year ago was ... $1,375!
Add to that deposits after deposits (i.e. $1,300 is held by them - it's been 2 years already now - without any interest at all - they wanted that because I was a Canadian and no damn "credit history" - my credit history in Canada is best - never owed anyone a cent and I've bought our house back in Canada WITH 100% CASH). And when you leave they want more of your money, inventing all sorts of "damages".

Another trick these big rental companies are doing: they SHIFT the ending date of your next leasing contract, so that you will have to renew near summer time. So that they can charge more! So for example, if your first rent year started in December, "they" will make sure to end the lease somewhere around June, July or August. Instead of agreeing to exactly 1-year contract.

Another drawback here comparing to how renting is done in other countries: You must renew on a yearly basis, even after a first complete lease year. In other countries, there are provisions allowing you to go month-to-month after the 1st year. You may argue that the same exists here, too. Yeah, that's only on paper (they will charge different, astronomical prices for a month-to-month mode).

Boo to this MAFIA! I can hardly wait for my residential situation here to stabilize and buy something on my own. Being a renter in Colorado (or Denver Greater Area at least) IS A SUPER-LOSING PROPOSITION. YOU ARE SKINNED AND MILKED TO DEATH.
Somebody skipped ECON 101.
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Old 10-06-2015, 10:03 AM
 
5,444 posts, read 4,811,646 times
Reputation: 15020
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyDog77 View Post

Again, can you look me in the eye and tell me with a straight face that you would give a complete stranger $12,000?
All I know is that I don't give strangers 5 bucks let alone 12,000.

To the OP and Smihalia, the market dictates the rents, not a business owner being 'nice'. If someone can rent a place out for 2,000 a month, they are going to. If they don't have any takers, they will lower the rent just enough to get someone into the place. If occupancy is 100% and they see other apartments being rented out for more, they will raise the rents.

This is business 101. When you go into the grocery store and see an apple for 99 cents. This price is the maximum amount the grocery store can charge where people will still buy them. Yes, they could charge 50 cents an apple, but businesses are in the business of making money. Now, if they raised the price of the apple to 5 dollars, nobody would buy the apples.
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Old 10-06-2015, 10:30 AM
 
Location: Prescott Valley, AZ
2,658 posts, read 2,304,927 times
Reputation: 2657
Quote:
Originally Posted by smihaila View Post
Is it you really OWNING the property that you are renting out, or the Banksters!? Hadn't you taken it with a mortgage, you would've charged more humane prices, I guarantee that to you.

"Leaving money on the table"? Are you kidding me? All of you, the sole proprietors or big rental companies, are understood one with each other, and are hiding yourselves behind "market prices". What market prices? This is not a free market, the market is Y-O-U.

$1,600 for a sub-1000sqft, unmodernized apartment (25 year old with no renovation), in the boonies (crappy suburbs) - yeah, that's super-sustainable. And the price a year ago was ... $1,375!
Add to that deposits after deposits (i.e. $1,300 is held by them - it's been 2 years already now - without any interest at all - they wanted that because I was a Canadian and no damn "credit history" - my credit history in Canada is best - never owed anyone a cent and I've bought our house back in Canada WITH 100% CASH). And when you leave they want more of your money, inventing all sorts of "damages".

Another trick these big rental companies are doing: they SHIFT the ending date of your next leasing contract, so that you will have to renew near summer time. So that they can charge more! So for example, if your first rent year started in December, "they" will make sure to end the lease somewhere around June, July or August. Instead of agreeing to exactly 1-year contract.

Another drawback here comparing to how renting is done in other countries: You must renew on a yearly basis, even after a first complete lease year. In other countries, there are provisions allowing you to go month-to-month after the 1st year. You may argue that the same exists here, too. Yeah, that's only on paper (they will charge different, astronomical prices for a month-to-month mode).

Boo to this MAFIA! I can hardly wait for my residential situation here to stabilize and buy something on my own. Being a renter in Colorado (or Denver Greater Area at least) IS A SUPER-LOSING PROPOSITION. YOU ARE SKINNED AND MILKED TO DEATH.
That's just how the market works, people want to move here and you can't stop them from doing so. Either find a better paying job, or find a cheaper place to move like what I'm doing.
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Old 10-06-2015, 11:27 AM
 
170 posts, read 181,894 times
Reputation: 107
As other posters have mentioned it is a matter of econ 101 and a landlord can't dictate the prices and rental prices can go down if there are more units being built. I think if you look hard enough and you are flexible on location you can find some deals out there even for new apartments. For example, a new complex behind the place I work in DTC wanted $1850 in rent for a 2 bedroom, but it seemed there were no takers so they reduced their price to $1700 and they offered a whopping 2 months in free rent. Which would reduce the rent close to $300 a month so effectively you are only paying a little above $1400 a month which is below the average rents for a 2 bedroom in Denver.
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Old 10-06-2015, 01:24 PM
 
411 posts, read 1,146,439 times
Reputation: 313
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyDog77 View Post
No I'm not kidding you. I appreciate the frustration. Really I do. I think the rental rates are a problem for the city, but I'm not going to give away money.

I still ask the question (which you did not answer), What would you do if you owned a rental and everyone around you was charging $3000 a month? Would you charge $2000?

The mortgage or lack there of has absolutely nothing to do with my pricing. I own some property free and clear and some with very low mortgages. My mortgage rates are all below 4% and less than 50% LTV. My personal financial situation does not dictate rental rates. The market does. I am not the market. If I try to charge too much, I will have a vacancy.

If everyone around me is charging $3000 and I charge $2000, I am giving away $12,000 a year. Plain and simple. I don't know you at all, why would I give you a gift of $12,000?

Again, can you look me in the eye and tell me with a straight face that you would give a complete stranger $12,000?
I will answer: If the average "market rate" is $3,000 (quotes emphasized) and I were a landlord who does not have to pay anything to the greedy Banksters, I would proceed as follows:
1. Identify who the main contributors to that "market rate" are: The big fat greedy rental COMPANIES, or individual owners.
2. If the main contributors are the COMPANIES, then I will be ok with rents prices around $2,250 (-25% discount).
3. If on the other hand it's mainly the small landlords dictating the "market prices", then I will still prefer to be honest, less greedy and compete with them and ask maybe $2,700 (-10% discount).

Overall, in any case, I will look FIRST at what kind of people those prospecting tenants are: family, serious people, no debt, COMMITTED PEOPLE. I would also be willing to discount the rate even more if they could commit for a 2 or even 3 year lease agreement. OR, if that's a no-no, I would be at least flexible and offer month-to-month once the 1-year lease period expires. This will show to SERIOUS tenant that I am also a SERIOUS, responsible and ETHICAL and HUMANE landlord.

Thank you.
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Old 10-06-2015, 01:28 PM
 
411 posts, read 1,146,439 times
Reputation: 313
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hschlick84 View Post
That's just how the market works, people want to move here and you can't stop them from doing so. Either find a better paying job, or find a cheaper place to move like what I'm doing.
What's with this "find a better paying job" suggestion. Let's see you first doing it and then we're talking :-)
It's so easy to talk and give advices. Are you also a renter, btw? Put yourself in the renter's shoes first.

The fact that one already has a good paying job (which I have), has nothing to do with how FAST the rent prices should increase year over year. The current rates are completely decoupled from the reality. Higher than CPI, higher than COL, inflation or even the growth rates in house sales.

Thanks.
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Old 10-06-2015, 01:30 PM
 
411 posts, read 1,146,439 times
Reputation: 313
Quote:
Originally Posted by AmFest View Post
Somebody skipped ECON 101.
Yeah, I truly skipped it, as I didn't buy into any mainstream propaganda and brainwashing. No debt Sir, and I live withing my means. Super frugal, massive saver (more than 75% saving rate) and one breadwinner in a family of four. I managed to buy a $400k house back in Canada, without anyone's help (not even from relatives, which I do not have here in North America).

Let's see - where do you stand???
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Old 10-06-2015, 01:33 PM
 
411 posts, read 1,146,439 times
Reputation: 313
Quote:
Originally Posted by BornintheSprings View Post
Take a macroeconomics course.
If you are so well-versed in macro-economics, kindly explain to me why this BIG mismatch and divergence in terms of growth rates, between fully detached, residential properties, and rental prices. Thank you in advance for your explanation. I'm also curious if you ever lived anywhere outside U.S or ever changed states or cities :-)
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Old 10-06-2015, 01:38 PM
 
Location: Denver CO
20,975 posts, read 11,615,689 times
Reputation: 31807
Quote:
Originally Posted by smihaila View Post
I will answer: If the average "market rate" is $3,000 (quotes emphasized) and I were a landlord who does not have to pay anything to the greedy Banksters, I would proceed as follows:
1. Identify who the main contributors to that "market rate" are: The big fat greedy rental COMPANIES, or individual owners.
2. If the main contributors are the COMPANIES, then I will be ok with rents prices around $2,250 (-25% discount).
3. If on the other hand it's mainly the small landlords dictating the "market prices", then I will still prefer to be honest, less greedy and compete with them and ask maybe $2,700 (-10% discount).

Overall, in any case, I will look FIRST at what kind of people those prospecting tenants are: family, serious people, no debt, COMMITTED PEOPLE. I would also be willing to discount the rate even more if they could commit for a 2 or even 3 year lease agreement. OR, if that's a no-no, I would be at least flexible and offer month-to-month once the 1-year lease period expires. This will show to SERIOUS tenant that I am also a SERIOUS, responsible and ETHICAL and HUMANE landlord.

Thank you.

And I suppose you told your employer to pay you 10% less, because it was only greedy workers who drove up salaries but that it was more ethical for you to get less money.
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Old 10-06-2015, 01:39 PM
 
Location: Washington Park, Denver
6,904 posts, read 6,494,653 times
Reputation: 7353
Quote:
Originally Posted by smihaila View Post
I will answer: If the average "market rate" is $3,000 (quotes emphasized) and I were a landlord who does not have to pay anything to the greedy Banksters, I would proceed as follows:
1. Identify who the main contributors to that "market rate" are: The big fat greedy rental COMPANIES, or individual owners.
2. If the main contributors are the COMPANIES, then I will be ok with rents prices around $2,250 (-25% discount).
3. If on the other hand it's mainly the small landlords dictating the "market prices", then I will still prefer to be honest, less greedy and compete with them and ask maybe $2,700 (-10% discount).

Overall, in any case, I will look FIRST at what kind of people those prospecting tenants are: family, serious people, no debt, COMMITTED PEOPLE. I would also be willing to discount the rate even more if they could commit for a 2 or even 3 year lease agreement. OR, if that's a no-no, I would be at least flexible and offer month-to-month once the 1-year lease period expires. This will show to SERIOUS tenant that I am also a SERIOUS, responsible and ETHICAL and HUMANE landlord.

Thank you.
How do you determine if the main contributors are companies or small landlords? That's a ridiculous notion. You seem to have it in your mind that we all get together once a month and set prices. That's not even remotely close to how it works. If we have more applicants than units, the rates go up. That's it. If we are sitting on vacancies, the rates go down.

In scenario 2, you are seriously going to give up $9000 a year? I don't believe that for a second. Your frustration with your current situation is clouding your reality.

I set my rates slightly below market because it gives me a better pick of tenants. Maybe $100-200. That's it. Anything else is giving away free money to strangers.

I NEVER sign leases longer than 1 year. Just like you seem to think most landlords are only out for themselves, my experience has been that tenants are even worse. They have no skin in the game. If I lock myself in to a 3 year lease and rates go up as they have, I'm stuck getting sub market rents. If a tenant locks themselves in to a 3 year lease and rates go down, they just leave because they know I'm not going to spend money going to court to recoup money they may or may not have. I had this happen to me early on when a tenant, who I thought was a good guy, asked me to lower the rent to help him out. I did. First $100 a month, then $200. There's $2400 a year I gave away. After a few months he broke the lease and moved out to a cheaper, smaller place. I stopped looking out for tenants after that because there is no upside for me to do so.

Rentals are my retirement plan. If I bought stocks and the stock markets went up a lot, would you be mad at me too? This is ridiculous.

Last edited by SkyDog77; 10-06-2015 at 02:19 PM..
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