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Old 12-11-2015, 09:13 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
86,871 posts, read 102,248,055 times
Reputation: 32940

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^^I would take some of these time estimates with a grain of salt. Yes, maybe you could drive from Evergreen to Denver in 1/2 hour at 3 AM on the 4th of July. Maybe you could drive to DIA in an hour then, too. But in ordinary everyday traffic, let alone snow, it will take longer, at times much longer. DIA is 51-59 miles from Evergreen, depending on the route taken, per Google. Evergreen to downtown Denver is 28-33 miles, depending on your route. While Google says one can get to DIA in 1 hr, 1 min; even they say 39-46 min to downtown. And that's with NO traffic!
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Old 12-11-2015, 10:02 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
5,608 posts, read 20,664,917 times
Reputation: 5338
Quote:
Originally Posted by Birdie'sMom View Post
Don't reply. Don't be feminine and insist on having the 'last word.' It's pathetic.
Birdie's Mom, don't take it personally. The forum does have a pretty cool feature: "http://www.city-data.com/forum/profi...?do=ignorelist." Come to think of it I'm going to make use of it myself.

Last edited by Mike from back east; 12-12-2015 at 12:23 PM..
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Old 12-11-2015, 10:16 PM
 
64 posts, read 64,309 times
Reputation: 72
lol. thank you for that info!
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Old 12-12-2015, 08:58 AM
 
99 posts, read 83,832 times
Reputation: 60
Birdies'sMom - I came back to this thread because I think I missed something. I might even be slightly offended. lol.

In reading the first response to Livecontent I've started to wonder if there's a disconnect between what you've described and what you're after.
Allow me to first express that I'm on this site for two reasons... to learn about Denver because my move is already official and to help people who are getting BS info about Orange County, CA.

Well, I actually typed a whole host of stuff... then I reminded myself that I was not only preaching... but it's pointless. So her goes my very scaled down version. lol.

Los Angeles and surrounding counties are very segregated. I'm assuming that's what you were saying when talking isolated.

Some constants: (I know you are aware Birdie, its for anyone else unfamiliar or lived in CA 10 year ago.)
Traffic
Drought - It's a desert folks. Much of the vegetation in Southern CA is transplanted.
Actors
Musicians
Writers
Dreamers
Poor
Rich
Wealthy
Arrogance
Ignorance
Displaced
... I can go on and on really. However, I'm willing to bet every gateway city has its share too.

You mention no Denver Proper. I get that, my vision of Colorado is Rocky Mountain National Park. That's my draw, but I can't have it without commuting. Which for me, is one nasty word.

But let me be blunt about some stuff. Cuz we're inter-web strangers right?

I grew up in a wealthy neighborhood. It's a mix between wealth and rich. Many of my classmates in H.S. drove Mercedes & BMW's as first cars. Range Rovers and the like. Most of the housing is in the million plus range, even for crappy beach cottages... which the majority have given way to mammoth new builds.
We have a strong Local's Only mentality... I'd never raise my children there. I just don't agree with the mindset any longer. Its uber safe, but the disease of thinking stuff gives you stature is misguided at best. Only turds care if you drive a BMW vs a Pinto.

Generations of kids are getting a real ****ty perspective on life. Feelings of superiority and entitlement. This comes from many things, but economic segregation is one... if one doesn't see the poor, homeless, and hungry... they don't feel the need to change it. Driving past it keeps one disconnected. The attitudes tend to favor the blame game... blaming the less fortunate vs feeling the need to bring them up.
You mentioned being bi-racial and your husband being black. You must know first hand the horrors of how stupid humanity is. As if you or your husband had a choice in the matter... ugh! I digress, it's my life's pet peeve. Ethnic hatred. Sorry.

My buddy lives in Castle Rock. He loves it... he commutes to downtown, about an hour he said.

I don't know any actors, but I do know many well known & famous musicians. I too am a musician, we are weird. Strange birds of a feather love to flock together... why not move to Aspen or wherever the Hollywood folk like to live in CO? Sounds like you might have more common interest there? Obviously location is of no concern, as long as an airfield is close enough.

2 cents on Home schooling. Sounds so safe right, but we need social exchanges to navigate life... one can't live in a bubble... they're destined to pop.

I didn't get any feeling you actually wanted to hang out with strangers within a community... or, maybe you only want those with similar economic standing. IDK? It's totally fine to want that, its not a strange behavior...

This isn't directed at Birdie... its directed at everyone. Myself included!
I always say, nobody asked to be born... don't punish them for it too. If you don't like the community because its not very educated... reach down, pull them up and share some knowledge. Geez, for so many, stop buying $100,000 cars and learn to be adult enough to drive that toyota. Take the extra $40k and save a life!

Off soapbox.. rant over... I'm sorry to be that guy!

Last edited by ZeusMutation; 12-12-2015 at 09:03 AM.. Reason: missing text added
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Old 12-12-2015, 09:09 AM
 
Location: CO
2,455 posts, read 2,608,148 times
Reputation: 5190
In all fairness, livecontent is a wealth of information about Denver and his input on city data is invaluable. In this particular case, not so much, but I certainly wouldn't discount his input.

Considering everything you have said I think you are suited very well for the Pinery and since you are finding homes that fit your criteria I'd go for it. Many have mentioned Evergreen but the lack of available homes is a non-starter. Welcome to Colorado!
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Old 12-12-2015, 09:17 AM
 
Location: Evergreen
397 posts, read 588,237 times
Reputation: 469
Katarina ~ you don't know actual commute times because you don't live in Evergreen. What you are saying just isn't true with the exception of the fact that snow (or a highway accident) will definitely slow you down.

I drove my husband from our house to DIA this past Tuesday (typically weekday work day...not a holiday). We left our home in South Evergreen at 8:20 a.m. as soon as our youngest got on the school bus and took Hwy 73 to Hwy 285 North to C-470 West to I-70 to the airport off the Pena Blvd exit. I was back home in my garage at 10:20 a.m. after stopping to fill up my car with gas in Aspen Park at the Loaf 'n' Jug. Do the math!

The other nice thing about modern technology is that one can check traffic before leaving and while driving as well. If there was traffic on I-70, I could've made the decision to take C-470 East to E-470 to DIA. There are options and DIA is certainly an hour away on most days out of a given year.







Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
^^I would take some of these time estimates with a grain of salt. Yes, maybe you could drive from Evergreen to Denver in 1/2 hour at 3 AM on the 4th of July. Maybe you could drive to DIA in an hour then, too. But in ordinary everyday traffic, let alone snow, it will take longer, at times much longer. DIA is 51-59 miles from Evergreen, depending on the route taken, per Google. Evergreen to downtown Denver is 28-33 miles, depending on your route. While Google says one can get to DIA in 1 hr, 1 min; even they say 39-46 min to downtown. And that's with NO traffic!
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Old 12-12-2015, 09:41 AM
 
64 posts, read 64,309 times
Reputation: 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeusMutation View Post
Birdies'sMom - I came back to this thread because I think I missed something. I might even be slightly offended. lol.

In reading the first response to Livecontent I've started to wonder if there's a disconnect between what you've described and what you're after.
Allow me to first express that I'm on this site for two reasons... to learn about Denver because my move is already official and to help people who are getting BS info about Orange County, CA.

Well, I actually typed a whole host of stuff... then I reminded myself that I was not only preaching... but it's pointless. So her goes my very scaled down version. lol.

Los Angeles and surrounding counties are very segregated. I'm assuming that's what you were saying when talking isolated.

Some constants: (I know you are aware Birdie, its for anyone else unfamiliar or lived in CA 10 year ago.)
Traffic
Drought - It's a desert folks. Much of the vegetation in Southern CA is transplanted.
Actors
Musicians
Writers
Dreamers
Poor
Rich
Wealthy
Arrogance
Ignorance
Displaced
... I can go on and on really. However, I'm willing to bet every gateway city has its share too.

You mention no Denver Proper. I get that, my vision of Colorado is Rocky Mountain National Park. That's my draw, but I can't have it without commuting. Which for me, is one nasty word.

But let me be blunt about some stuff. Cuz we're inter-web strangers right?

I grew up in a wealthy neighborhood. It's a mix between wealth and rich. Many of my classmates in H.S. drove Mercedes & BMW's as first cars. Range Rovers and the like. Most of the housing is in the million plus range, even for crappy beach cottages... which the majority have given way to mammoth new builds.
We have a strong Local's Only mentality... I'd never raise my children there. I just don't agree with the mindset any longer. Its uber safe, but the disease of thinking stuff gives you stature is misguided at best. Only turds care if you drive a BMW vs a Pinto.

Generations of kids are getting a real ****ty perspective on life. Feelings of superiority and entitlement. This comes from many things, but economic segregation is one... if one doesn't see the poor, homeless, and hungry... they don't feel the need to change it. Driving past it keeps one disconnected. The attitudes tend to favor the blame game... blaming the less fortunate vs feeling the need to bring them up.
You mentioned being bi-racial and your husband being black. You must know first hand the horrors of how stupid humanity is. As if you or your husband had a choice in the matter... ugh! I digress, it's my life's pet peeve. Ethnic hatred. Sorry.

My buddy lives in Castle Rock. He loves it... he commutes to downtown, about an hour he said.

I don't know any actors, but I do know many well known & famous musicians. I too am a musician, we are weird. Strange birds of a feather love to flock together... why not move to Aspen or wherever the Hollywood folk like to live in CO? Sounds like you might have more common interest there? Obviously location is of no concern, as long as an airfield is close enough.

2 cents on Home schooling. Sounds so safe right, but we need social exchanges to navigate life... one can't live in a bubble... they're destined to pop.

I didn't get any feeling you actually wanted to hang out with strangers within a community... or, maybe you only want those with similar economic standing. IDK? It's totally fine to want that, its not a strange behavior...

This isn't directed at Birdie... its directed at everyone. Myself included!
I always say, nobody asked to be born... don't punish them for it too. If you don't like the community because its not very educated... reach down, pull them up and share some knowledge. Geez, for so many, stop buying $100,000 cars and learn to be adult enough to drive that toyota. Take the extra $40k and save a life!

Off soapbox.. rant over... I'm sorry to be that guy!

Thanks for the reply. Part of us living LA is b/c we don't need to be around actors/entertainers. It's what we've had both of our entire adult lives. Not that all entertainers are bad, etc..obviously. It's just there's more to life than this business and living in 'Hollywood.' We don' mind living amongst people who have varying jobs. Teachers. Construction workers. Doctors. That stuff really doesn't matter, all we care about are when we cross paths in life, at the grocery, park or wherever, that people are generally kind and friendly. (*Not sure if you've noticed this about LA/Orange County, but ppl here don't really say 'hi,' in passing. Don't make eye contact and many times treat you like an alien if you dare nod w a smile in their direction. Is it everyone, all the time? No. Is it too often? Absolutely. We've had people be pretty snippy to my husband, or white women move their purse in the grocery aisle when they see him, (and he's not a 'thug' or stereotype lol) only later to have another person recognize him from TV, THEN all of that changes, and the 'scared' woman is now the biggest fan. It's weird in 2015 in a city like LA, I know, but it happens.)

Similar economic standing doesn't mean anything to us. We have that here. As I mentioned before, there are people with much more, and many people with even less, than us. We have friends that run the gamut between wealthy and struggling to live with 5 roommates and riding the bus. I'm from the Midwest. I don't give a rat's tail about what materialistic nonsense ppl have acquired, their titles or anything like that. What I care about again, is character, kindness and a sense of humility.

I definitely don't care about people's education. Again, I went to university, as did my husband, I have acquaintances who are double ivy league grads, and some who just finished high school. Some of the dumbest people I know have the most credentials. Literally. So again, none of that matters to me.

As for homeschooling, when people comment on its isolation and lack of 'community' I often wonder if they themselves have first hand experience of it, or even know anyone directly who is a true homeschooler. Homeschooling is actually more inclusive, community oriented, etc, than shipping these kids off to schools, where exclusivity is taught and learned, vs inclusivity. The kids still play sports, have groups, etc. The difference is, as parents, we don't' put the responsibility on strangers, the government and the student body to properly educate and prepare our children for the future. Our kids don't sit in oversized classrooms, in schools corrupted or disrupted by greed etc. They are out in the world, hands on, and we are all actively involved in their maturation within their learning environment. As they learn, we RE-learn, etc.

Homeschooling, when done properly, is a truly beautiful experience, for those fortunate enough to be able to stay home and afford to do it. The children are often more tolerant, less focused on nonsense (clothes, cliques, etc) more mature and less depressed/pressured (by the cattiness that permeates school halls/classes etc.) Again, we haven't' fully decided which path we will take, but we are open to it, b/c we will always do what is best for OUR children. Always. If that means placing them in a stellar school, with great programs/teachers and an awesome parent support system, so be it. But if that's not what is out there, wherever we end up, and homeschooling our children becomes the best option, we will do that, and do it well.

As for giving back, or judging people based off of how different they are to us, or how much they lack compared to us, that's not our issue whatsoever. Our children's birthdays, though celebrated, are a time for THEM to give back to those who aren't as fortunate, to instill in them, that their BIRTH day, was and is a time for giving blessing to others and being a blessing. We are not christian or anything. We are a spiritual family that believe that we are all One and there is no separation between ourselves and any other. Traditional holidays in America (xmas, thanksgiving) are treated the same. There are no gifts under the tree with our names on them, we sponsor families that go without.


We never considered Aspen. Just wasn't on our radar. I'll have to check it out. So far, I've gained a vibe that people have an odd preconceived notion about castle rock and parker. Like, the folks who choose to live there are snobby, stuck up, elitist, etc. Just an aside, we only gravitated towards these areas b/c we liked the space and found homes we would be willing to take on a mortgage for. Again, b/c we don't work in Denver, and have very untraditional careers, our only driving force for choosing our home, is that it's the home WE want to live in. It's not about how far it is to the city, or a job, etc. Though we may consider proximity to the airport, as we obviously still work sometimes in LA and will need to travel back and forth.

Our family is simple. We go to the grocery, movies, we bbq, play in the yard, go to the parks, kids places etc. We don't eat out everyday or need to be 'seen.'

I wish that what we saw in some parts of Denver proper in regards to ethnic diversity, we could find in CR and Parker, but alas, we can't all get everything we want. But we definitely aren't moving to CO, for a 'city' life. We've been there, done that already. We like the peace, quiet, and privacy. But it doesn't mean we don't love people and intend on interacting with whomever we encounter.

I agree wholeheartedly with how you described the OC. One of my best friends is from there. She's part italian. Looks like an average white woman to me but growing up down there she has said that she felt like a minority, simply b/c she had a bit of color to her and brunette hair. That says a lot.

Quite a few of the comments/replies on here have been deleted so it may be hard to follow has the convo has evolved throughout the thread. So I'm not sure what you may have been offended by
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Old 12-12-2015, 09:50 AM
 
64 posts, read 64,309 times
Reputation: 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost Roses View Post
In all fairness, livecontent is a wealth of information about Denver and his input on city data is invaluable. In this particular case, not so much, but I certainly wouldn't discount his input.

Considering everything you have said I think you are suited very well for the Pinery and since you are finding homes that fit your criteria I'd go for it. Many have mentioned Evergreen but the lack of available homes is a non-starter. Welcome to Colorado!

Hi! Thanks for the Welcome! As for LiveContent, he discounted himself as soon as he started typing. Sorry. I am here to gain knowledge, but in the end, I don't take any info from someone whom I don't feel I would deal with in real life, nor someone who makes it hard to have a mutual respect. I appreciate the native folk who have a wealth of information, but also understand in the end, everyone has opinions and ultimately there's only one me and that will be what my/our decision is made from. At this point, nothing he could say is of any worth or importance to me. I would't deal with him on the internet and I d*mn sure wouldn't deal with him in real life.
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Old 12-12-2015, 10:00 AM
 
99 posts, read 83,832 times
Reputation: 60
My offense was half-hearted. Only poking fun because I'm proud to be a Native Southern Californian.

I do know a few home schooled families. I agree, its what you make of it. My opinion is rooted in some of the more ugly aspects of public schooling. The social stuff that happens between classes. I think its good to learn how to navigate that at an early age.

The comment about eye contact and general politeness... Hilarious!! 100% agree... so I shock people by engaging, forcing them to run away or speak. Hahaha.

Good luck to you! Sounds like you'll do just fine.

Last edited by ZeusMutation; 12-12-2015 at 10:01 AM.. Reason: grammar
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Old 12-12-2015, 10:11 AM
 
Location: Evergreen
397 posts, read 588,237 times
Reputation: 469
Yes, residents of the foothills live with the threat of wildfire. There are thousands of other threats to individuals on a daily basis that makes the threat of wildfire just another one on the list. You can slip on a wet floor or down the stairs or on ice. You can get hit by a car at any point throughout the entire state of CO because we have a high rate of suicides, drunk drivers, pot heads, (not to mention elderly who shouldn't be licensed anymore). You can get killed by another skier on the slopes or die yourself by crashing into a tree on a downhill run.

Oh my goodness...you could get eaten by a mountain lion or attacked by an elk during rutting season because we have those animals up here too!

The risks to any human being on a daily basis are too numerous to really get into and certainly if one really spent time dwelling on and obsessing with them, would most likely result in a life in a padded room or a bubble.

Back to the original point brought up by mic111: there have been two evacuations in the foothills that I know of since I moved here in November 2008. The first was the prescribed burn that got out of control in the Lower North Fork Fire in March 2012 that involved residents in parts of Morrison, Conifer, and Littleton, resulted in the loss of three human lives and numerous homes. It was sad, awful, probably preventable if someone was smart enough to read the weather reports of the impending winds before deciding to light a match that day and sending out much more timely evacuation notices...who knows. The second was the Bluebell fire in June 2013 in Evergreen. It was caused by a 48 ft tree falling into power lines. One home was affected. No lives lost. There was a four mile radius of evacuations around the source of the fire for safety. The Lower North Fork Fire prompted a revised emergency notification system to be instituted which worked very well (to my knowledge) during the Bluebell fire.

In the event that there is a fire, local emergency crews have systems in place through a "CODE RED" alert system where you will get a text, recorded call, etc with a message that will tell you what level of evacuation you are at at that particular moment. It is based on your home address.

Residents of the foothills realize that there is the possibility of wildfire when they move here. We have a short list of items that we hope to be able to take out of our homes if there is an evacuation put in place such as irreplaceable family photos, computer hard drives, pets, a prized piece of art, etc. but if we don't have that opportunity then, oh well... Homeowner's insurance, with the correct coverages, will replace most things. I know, personally, if a fire blew through my neighborhood, I would want my house to burn down. I don't want firemen to try and save it so that I can come back and live in a charred out area with nothing around me. But, really. What are the chances of that happening in my lifetime? I personally feel the risk is minuscule compared to the everyday enjoyment and quality of life that my family and I get out of living in such a spectacular setting in an amazing location. One would be hard pressed to find another place in our country where you have a city with 5 major sports leagues and a wonderful vibe, an international airport within an hour, world-class skiing close-by, low property taxes, excellent public schools, and some personal space where you're not hearing your neighbor yell at his wife or dog incessantly bark.






Quote:
Originally Posted by mic111 View Post
When we were looking we looked at a number of homes in the foothills. Three times the showings were cancelled due to wildfire evacuations. We decided it was a sign and changed our emphasis to the flatlands. Our realtor told us, after we changed our target, that realtors love foothills buyers. They are good for at least 3 or 4 house transactions. Those from out of town buy a home there, sell it 3 or 4 years later and buy in the flatlands (3 transactions). Locals are good for 4 (sell Denver area, buy foothills, sell foothills, buy Denver area). Lots of people don't care for the wildfire danger, isolation, trouble getting around in the winter etc when they can negate all that by moving back to the front range.

In terms of availability more will open up in the spring. Not too many buyers up there when things get snowed and iced in on a regular basis so people don't have their houses on the market.

Denver area is an interesting mix of neighborhoods. You can get practically anything you want from city neighborhood to large lots. The quality of life is very high. Lots of good schools, strong communities, large lots, etc. are much closer in that you realize. In addition the farming towns around Denver grew outward and interconnected so that dotted throughout the area you get small town centers.
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