Ann Arbor to Denver??? Pros v. Cons??? Please Help!!! (Center: environment, student loans)

[mcb1025]

Alright, so I'm graduating with my bachelor's degree from the University of Michigan in April 08, and I'm looking to relocate. I've explored a few options (i.e. Scottsdale, Phoenix, mostly AZ cities) and surprisingly Denver has moved its way to the top of my list. I'm looking for the "big city" environment as most college grads are. I just don't want to wind up in NYC and Chicago like the rest of them. Climate is very crucial to me, because I'm very much into the outdoors. I really like to go cycling, and I'd like to get into hiking and mountain climbing as well. Most of the other threads in this forum have lead me to believe that Denver will provide an atmosphere for all of these things.


At this point, I'm just looking for a place to settle down. I'm very interested in living downtown. I've looked into some Denver neighborhoods, and Union Station, Five Points, N. and Capitol Hill, Civic Center seem to be located in the midst of all the action (near the major business, stadiums, etc.) Does anyone have any good suggestions about places to live? I'd even be willing to hear some new ideas as long as they're located near downtown and not the outskirts. I'm looking for something in the range of $600-$800/month. Do any of you natives have any suggestions where a 20-something can live economically and safely and still be in the big city? I'd really appreciate the help.

[Katiana]

I would suggest 1: do a search with the terms Denver, neighborhoods, apartments, etc, and 2: look in the index under those topics. There is lots of information on this forum about these issues.

[oberon]

Welcome! As a native of MI, Metro Detroit especially, I've visited Ann Arbor numerous times. My brother is an U of M graduate, and he also lives in Colorado -- formerly in Denver, but now in the mountains.

Opportunities for cycling, hiking, & mountain climbing are in abundance in Colorado, as I'm sure you know. Metro Denver in particular has a very large bike trail network.

That said, I've had friends/family who've spent much time in the Detroit & Ann Arbor area who have major concerns about personal safety, and assume the same problems occur here because it's also a big city. Let me assure you, most of Metro Denver is quite safe. That includes most of downtown and many neighborhoods close by. Denver is nothing like Detroit or Ann Arbor in this respect.

As Katiana says, there are plenty of threads by similar people looking for a similar place to live. I suggest you check out Mike from back east's index thread & try a search.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by mcb1025

Alright, so I'm graduating with my bachelor's degree from the University of Michigan in April 08, and I'm looking to relocate.

What line of work are you in? Does Denver have a good deal of those industries? Did you find out where in the region those facilities are?

[mcb1025]

Originally Posted by Charles

What line of work are you in? Does Denver have a good deal of those industries? Did you find out where in the region those facilities are?

Well as a soon to be college grad, I'm not really into any specific line of work yet. My major is in political science, but believe it or not, I actually want to stay away from politics, at least for now. I'm generally looking for something in finance or business. Unlike many grads my age, I have a good amount of administrative and technical experience from jobs I've had in the past. At this point, I'd be willing to take a variety of white collar type jobs given the pay is adequate for my needs. I'm actually looking into applying at the University of Colorado-Denver's or the University of Denver's MBA program so that I will become more marketable in those areas later. For now, I'm just looking for something that pays a college grad anywhere between 48k to 55k, which I don't think is too much to ask for from someone coming out of the great and almighty University of Michigan (haha, at least that's the reputation they market to their students). So that's what I'm looking for in terms of work. If anybody knows of any jobs that fit into this category that needs to be filled come April/May, please contact me.

Thanks so much for your responses so far. I'll be sure to investigate these forums more thoroughly. Until then, I look forward to receiving more feedback.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by mcb1025

For now, I'm just looking for something that pays a college grad anywhere between 48k to 55k,forums more thoroughly. Until then, I look forward to receiving more feedback.

That's pretty interesting. Those salaries are what engineers are making out of college. What might you actually do for that kind of salary straight out of school?

[mcb1025]

Originally Posted by Charles

That's pretty interesting. Those salaries are what engineers are making out of college. What might you actually do for that kind of salary straight out of school?

Those figures come from a breakdown of what I predict to be my expenses. $48k comes down to about 4k (or a little less after taxes) a month. First and foremost, I have a good chunk of college debt to pay off. I want to pay around $800-$1000 per month, so I don't find myself paying it at my death bed. I'd like to have a car, nothing expensive, but I figure that's another $400 a month with insurance (assuming I buy a cheap new car and make payments). I'm guessing an apartment will cost around $1000/month with utilities, depending on what comes with the apartment. There's probably another $1000 for food, travel expenses, clothes (I may need some new swag for work), small portions of entertainment, doctor visits and other such living expenses. Of course, these are slight overestimates, but I like to play it safe. I don't want to go writing home to mom and dad, not that they could help much, but you know what I mean.

So right there, off the bat, I'd be looking at anywhere between $3200 and $3400 a month in expenses. And considering I would like to retire, I figure I could save/invest a little bit of what's left over (if there is any). So now that $4000, or probably more accurately $3500 (after taxes, health, SS, 401k, etc) a month doesn't look like I'd be living such a grandiose lifestyle. I realize the cost of living on your own is quite steep, because I'm doing it now in Ann Arbor where I go to school. I've done some research, and the cost of living in Denver is a little higher than it is here. So I know the $800-1000/month I make working part time that can't even cover my measly expenses now (hence the reason for student loans) won't cut it out there.

This all comes down to practicability. I'm not asking for a pretentious amount of money, just enough to cover the basics...for now . If I need to accept a little less, I can find ways to cut corners. I have a solid background in economics and even more so, I've had good experience doing it while living on my own on such a tight budget. With my work experience in administrative/accounting/IT fields (5 yrs) and 4 years of education at a "public ivy" school (as they like to be referred to), I think this salary is not much to ask for if I were to get into an entry level finance, marketing, IT, accounting, or related position. Whew, sorry that was so long winded. But hopefully that makes a little more sense to you. I'm not just another snobby college grad expecting the world to be handed to me because I just got my degree (haha). Like I said before, I'm willing to accept lower. But as any sensible labor bargainer does, I start high, then go lower.

[Katiana]

Hopefully, you have some money saved for your job search. You will probably have to do it here in Denver.

[mcb1025]

Originally Posted by Katiana

Hopefully, you have some money saved for your job search. You will probably have to do it here in Denver.

I'm going to start applying in the coming weeks online when I have a break from school. I may also visit for a weekend during the break, so that I can become more acquainted with the city. During that time I may get a chance to visit some potential employers.

[vegaspilgrim]

mcb1025, don't want to burst your bubble, but as someone who will soon be graduating myself, I think it's unrealistic to expect to make 48-55k the day out of college. As Charles said, if you were an engineer, that would be very doable-- I've heard that graduates of the Colorado School of Mines in certain engineering specialties, for example, can make upwards of 90K straight out of college. With a liberal arts, I doubt it. Have you ever taken economics? Basic law of economics: what you will earn is based off of what your skills and experience are valued in the job market-- not off what you would like to earn to support the lifestyle you want. In your calculations, you've made quite a number of assumptions. "Cheap new car"? What makes you think you have to have a new car? I drive a car that's over 15 years old, cost $5,500 when I bought it, but because it's a well maintained Japanese car, it still runs great, and I plan on driving it as long as it runs way into the future.

Second, you're falling into the same trap I was in until very recently. You need to zero on on what it is you want to do. You don't need to have your whole life plan figured out, just a 5 year plan. To say you want to do some kind of "white collar" work is too vague. A lot of the fields you mentioned, like accounting, finance, etc, are going to require additional business education. Not that poly sci is a bad degree, not at all, but for anything above bare bones entry level jobs; just a Political Science degree isn't going to cut it. One thing you can get into straight out of college is a sales position-- some kind of business to business sales. That may be an option you might want to consider-- but don't expect 50k right off the bat either.

Good luck with your job search! Priority one: zoom in on exactly what field it is you want to do.