A Review of the Denver Metro Area (Colorado Springs, Aurora: gated, for sale)

[DENVERBULLDOG]

Traffic Engineer, sociologist, construction consultant, and urban planner, all in one! wow!

Denver is too spread out and too compact at the same time. You are able to jump from roof to roof but complain about the sprawl...what do you suggest? houses further apart, thus more sprawl?

Whatever city you came from, it must have been nice. No traffic, perfectly segregated, no sprawl but not crowded...let me know what it is cause I want to move there!

I think the problems you just described are true of about every city in the country.

[tfox]

The OP does have a point here. The condition of the highways are dreadful in the Denver area. CDOT has precious little money to do anything to fix them. CDOT relies on a revenue stream that declines every year (gas tax), but faces construction material cost increases that rise by double-digit percentages every year (concrete, steel -- mostly demand from China). The I-70 viaduct east of I-25 is in horrid condition. It's on the borderline of being a public safety hazard, though CDOT does their absolute best to keep putting bandaids on that decrepid bridge to keep the motorists safe. It's unclear how much longer CDOT is going to be able to do that.

It's not CDOT's fault -- IMO they are a very efficient, professional outfit doing the very best they can. They are squeezed from three sides: declining revenues, spiraling construction costs, and a rapidly expanding population sprawling further and further into rural areas. How can they possibly keep up?

[steveco.]

Most likely we will see more in the way of toll roads unfortunately similar to the toll proposal on I-70 in the mountains. Other options is to hike up gas tax like california style which is going to be great since its already expensive. Who knows with the way prices are going the highway might go the way of the dinosaur.

[denverian]

Some of what you say about traffic is true, but overall, it sounds like you're fairly young and haven't travelled much. By the time I was 22, I had lived in Germany for three years and travelled to over 25 countries and many major cities of the world. I've also been to every major city in the U.S. Denver isn't that crowded and houses aren't packed together. It's all relative to what you've experienced, but there are much more densely populated cities than the Denver metro area. I'd say it's suburbs are fairly average, maybe a bit denser than other U.S. cities.

If you don't like cities, then I wouldn't expect anything positive. I don't like rural areas, so I'd give a very negative review of somewhere like Limon.

[denverian]

Originally Posted by tfox

The OP does have a point here. The condition of the highways are dreadful in the Denver area. CDOT has precious little money to do anything to fix them. CDOT relies on a revenue stream that declines every year (gas tax), but faces construction material cost increases that rise by double-digit percentages every year (concrete, steel -- mostly demand from China). The I-70 viaduct east of I-25 is in horrid condition. It's on the borderline of being a public safety hazard, though CDOT does their absolute best to keep putting bandaids on that decrepid bridge to keep the motorists safe. It's unclear how much longer CDOT is going to be able to do that.

It's not CDOT's fault -- IMO they are a very efficient, professional outfit doing the very best they can. They are squeezed from three sides: declining revenues, spiraling construction costs, and a rapidly expanding population sprawling further and further into rural areas. How can they possibly keep up?

Thanks for the explanation. I wondered why some roads are in such horrible condition, like 270. And I didn't understand why freeways like 225 and 270 are only 2 lanes in a city this size, especially when there's plenty of room to widen them.

Replacing that I-70 viaduct is going to be a huge mess someday. Wouln't they basically have to close it down for years? Or at least one side, then the other?

[Shonuff]

Originally Posted by DENVERBULLDOG

Traffic Engineer, sociologist, construction consultant, and urban planner, all in one! wow!

Denver is too spread out and too compact at the same time. You are able to jump from roof to roof but complain about the sprawl...what do you suggest? houses further apart, thus more sprawl?

Whatever city you came from, it must have been nice. No traffic, perfectly segregated, no sprawl but not crowded...let me know what it is cause I want to move there!

I think the problems you just described are true of about every city in the country.

Sorry I didn't type that too well. What I'm trying to say is that the places where people work is very centralized mainly around two areas. Everything is built around these areas (Downtown & DTC). However houses don't start becoming affordable until you hit the farthest edges of the metro area (castle rock for example). In my opinion what would have been better would be to have places of work scattered everywhere and not centralized in two area. This way it allows people lo live wherever they want because they won't all work in the same area. I guess this is what I prefer because its what I experienced while living in Florida. Its kind of like if they did what was built in Lone tree. Put up some commercial and industrial areas in your town. If each town had an area like this then people could pick and choose and perhaps have a far less stressful commute because not only are people not commuting all to the same area but they probably wouldn't have to go as far either. I could be wrong maybe there are serious flaws to building out an area like that but Im just throwing it out there.

[tfox]

Originally Posted by denverian

Replacing that I-70 viaduct is going to be a huge mess someday. Wouln't they basically have to close it down for years? Or at least one side, then the other?

Well, CDOT has already done some studies of the corridor, though they don't have any money to actually act on the studies. You can read about it at i70east.com

Since the viaduct is near the end of its life, SOMETHING has to be done in the next decade or so. CDOT can simply replace the viaduct with a new one (no widening), replace and widen the viaduct in the existing corridor, or realign the corridor slightly to the north (paralleling I-270 for a few miles, heading due west, and following the railroad corridor back to the existing corridor). The realignment option is the most expensive, but would have the least disruption of existing traffic during construction. You're right, any attempt to build on the existing corridor would be very disruptive, as likely traffic would be forced onto one bridge while the other one is rebuilt, and vice-versa.

[steveco.]

There are actually many employment centers scattered throughout the metro area. Boulder, Interlocken, Commerce city, Federal Center, Meridian, DTC, and the Downtown. Mainly having a centeralized employment center works best for ease of infrastructure and convenience of corporations. You can still live wherever you want and affordability isn't so much a factor of distance from places of work but rather ease of commute and ammenities close by. Florida is a mess of urban sprawl which is not a model to follow.

[wanttomoveeast]

The part you wrote about CDOT and I-70 made me think of that beam that fell on that family, remember? Anyway, I was thinking to your last question, it shouldn't be how can they keep up, it should be why aren't they keeping up and they better keep up. Just on the safety issue anyway.

Originally Posted by tfox

The OP does have a point here. The condition of the highways are dreadful in the Denver area. CDOT has precious little money to do anything to fix them. CDOT relies on a revenue stream that declines every year (gas tax), but faces construction material cost increases that rise by double-digit percentages every year (concrete, steel -- mostly demand from China). The I-70 viaduct east of I-25 is in horrid condition. It's on the borderline of being a public safety hazard, though CDOT does their absolute best to keep putting bandaids on that decrepid bridge to keep the motorists safe. It's unclear how much longer CDOT is going to be able to do that.

It's not CDOT's fault -- IMO they are a very efficient, professional outfit doing the very best they can. They are squeezed from three sides: declining revenues, spiraling construction costs, and a rapidly expanding population sprawling further and further into rural areas. How can they possibly keep up?

[cobeachgirl]

Originally Posted by denverian

Thanks for the explanation. I wondered why some roads are in such horrible condition, like 270. And I didn't understand why freeways like 225 and 270 are only 2 lanes in a city this size, especially when there's plenty of room to widen them.

While I don't have a technical explanation for this, an acquaintance of mine is a transportation planner. When I asked him why C470 (and you can apply this to the roads mentioned above) across Highlands Ranch wasn't just made 3 lanes when they built it, he said that basically at the time, that is all that was needed as well as limited money available, along with additional environmental studies, etc, etc, required. I think he also said that historically, highways in general most everywhere are not built as big as they can be built to begin with, only what is needed at the time. There is also that saying "build it and they will come", meaning, widen/build the road and you'll have more people using it, and more development along said road. It didn't make me feel any better sitting in traffic when I used to drive that stretch of road, but I'm just saying there is a lot more to it than meets the eye.