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I may have over spoken there. California is a big state. Some parts, especially the coastline north of San Francisco may be more green then Denver.
Yes, if you are rich enough and can afford the water, you can make anything green. The problem in California is that most of the state gets no precipitation from May to September. Which means that your lawn is 100% dependent on your own water for half the year. Most Californian's elect to fill their yards with low water use plants and trees, and forget about green grass. You just don't see the large green lawns in California that are typical in Denver.
So California has a much greater verity of vegetation then Colorado, but general is not as green, IMHO.
Are you kidding? This is the land of over-watered, year-round green lawns and non-native species.
In your picture of Denver, I see a lot of streets with big mature trees. We may not have as many tree-lined streets, but believe me, nearly every house has a green lawn regardless of season.
I'm gonna dive into the whole green thing and state that most of the people considered with "green" are either from the eastern U.S. or the Pacific Northwest, and frankly, neither Phoenix nor Denver compares. Phoenix's Sonoran landscaping is beautiful, no doubt (when done right), and part of it's appeal is that it is so UNLIKE those two "green" regions, but Denver, while being a pale imitation, is closer to what most easterners and PNers I think are looking for when they say they're looking for "green."
That said, we're both dry and mostly brown across much of our cities for much of the year. Personally I don't have a problem with that.
I may have over spoken there. California is a big state. Some parts, especially the coastline north of San Francisco may be more green then Denver.
Yes, if you are rich enough and can afford the water, you can make anything green. The problem in California is that most of the state gets no precipitation from May to September. Which means that your lawn is 100% dependent on your own water for half the year. Most Californian's elect to fill their yards with low water use plants and trees, and forget about green grass. You just don't see the large green lawns in California that are typical in Denver.
So California has a much greater verity of vegetation then Colorado, but general is not as green, IMHO.
Well it also takes a large amount of extra water to make Denver look the way it does in the summer (the rainfall we get in the summer is not nearly enough to support Kentucky bluegrass and large maple and elm trees). So IF the city of Denver is greener in the summer then California cities it's more indicative of the poor water conservation ethic in the state then it is of favorable growing conditions for eastern landscape plants.
Well trying to compare anything about Phoenix and Denver is apples and oranges. But since we are anyway. First I don't have another picture of #2. Second, I choose picture #1, because I thought it represented a nice example of typical southwest desert landscaping.
I don't buy your argument that older neighborhoods in Phoenix are more green. I don't know enough about Phoenix to know which neighborhoods are old. My understanding is there is not a lot of old in Phoenix. But I will guess that the neighborhoods near Downtown Phoenix are pretty old. The houses look old anyway. I'll include a streetview picture of one such area near Downtown, to show that it's just like the other picture. Sand and palm trees. I'll also include aerial photos of Phoenix and Denver (same zoom level). Which should be a slam dunk to prove which is more green, and will hopefully end this silly argument.
Phoenix
Denver
Not to keep harping on this subject here, but that picture looks like it was taken in a total ghetto-- I'm guessing somewhere a mile or two east of downtown Phoenix? North-central Phoenix, the Biltmore area, Arcadia, the older parts of Tempe-- can be really lush and green, as far as a desert city goes.
Yeah, Denver is way more green than Phoenix or anywhere in the desert southwest during the summer, no doubt about it. My point though is that only lasts 6 months out of the year here-- the other 6 months this is a total brown town, other than for pine trees and juniper landscaping. Whereas the greenery that is in Phoenix lasts year round.
I have made my fair share of trips to Scottsdale to the Fiesta Bowl or now I guess they call it the Tostitos Bowl. Parts of Scottsdale in the winter months are very lush, green and manicured. I used to marvel at the greenery in fact. I love seeing ornamental banana,queen palms,and flowered cover arbors in January. Denver is actually pretty green a few months out of the year depending on location, but generally short lived. I think Vegas's over all analysis pretty well summed it up actually. The stark landscape does tend to get monotonous in the winter to me at times, but the weather kind of makes up for it a bit..IMO.
If Denver is cold for you; never come to the upper Midwest in the winter time. Denver is practically tropical compared to Iowa in January. People literally wear t-shirts here when the mercury hits 35 degrees after a long period of below freezing day highs! That actually feels warm after the dead of winter!
* ...the climate. It's so dry that wearing contact lenses (necessary after vision surgery that went wrong) becomes almost impossible. That it's not unusual to bend your fingers and have your knuckles bleed. That you can simply expect to wake up with a nosebleed, every winter morning.
Yep, the lack humidity is one thing people here tout as making Denver desirable. The elevation compared with the near desert air is just uncomfortable and it feels gross.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cueroso
* ...the barrenness. It's not in -- or really, even all that near -- the lovely Colorado spruce forests of the mountains. It's firmly situated on the treeless plains, and any tree in the city was forced to be there; it didn't
happen naturally.
Denverites claim the mountains as part of the allure of the city. This is despite the fact that these prized mountains are often obscured in obscure particulate matter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cueroso
* ...the "brown-ness". Mostly because it is so dry and so high, even in the summer most of the vegetation is.....brown. Most of the year, the leaves (if there are any at all) are.....brown. The branches are.....brown. The heavily polluted air is.....brown. The buildings are.....brown. The grass is.....brown. Everything is.....brown.
Everything here is brown and people seem to have no problem with it. The trees, grass, houses, buildings, air and widespread manure are all some hue of beige or brown! Disgustingly depressing. I find Phoenix to be greener than Denver!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cueroso
* ...the dustiness. Denver is the only place I've ever been that could actually still be dusty during a snowstorm!
I attribute much of the "dust" to agricultural particles floating around (manure, carcass dust from slaughterhouses, and decaying crops). Denver also gets dust from the desert areas to the southwest. Car exhaust also gets into the mix, creating a nice blend of a sand, manure, death, decay and carbon monoxide that we have the pleasure of breathing day in and day out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cueroso
* ...the blandness. Denver is not the place you come to be inspired. It's not a destination, it's a stopover on the way to somewhere else. And that's reflected in the really pretty boring sameness and blandness of the city: not much diversity, a half-hearted attempt at "culture", a smugness that comes of being the largest city for hundreds and hundreds of miles in any direction (you see the same kind of smugness, for example, in Spokane --- for the same reason, although it's not as large as Denver).
I am glad someone realizes this! Denver is about as bland and Middle America as a city comes. There is no diversity to architecture and everything is just so dull.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cueroso
* ...the dark, looming, squat, oppressive architecture. Denver is an old railroad and mining-supply town, and it shows. Even newer residential areas still have a very low-slung, "squat", broad-based, looming, bulky, dark style that varies very little from one area to another, and becomes really rather oppressive and depressing.
This architecture is here is just boring. That's the way people here seem to like it! I miss a lot of the fantastic architecture that you see in other cities. The buildings here just blend in with the dull yellowish-brown color of the endless prairies.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cueroso
* ...the provincial attitudes. For all its wannabe aspirations toward being a cosmopolitan big city, there are an awful lot of very backward and backwoods attitudes that cling to the city. Example: try to buy a bottle of wine to go with dinner, at the supermarket....
Denver does pride itself on having cattle hotfooting down its downtown streets every winter for the stock show. That makes it very difficult to take Denver seriously as a cosmopolitan place. Imagine farm animals sprinting down a street in LA, NY, Dallas, or DC. It would be a truly chilling experience.
Denver can be better with some work! Hopefully it materializes one day.
Last edited by CO_Transplant; 03-15-2011 at 12:01 AM..
If Denver is cold for you; never come to the upper Midwest in the winter time. Denver is practically tropical compared to Iowa in January. People literally wear t-shirts here when the mercury hits 35 degrees after a long period of below freezing day highs! That actually feels warm after the dead of winter!
Ok, well, if you think that the Midwest is cold, why don't you come to my house located in the center of the South Pole...OK my point is there's always Somewhere colder, but thats not the point. It Does get cold in Denver, no one could justify a debate against that.
Denver does pride itself on having cattle hotfooting down its downtown streets every winter for the stock show. That makes it very difficult to take Denver seriously as a cosmopolitan place. Imagine farm animals sprinting down a street in LA, NY, Dallas, or DC. It would be a truly chilling experience.
Denver can be better with some work! Hopefully it materializes one day.
Frankly, I think the cattle drive (very contrived these days), makes Denver. . . Denver. I got into a "discussion" on a different forum about this. Someone asked, "Is that anything to be proud of?". I said "Yes, eat much?" I mean really. As for DC, there's so much nonsense going on there, what difference would a cattle drive make?
Yep, the lack humidity is one thing people here tout as making Denver desirable. The elevation compared with the near desert air is just uncomfortable and it feels gross.
Denverites claim the mountains as part of the allure of the city. This is despite the fact that these prized mountains are often obscured in obscure particulate matter.
Everything here is brown and people seem to have no problem with it. The trees, grass, houses, buildings, air and widespread manure are all some hue of beige or brown! Disgustingly depressing. I find Phoenix to be greener than Denver!
I attribute much of the "dust" to agricultural particles floating around (manure, carcass dust from slaughterhouses, and decaying crops). Denver also gets dust from the desert areas to the southwest. Car exhaust also gets into the mix, creating a nice blend of a sand, manure, death, decay and carbon monoxide that we have the pleasure of breathing day in and day out.
I am glad someone realizes this! Denver is about as bland and Middle America as a city comes. There is no diversity to architecture and everything is just so dull.
This architecture is here is just boring. That's the way people here seem to like it! I miss a lot of the fantastic architecture that you see in other cities. The buildings here just blend in with the dull yellowish-brown color of the endless prairies.
Denver does pride itself on having cattle hotfooting down its downtown streets every winter for the stock show. That makes it very difficult to take Denver seriously as a cosmopolitan place. Imagine farm animals sprinting down a street in LA, NY, Dallas, or DC. It would be a truly chilling experience.
Denver can be better with some work! Hopefully it materializes one day.
I really think you don't know what you're talking about. Mountains obstructed by obscure particulate matter? Um, that never happens! The only times I can't see the mountians are when the humidity / water vapor levels are high - the white haze then hides the mountains. But I have NEVER seen a brown "particulate matter" haze hide the mountains. And where are you getting this illusion of manure spread over the city? That's ridiculous and not true at all.
Also, we don't get any southwest dust. Do you know why? There's these things called mountain ranges in the way. Never experienced this one either.
One of the only things you get right is the brown thing. I'm sorry, but that's just how the landscape is here, and actually, that's how the landscape is throughout much of California also. I remember visiting the LA area and it was very brown and dusty - similar to how Denver is. Our suburban homes, because apprently you haven't noticed, were painted the way they are in order to compliment the color of the natural landscape. It's fine if you don't like that, it's not for everyone of course. My points above still stand...
There is a difference between having personal preferences that differ from what a city has to offer and explaining them, and downright telling lies about a place. You're doing the latter.
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