Just how hard is it to get a job in Denver right now? (Grand Junction: unemployment, high school)

[vegaspilgrim]

Originally Posted by Cylence

When you look online there are thousands of jobs available in the Denver area. It just seems like a lot of people are assuming that those jobs won't be enough so they chose to do nothing at all. Its a matter of how bad do you want the money and how much "pride" can you put aside. I have a friend that moved to Denver a couple weeks ago and landed a job in no time. Its $10 an hour at applebees. I know this isn't big bucks, but assuming you arent one of the millions of americans that financed themselves into a corner with a life they can't afford, it'll pay the bills.

I respectfully disagree with you.

--Just because you see jobs posted "online," (whether that's companies' career websites or craigslist/monster/careerbuilder ads) doesn't mean that all those positions are currently available, going to be filled, or necessarily open to outside candidates (regardless of what the "official" policy is).

--Not everybody is career oriented, and that's okay. Nothing wrong with people out there who will take any old job that "pays that bills." Without those people, we'd be living in a top heavy society with too many cooks in the proverbial kitchen. But some people have spent years acquiring education and skills and have long term goals & aspirations to further develop themselves and help grow/start a business. Without those people, we would be living in a poverty stricken third world country.

--Many people could not get an unskilled, low paying job even if they wanted to, because they are instantly considered "overqualified." Unless if they are able to successfully fabricate/doctor up their resume. Companies don't want to hire people who they think will leave the job as soon as something they want better comes around.

--Not everybody is single, living with roommates, owning nothing with no obligations. $10 an hour is not going to pay the bills for anyone with children or a family to support. It's not going to cut it for someone who wants "luxuries" like health insurance and visiting a dentist regularly.

[80skeys]

I just returned from a job-interviewing trip to San Francisco and I'd like to share my impressions. I came away from two official interviews and one informal meeting with the impression that things aren't as good as one would be led to believe by the number of job postings on the internet. My feeling is that:

(1) companies are skimping a lot on their offered salaries
(2) business is slow
(3) the number of jobs advertised does not jibe with the number of real positions that need to be filled

The first place I interviewed was a small consulting firm in downtown S.F. I was (and am) one of the top two candidates being considered. I walked away from that meeting knowing that they are most definitely not desperate to hire, even though they claimed that their business was doing well.

The second place was a large firm in Silicon Valley. In this situation, I was told that the higher salaries were not on the table these days. They're offering much less (-$30K) than they used to. I think they felt embarrassed to make a formal offer to me knowing my lengthy experience and expertise.

The third meeting was an informal meeting with a recruiter whom had set me up with some interviews in Seattle a few months ago. He informed me that in the Bay Area there are only a few openings on a sporadic basis and things are slow.

My predictions for the foreseeable future are the following:

(1) Those of us in high-level IT technical positions (non management) jobs will find it very difficult or impossible to make a lateral move while keeping the same salary. If we want to make the move we'll have to take a 20-30% cut.

(2) Since the Bay Area is an important barometer of the IT industry, it means the situation is worse and will continue to stay worse in most other major cities in the U.S.

(3) The effects of poor state economies has yet to impact private business. Once state employees are furlowed in large numbers, these employees will try to make the move to the private sector. This will saturate the private sector resulting in more competition and lower salaries for everybody.

This situation will be good in the long run for recent college grads and entry level IT people. It will be bad for those of us technical gurus who are used to making higher salaries.

IT managers, of course, will continue to make ridiculous ($130K) salaries while doing nothing worthwhile.

As a side note, my colleague at work has decided to move back to the Front Range. He's in job-applying mode and has sent out lots of applications and resumes. Like myself, he is a high level, experienced IT person with three decades. Responses have been minimal. Most of his applications have gone unanswered. He's had one or two interviews and those have not resulted in any offers.

Time to start my own business.

[denverian]

Originally Posted by vegaspilgrim

I respectfully disagree with you.

--Just because you see jobs posted "online," (whether that's companies' career websites or craigslist/monster/careerbuilder ads) doesn't mean that all those positions are currently available, going to be filled, or necessarily open to outside candidates (regardless of what the "official" policy is).

--Not everybody is career oriented, and that's okay. Nothing wrong with people out there who will take any old job that "pays that bills." Without those people, we'd be living in a top heavy society with too many cooks in the proverbial kitchen. But some people have spent years acquiring education and skills and have long term goals & aspirations to further develop themselves and help grow/start a business. Without those people, we would be living in a poverty stricken third world country.

--Many people could not get an unskilled, low paying job even if they wanted to, because they are instantly considered "overqualified." Unless if they are able to successfully fabricate/doctor up their resume. Companies don't want to hire people who they think will leave the job as soon as something they want better comes around.

--Not everybody is single, living with roommates, owning nothing with no obligations. $10 an hour is not going to pay the bills for anyone with children or a family to support. It's not going to cut it for someone who wants "luxuries" like health insurance and visiting a dentist regularly.

Great post! I've applied for over 150 jobs in the past year that were in line with my experience/degree, and nothing yet, although I have a third interview next week on a job and had a good interview last week for a federal job, so I may be employed soon. But I can't take a $10 an hour job when daycare for our kids costs $20 an hour!! Not everyone can take just any job. I do know people who've taken jobs that paid much less than they were making and they had to sell the house, half their belongings, and downsize significantly.

[Idunn]

I think you are correct and, like it or not, your best business may lie in helping to outsource the very positions looked at.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by 80skeys

(1) Those of us in high-level IT technical positions (non management) jobs will find it very difficult or impossible to make a lateral move while keeping the same salary. If we want to make the move we'll have to take a 20-30% cut.

This has been the case in Denver-Boulder for some time. DH does non-management high-level IT. He got laid off several years back, and had that experience. It took a while to get back up to what he was making.

[80skeys]

Originally Posted by denverian

But I can't take a $10 an hour job when daycare for our kids costs $20 an hour!! Not everyone can take just any job.

Nor should you. You should expect and seek out your fair share, or close to it. Your pay needs to be in line with the value of the work you perform, how much education is needed to do that work, how skilled of a job it is, and how important it is.

[WhereTheSidewalkEnds]

Originally Posted by vegaspilgrim

I respectfully disagree with you.

--Just because you see jobs posted "online," (whether that's companies' career websites or craigslist/monster/careerbuilder ads) doesn't mean that all those positions are currently available, going to be filled, or necessarily open to outside candidates (regardless of what the "official" policy is).

--Not everybody is career oriented, and that's okay. Nothing wrong with people out there who will take any old job that "pays that bills." Without those people, we'd be living in a top heavy society with too many cooks in the proverbial kitchen. But some people have spent years acquiring education and skills and have long term goals & aspirations to further develop themselves and help grow/start a business. Without those people, we would be living in a poverty stricken third world country.

--Many people could not get an unskilled, low paying job even if they wanted to, because they are instantly considered "overqualified." Unless if they are able to successfully fabricate/doctor up their resume. Companies don't want to hire people who they think will leave the job as soon as something they want better comes around.

--Not everybody is single, living with roommates, owning nothing with no obligations. $10 an hour is not going to pay the bills for anyone with children or a family to support. It's not going to cut it for someone who wants "luxuries" like health insurance and visiting a dentist regularly.

Couldn't rep you again, but this is spot on.

My husband was laid off (IT) last July. Just started a contract to hire gig last week.

The job hunting process has been interesting, to say the least.

People seem to think that it would be a snap to get a job at lets say Home Depot - but why would they hire someone they know would still continue looking for a job? Wouldn't make sense. Not all professionals who had a higher salary were living high on the hog with tons of debts.

We have a very modest home, we have cut back everything we can - don't even pay for t.v. any longer. But we do have a child who will be starting college in two years.

My husband had several jobs he interviewed for, so I suppose he was lucky because for some it's been hard to even get to that point. In the end, what he found he found through someone he knew. Networking has been key for him.

[Katarina Witt]

^^Congrats on your husband's job. I have a couple neighbors who have been out of work for ~ 2 yrs now. They work in IT. There are some companies who will hire overqualified people and some who won't. The job seeker is at the mercy of the employers' biases.

[Vision67]

Welcome to the new deflationary economy. Any job that can be done on a computer that has as its output a file that can be sent over the internet is vulnerable to wage arbitrage. The best defense is to find a livelihood that is both high added value and is difficult to outsource. If possible, work for yourself.

[80skeys]

Yes a lot of stuff is being outsourced. The economy in India is booming due to this fact. I've been told that real estate in large cities in India, such as Bangalore, has skyrocketed and is even more expensive than New York City.

On the other hand, I've done a little consulting recently and have gotten the impression that small internet hosting companies in the U.S. are making a good business of it. The place I consulted with does web and email hosting and they told me their business is expanding rapidly. This is probably due to the fact that they charge less than larger competitors and this is appealing to small business clients looking to save a buck.

And consultants for complicated, high demand business applications are in a good business as well. I don't see this changing at all. If you are an expert in such things as SAS, Microstrategy, Filenet, and other enterprise class software, you can still demand a pretty penny for your services.

Additionally there are plenty of opportunities to be explored in software development and consulting, which know no national boundaries - you can do these things as easily in the United States as elsewhere.

I'm seriously considering pursuing a networking software idea I had a few years back - and which I did some initial development on - and which I still consider a valid idea. However, if I'm working full time on another job, it's impractical to get started on this project, because it will require not only my full time attention, but the full time resources of at least two other software developers. I'm roughly estimating this project will take a year to release version 1.0. This of course means I'm going to need to quit my day job and obtain funding.