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Old 11-09-2010, 03:37 PM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
24,764 posts, read 59,756,648 times
Reputation: 26935

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Quote:
Originally Posted by magellan View Post
If you are going to be one of the people who'd like to bring Detroit back from the brink of extinction, you'd better get a thicker skin. You have to be honest with yourself and realize you're dealing with a city that is probably the worst on the planet, for crime, for outmigration, for disrepair, for disfunctionality, for everything. I've even heard people compare it to former Soviet bloc countries that emptied out after the fall of the Soviet Union (in other words, there's nothing in the U.S. to compare it to). When I drive down the Lodge and literally lose count of the number of burned out and boarded up homes, no one can possibly make any serious claim that Detroit is only a victim of "perception." IT'S RIGHT THERE BEFORE YOUR EYES. Unless you want to tell me that the "burned out" look is the next big thing, and each one of those contains a middle class family who enjoys not having any windows or insulation in their home.

Start from there, quit whining like a little girl, and start making some changes. (and stop sending me messages to ban people from the site who haven't done anything wrong but say bad things about Detroit).

Look. More wisdom about Detroit from someone who has never been here. Perhaps you need to open your eyes during the entire drive through Detroit, not just the bad parts that you want to observe. Perhaps youmight even want to get off the freeway and do something in the city once in a while. You may relaize that the worst neighborhoods tend to line the freeways, because no one wants to hear the noise and breathe the fumes.

The middle class fmailies in Detroit do nto live in the burned out neighborhoods. They live in nice middle class neighborhoods. Those burned out homes are empty. Half of the City as a whole is or mostly empty, but a considerable portion of the remaining occupied city is pretty nice.

Downtown Detroit for example is quite pleasant. While there are a couple of abandoned towers, most of the downtown is in pretty good shape and is reasonably safe. Mid town is also decent, as is most of Corktown.

Indian Villiage and Palmer Woods are also quite nice.

Detroit is far from the worst city in the world. It is not even in the running. (Check out Tijuana for a convenient example).

This is only the tip of the iceberg. Quite a lot of Detroit is nice. Go downtown open your eyes and amybe you will see this, unless you are one of those people who only see bad things and cannot see nice in anything.

 
Old 11-09-2010, 03:39 PM
 
Location: Grand Rapids Metro
8,746 posts, read 16,837,359 times
Reputation: 3618
Quote:
Originally Posted by scolls View Post
Seriously you are comparing Grand Rapids to Detroit? Grand Rapids at it's largest never even hit 200k. Detroit was 1.8 million. Grand Rapids is 45 square miles. Detroit is 138. Almost 100 square miles bigger than Grand Rapids. Detroit even after all the population loss still has a higher population density than Grand Rapids. It's an apples to oranges comparison. Cities to compare Detroit to are Chicago and Philadelphia who have both lost a good chunk of people, both have high crime rates, and both have rising poverty levels. If you are going to compare Grand Rapids to anything, it would be Ann Arbor.
So what is your point? And what the heck does "density" have to do with systemic problems and mass flight? It seems like that density would work in its favor.
 
Old 11-09-2010, 03:42 PM
 
1,512 posts, read 1,528,635 times
Reputation: 578
Quote:
Originally Posted by scolls View Post
Seriously you are comparing Grand Rapids to Detroit? Grand Rapids at it's largest never even hit 200k. Detroit was 1.8 million. Grand Rapids is 45 square miles. Detroit is 138. Almost 100 square miles bigger than Grand Rapids. Detroit even after all the population loss still has a higher population density than Grand Rapids. It's an apples to oranges comparison. Cities to compare Detroit to are Chicago and Philadelphia who have both lost a good chunk of people, both have high crime rates, and both have rising poverty levels. If you are going to compare Grand Rapids to anything, it would be Ann Arbor.
Denial is not a river in Egypt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by magellan View Post
Yeah, didn't Bing say he had a goal to tear down 10,000? Wowza. Detroit is just like every other city in the country, fer sure.
10,000 with 2,000 down. Detroit Mayor Dave Bing: More than 2,000 blighted houses demolished so far this year | MLive.com

Good for him. I remember as a kid in Detroit the police would chase us around but they never had a chance because everyone knew which abandoned houses to run to. If you missed the best one, oh well just run to the next.

I think this is on par with Giuliani's New York reinvention.
 
Old 11-09-2010, 03:47 PM
 
Location: Huntington Woods, MI
1,742 posts, read 3,370,133 times
Reputation: 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Homogenizer View Post
Denial is not a river in Egypt.



10,000 with 2,000 down. Detroit Mayor Dave Bing: More than 2,000 blighted houses demolished so far this year | MLive.com

Good for him. I remember as a kid in Detroit the police would chase us around but they never had a chance because everyone knew which abandoned houses to run to. If you missed the best one, oh well just run to the next.

I think this is on par with Giuliani's New York reinvention.

Who said I denied it? Comparing Detroit with a city the fraction of it's size is not a valid comparison. No **** there will be less abandoned houses in Grand Rapids. It's about the size of 3-4 neighborhoods in Detroit. Compare Detroit to a similar city like Philadelphia.
 
Old 11-09-2010, 03:54 PM
 
Location: Grand Rapids Metro
8,746 posts, read 16,837,359 times
Reputation: 3618
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens View Post
Look. More wisdom about Detroit from someone who has never been here. Perhaps you need to open your eyes during the entire drive through Detroit, not just the bad parts that you want to observe. Perhaps youmight even want to get off the freeway and do something in the city once in a while. You may relaize that the worst neighborhoods tend to line the freeways, because no one wants to hear the noise and breathe the fumes.

The middle class fmailies in Detroit do nto live in the burned out neighborhoods. They live in nice middle class neighborhoods. Those burned out homes are empty. Half of the City as a whole is or mostly empty, but a considerable portion of the remaining occupied city is pretty nice.

Downtown Detroit for example is quite pleasant. While there are a couple of abandoned towers, most of the downtown is in pretty good shape and is reasonably safe. Mid town is also decent, as is most of Corktown.

Indian Villiage and Palmer Woods are also quite nice.

Detroit is far from the worst city in the world. It is not even in the running. (Check out Tijuana for a convenient example).

This is only the tip of the iceberg. Quite a lot of Detroit is nice. Go downtown open your eyes and amybe you will see this, unless you are one of those people who only see bad things and cannot see nice in anything.
Downtown Detroit is a dump. I'm sorry. I was just there last week and spent a couple of days DOWNTOWN. All over downtown. I walked around downtown at night. At night, the streets were empty of people and cars. There are a few glimmers of hope, like added landscaping, a few new hotels (Book Cadillac, Fort Shelby). But mostly it was empty of anything.

I've lived in Michigan for over 40 years, and have spent plenty of time in Detroit. I had a lot of friends in college from Detroit (suburbs and city) and spent many a weekend road trip in and around the entire metro area of Detroit. I spent two months living in Detroit (an area that is now called East Pointe or some other silly "trying to be like Grosse Pointe" name). My brother went to University of Detroit and lived off campus a right off of McNichols. I traveled to visit him many times in college and loved to look at all the lovely chop shops along Livernois. I especially loved all the abandoned mansions surrounding the Detroit Country Club and surrounding areas.

I worked for an automotive parts supplier for the better part of a decade, with almost all of its customers in Highland Park, Warren, Southfield, Allen Park, Farmington, Auburn Hills, Dearborn, Troy, you name it. I spent at least one day a week in Detroit and the surrounding areas for years.

Maybe, MAYBE Detroit has gotten better since the early to mid 90's. Is that what people are saying? That all the narrative about population loss and increased poverty and urban prairies and closed facilities and mile after mile of vacant properties is not true? It's all a ruse? All the burned out houses along the expressway are just an anomaly?

Wait a minute, Corktown? Nice? Is that the area around Slow's BBQ? (great place btw, but that area is decrepit). I will say that the area around Wayne State was promising and looked like some of the up-and-coming areas in DC and Chicago. Still a lot of grime though.
 
Old 11-09-2010, 03:55 PM
 
1,512 posts, read 1,528,635 times
Reputation: 578
Quote:
Originally Posted by scolls View Post
Who said I denied it? Comparing Detroit with a city the fraction of it's size is not a valid comparison. No **** there will be less abandoned houses in Grand Rapids. It's about the size of 3-4 neighborhoods in Detroit. Compare Detroit to a similar city like Philadelphia.
If someone says that Detroit sucks because it has abandoned houses, just say I know and tell them this is what we're doing about it. Problem solved and you don't look like a whiner making excuses for the inexcusable.

The world knows Detroit sucks. Maybe it's true and maybe it's not but they know it sucks. You can't argue what they know but you sure can tell them why they might reconsider.
 
Old 11-09-2010, 04:10 PM
 
Location: Grand Rapids Metro
8,746 posts, read 16,837,359 times
Reputation: 3618
Sorry for the rant, I'm done.
 
Old 11-09-2010, 04:10 PM
 
1,512 posts, read 1,528,635 times
Reputation: 578
One other thing Detroiters and D-lovers, if you haven't noticed, he's trolling you because you're easy pickings. I love Detroit but the knee-jerk reaction to cry makes me want to cap on Detroit too.
 
Old 11-09-2010, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Huntington Woods, MI
1,742 posts, read 3,370,133 times
Reputation: 683
Since we're throwing stones in this thread, lets not make Grand Rapids more than what it was. I spent a few days there on business and there was some good and bad. When I got off the freeway for the hotel I was greeted by some nice abandoned machine shops. A pretty grimey area. Then literally in the hotel parking lot was a homeless man holding a sign claiming to be some sort of vet and was harassing everyone entering the hotel. The downtown was nicer than when I went back in 2006. I wouldn't exactly call it vibrant but it was winter so I'd give it the benefit of doubt. My uncle lived in Wyoming till he died and I wouldn't call that a nice place at all.

And I LOL'd at how far off base you are about Eastpointe.
 
Old 11-09-2010, 04:13 PM
 
Location: Huntington Woods, MI
1,742 posts, read 3,370,133 times
Reputation: 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Homogenizer View Post
One other thing Detroiters and D-lovers, if you haven't noticed, he's trolling you because you're easy pickings. I love Detroit but the knee-jerk reaction to cry makes me want to cap on Detroit too.

The funny part is I get a warning that only says "trolling" yet the moderators troll themselves.
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