Middle-aged white people want to leave it all behind and move to the D. (Detroit: cheap house, neighborhoods)
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Don’t mean to discourage you but keep in mind that while property taxes might not be much because of low property values, that there is a 2.4% city income tax rate for residents without regard to where the income is earned.
Oh yes, I'm aware, but thank you. I'm a firm believer in being diligent with one's taxes
Quote:
Originally Posted by lpranger467
Crime in the seedy areas really will be an issue though. I'd look in Bagley, Corktown and maybe Hamtramck. You'll still need to gas your cars, get groceries and such and most of the east side of Detroit and Highland Park are filled with a lot of people who dont view life as you do. If you cant afford Bagley or Corktown you may even like the outer fringes of Brightmoor near Telegraph. A lot of Urban Farmers there, the neighborhood was one of Detroits worst but much of the blight has been torn down.
Bagley, Corktown, Hamtramck....up-and-coming, and priced accordingly. We're looking for value, and those markets to me are starting to look over-inflated. The "outer fringes" would be more our speed. Gas and groceries..... I make my own bread, wine, yogurt, ice cream, all that, from scratch. I make about one Costco trip a month and order other groceries from Amazon. I haven't been inside of what you folks call a "party store" in several years, and when you don't commute, you don't need much gas.
and after the initial set-up, are pretty much set for life!
Add a few hens for eggs...
and, if Detroit decides to allow residents to keep goats (please please) then...milk, cheese....you would almost never have to leave.
but this of course requires a bit of room. Our ideal situation would be to purchase a house or large duplex together with an adjoining vacant lot. Fringes.
Oh yes, I'm aware, but thank you. I'm a firm believer in being diligent with one's taxes
Bagley, Corktown, Hamtramck....up-and-coming, and priced accordingly. We're looking for value, and those markets to me are starting to look over-inflated. The "outer fringes" would be more our speed. Gas and groceries..... I make my own bread, wine, yogurt, ice cream, all that, from scratch. I make about one Costco trip a month and order other groceries from Amazon. I haven't been inside of what you folks call a "party store" in several years, and when you don't commute, you don't need much gas.
and after the initial set-up, are pretty much set for life!
Add a few hens for eggs...
and, if Detroit decides to allow residents to keep goats (please please) then...milk, cheese....you would almost never have to leave.
but this of course requires a bit of room. Our ideal situation would be to purchase a house or large duplex together with an adjoining vacant lot. Fringes.
Oh.....please don't turn Detroit into a country farm. The South is better suited for that. Anyway, I would not trade safety for value anywhere.....especially not in Detroit. He....give it a try though.....and report how it goes. There have been a couple of people who have moved into "rough" areas, from out of state, and shared their story of survival. If you can, you need to find an area with a lot of homeowners and not rentals....and get to know those long time residents.
Middle-aged white people want to leave it all behind and move to the D.
That's us. And we've never even been there either (of course!).
But I've read all the blogs and even a couple of the books
And we're super into being part of a community, knowing our neighbors, feeding people, art, music, culture, bike riding, sustainable living. All that.
We don't care what color our neighbors are or if there are "good" schools (no kids) or Whole Foods or whatnot around. We don't mind the grittier parts of any given city. We need space but don't want too be far away from potentially fun stuff to do.
I have an ebay business where I can make money from home. My husband has skills that he could freelance. Currently he makes just over 100k, but it's expensive for us to live here (Connecticut) at 2k per month in rent, in addition to other expenses that we wouldn't have in Detroit.
So..... I wonder sometimes what we're doing here, when we could take our 50k savings, spend, say, 30k cash to own a house in somewhere like Highland Park, fix it up as we can/want support ourselves doing ebay and freelancing, grow food, do hippie stuff, no rent, no mortgage, no commute.
The (seemingly) substantially lower cost of living would allow us to spend more time together and do all the artsy-fartsy stuff of our dreams.
And realizing that property taxes are higher, car insurance is higher, yes, all that....
But Michigan will let me grow my own medical marijuana whereas Connecticut will not. A significant savings.
Is there something we're missing? We plan to visit soon to help us decide.
Of course, everyone thinks we're crazy, but we've never talked about it with anyone actually living in Detroit.
Do you think we're crazy?
No. But visit first. And spend some real time there, not just a weekend but several weeks, or a month or two. You'll never know what it's like living vicariously through internet forums and talking to locals. Get a feel for the place. It is very, very, large. Still urban, but very spread out.
Listen to what people on this forum are talking about. Detroit is NOT what you are thinking that it will be. Parts of it are like the Bronx in the seventies. Other parts are like Baltimore, Camden, etc. It is not a run down city in Connecticut or New York. Something entirely different.
The Detroit I knew, was fast, materialistic, ran down, abandoned properties, abandoned high rises, abandoned neighborhoods, partially torn down buildings, gun shots at odd hours during the day and throughout the night. I felt under dressed and totally out of my element. And there weren't a lot of people walking around. That was 20 years ago; I'm sure some neighborhoods may have improved, some may be worse, whatever. You can't just fix up your house, restore it to original condition, when you have other properties in disarray that need attention bringing down the value.
Believe me....people can tell. You do not have to flaunt wealth....but little things that you do or do not do will make you stand out. I mean.....the optics of a middle age white couple moving into the community.....I mean....what percentage of middle age white couples are poor? It might just be assumed that you have more than the people around there.
I hope you do move to Detroit.....but like I said....you have to be very careful. Don't think you are going to fool anyone about your economic status. People are aware of gentrification....and its not usually poor people who gentrify.
Just PAY ATTENTION to this! Decide if you are prepared for the worst case scenario. Are you?
You need to be careful. Yes, you can still do in Detroit what you want to do, but you have to know the area.
Some areas are begin re-gentrified. That means they are sick of the purple houses, cars on the lawn, sofas on the porch, unpaired broken windows, etc. To correct this, they are engaging in somewhat strict code enforcement. It is the only way to make an awful area nice again. So, if you want to be left alone to do as you will, you do not want to be in an area that is on the upswing. They tend to be even more strict than already nice areas. They have to enforce evenly, so your purple house cannot be tolerated any mroe than the junk cars on the front lawn - if a purple house is not allowed. There are many places where the color of your house is not a concern, but you will have to maintain it and follow other rules. It is my understanding you want a place where you will be left alone to do as you please. Such areas exist, but many of them are not in places where you would live very long.
On the other hand, you do not want to be in an area where you need to surround your property with razor wire and buy six dobermans trained to kill.
It may be tough to find what you are looking for.
Del Ray might be such a place. It is basically empty. You do need security though. Del Rey is going to change dramatically with the construction of the Gordie Howe Bridge. No one can reasonably predict what it will be like two years after the bridge is completed.
Some place like Corktown, while safer and more in the fun zone is not going to have the live and let live attitude I think you are looking for. There are trying to attract more re-gentrification to the area, purple houses and eclectic lawn sculptures made of car parts, are not the kind of thing they want there.
Maybe you could buy those geodesic dome houses/buildings just outside of Corktown. It does not seem likely anyone will care what you do there, at least not for a while. Perhaps there is something available in the Heidelberg Project area, not sure.
Realistically, it sounds like for what you want, you might be better off in a rural area.
As for growing pot, I think you will need a license and inspections,etc. You will also have to be careful about not letting it be known and protecting your place form theft. That is a huge attraction for the criminal element.
Del Ray is actually already on my radar. Excellent insight with the bridge - I was not aware.
But I don't want to live in a rural area, I promise you. Done that. I grew up in the country, in North Carolina. The city always feels safer to me. Even in the "ghetto." The secluded nature of living in the country, the lack of close neighbors to watch out for you, limited access and egress, can be very isolating and make you feel like a sitting duck sometimes. Strange voices walking through the woods....and more than one break-in attempt.
And I've already done my due diligence on the weed. Trust me. It was one of the first things I looked up. I am a licensed medical MJ card holder here in Connecticut. I am not, nor do I condone, doing anything illegal, just to be clear
I think there may be some places in or around old redford that would appeal to what you want. In fact, there was a place on the market just recently that might be perfect. It was $125,000. Many of the nearby houses were $14,000. This on had a bit of land and bordered on a big vacant area. Beautiful older street with loads of mature trees. Cool houses but many are boarded up. Area looks like a park (only with litter).
I will see if I can find it.
BTW can you use, do you have guns? You will need to protect yourselves. Even the chief of police suggested people in outlying neighborhoods get a gun and learn to use it. An English mastiff or a pair of dobies would be a good idea too.
Couldn't find it sorry. Maybe it sold. It was a neat 1920s bungalow pretty much alone on its side of the street. Good sized maybe 2200 s.f. or something.
For a possible example of what you might find look at 18666 Burgess. Not for sale, but it might give you an idea of a type of house and type of neighborhood. Yes, over the course of 10 -20 years, you may well have crack dealers, gang bangers, some shootings or murders within walking distance, but you will also be left pretty much alone. That house would likely be int he $15,000 range. THe one I was referring to was 100 times nicer.
Some things have improved, these areas used to have no garbage pick up, no fire, police or EMT service to speak of. Sure they would come, but it might take 3-4 hours. You had to make your own arrangements for everything. Now it is better. Most places even have working street lights, regular garbage pick up occasional police service. EMTs may still take a while to arrive, but you can contract with a private service who will guarantee a specific response time.
If you want to help improve things, organize a neighborhood association. But be cautious, They may decide to clamp down on you.
Last edited by Coldjensens; 02-28-2017 at 11:40 AM..
Believe me....people can tell. You do not have to flaunt wealth....but little things that you do or do not do will make you stand out. I mean.....the optics of a middle age white couple moving into the community.....I mean....what percentage of middle age white couples are poor? It might just be assumed that you have more than the people around there.
I hope you do move to Detroit.....but like I said....you have to be very careful. Don't think you are going to fool anyone about your economic status. People are aware of gentrification....and its not usually poor people who gentrify.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkeith
Just PAY ATTENTION to this! Decide if you are prepared for the worst case scenario. Are you?
I was just about to address this, because it's 100% correct. We're very cognizant of this, having been early gentrifiers before, in Jacksonville FL, in the historic district, in the "ghetto" in what had, literally, been a crack house before we moved in. Neighborhoods could be vastly different from one block to the next, which is how a lot of Detroit seems.
We weren't really the gentrifiers though, it was all the people who came after us. Our house was kept purposely modest on the outside. We tried to be part of the neighborhood, not change it. But then they all came with their fresh paint and their lawns and their sprinklers....
Gentrification is an issue that I have a lot of appreciation for. I can see both sides. We aim to counter the negative by giving more than we take, but many MANY white people who move into predominately black neighborhoods do not, unfortunately. We were always extremely personable to our neighbors. Even the homeless ones (especially the homeless ones). We did crazy stuff like saying hello and smiling We'd pay people for little odd jobs to help them out. Give out extra food we had, etc. We always respected everyone as equals and had not one single problem in the ten plus years we lived there.
Meanwhile, the people in the "nice" neighborhood bordering ours were getting robbed left and right. All by non-residents who went over there because that's where all the rich people lived.
Our big mistake was buying a more expensive house in the historic district. Our house was a little too small, and a lot too regulated. But the area was "up-and-coming" and it was still a "good investment." Until the bubble popped, like they all will eventually..
But I digress.
"Worst case scenario?" Do you mean, are we prepared to defend ourselves? Absolutely.
I actually rented a purple house in Royal Oak, which is a suburb that teeters somewhere on the fulcrum of hip-college-grad-town and uppity-suburbanites-who-stuck-around-after-marriage. We didn't grow any drugs in our basement (that we were aware of.. we mostly stayed out of the basement as it was the place where nightmares come from.. ), but nobody seemed to mind the purple house. In fact lots of houses in that neighborhood were wonky colors - yellow, purple, bright blue, deep red... I think you may be surprised at how much more laid back the Midwest is than New England.
That was a big part of what drew us here instead of the Northeast as we had originally intended (I'm a transplant too).
Whenever I visit Royal Oak I find myself struggling to believe I'm not in Berkeley (the one here, with the additional "e").
By "worst case scenario" I mean, can you handle the situation if if turns out not to be what you expect. Both emotionally and financially. It would be wonderful if this works for you. Balance that with the possible need to change direction if it doesn't work out. Only you know how much stress you can tolerate. Best wishes to you!
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We'd pay people for little odd jobs to help them out. Give out extra food we had, etc. We always respected everyone as equals and had not one single problem in the ten plus years we lived there. 
), but nobody seemed to mind the purple house. In fact lots of houses in that neighborhood were wonky colors - yellow, purple, bright blue, deep red... I think you may be surprised at how much more laid back the Midwest is than New England.
