Is Detroit honestly SO terrible? (Ann Arbor, Ferndale: vacation, income, job)

[Cliffie]

Detroit is a fine city. It definitely needs some work in spots, but what large city doesn't? Considering the rough shape it's in economically, it's ASTOUNDINGLY good. I have never, never, never had a bad experience downtown, but I've had quite a few very good ones.

Points:

* Easiest place to find "Detroit-style" ribs
* King's Bookstore -- only the best used bookstore in the known & charted universe
* The Detroit Institute of Arts
* It's the home of rock 'n' roll!
* Cass Tech, Wayne State U, U of Detroit Mercy
* Two words: Jazz Festival
* Unique cultural items such as Pewabic pigs and the infamous Rat-A-Lope at the Whiskey In The Jar bar in Hamtramck
* One of the few places you can still rent the top of a house for $135
* Scenic Zug Island (I kid. I kid because I love)

[Cliffie]

Originally Posted by illmatic774

FYI I can't open your PM for whatever reason, but these things happen everywhere; they just happen in Detroit at a much greater rate.

No, they're REPORTED at a much greater rate. If someone breaks a nail in Detroit it gets turned into an hour news special about the crime in our fair city. I someone starts a neighborhood watch committee that cuts the burglary rate in the area 90%? DEAD SILENCE. You'll never hear about it.

You want a city with a high crime rate? Try Ann Arbor. Those rich kids wearing socks with their sandals are snorting coke in the hallways and getting the freshman girls drunk and RoHypnolled on a nightly basis so they can be gang-raped with impunity. The year I moved there, there was a gang of frat boys trolling the streets for men walking alone so they could gang-rape THEM. You ever hear of something like that happening in Hamtramck?

[Maxine3]

"Detroit is a fine city."
It WAS back in the 40's, 50's.

[Cclass84]

Detroit is still bad place to live, but getting better since the late 80's. downtown is really turning around, but still inferior to other major downtowns. (lack of 24hr phar, no shopping malls, very high office vacancies, virtually no foot traffic after 6pm, suburban feel with all the parking lots and open spaces. Downtown Detroit was never or will never be lower manhattan or the loop in chicago but maybe can compete with the better second tier cities in 25 years.

[GlassPipe]

I hate the traffic and self important weenies that rule the place. Get rid of all that and I wouldn't mind it.

[kimba01]

Originally Posted by CraigU

It is positive attitudes like yours that will truly make a change. There are negatives with every city in the world. Miami Beach used to be more or less a slum 15 years ago and now you can't touch any house for less than $750k; apartments start at $150k for a studio apartment which could be 500 s.f.

I was almost scared away from my decision to move my family and business, to the Detroit area, based upon posts on some of these boards and opinions from my family in the suburbs. I decided to see for myself and must say I am impressed by East English Village and several other neighborhoods in Detroit proper. So much so, we have offers out on two homes already. I just need to find a third...

My bet is Detroit is at the very beginning of what will be an astounding
rebound!

Well, this could be true. But to compare to Miami? Miami has good weather and great beaches! Poor little ole Detroit has Winter. Ugh. Oh, yeah and the Detroit River. It does have quick access to Canada and more Winter. And that could be wonderful if you love winter, but it doesn't have any winter resorts or such to enjoy all the winter sports there are. It's ok. Just depends on what a person seeks.

[detshen]

Miami is very hot and humid. I would take michigan winter over a Miami summer anyday. Michigan has the great lakes, there are many nice beaches outside of Detroit. I wouldn't mind letting wallow in all their misery if that's what they really want, except that people who may consider moving here read this and should hear both sides, but I'm getting very tired of it.

[CraigU]

Most native Floridians don't really go to the beach that often. Having said that, Miami is a beautiful city with many activities that can't be found elsewhere. However, many of the people do not have respect or consideration for others. Simple things like saying hello as you pass someone or letting someone into traffic in front of you simply do not occur often. There are so many of these little things that add up which begin to outweigh the benfits. In addition, our summers are very stressful, due to hurricane threats, and the humidity is intense.

At this stage of my life, people are the most important thing to me more so than anything else. This means friends and family but also people who you interact with on a daily basis. Common consideration and "doing the right thing" are under appreciated until you don't see them on a regular basis. I believe that in Michigan, midwest values are reflected in most peoples behavior and interactions with others.

That being said, I plan on keeping my Miami house to escape to during the winter. This will help me to have my cake and eat it too.

Originally Posted by kimba01

Well, this could be true. But to compare to Miami? Miami has good weather and great beaches! .

[CraigU]

In my opinion, its almost six of one and a half dozen of the other.

The difference that makes me agree with your statement is the stress involved with constant hurricane threats. We've had a few rough years of constant threats with the worst being when both Katrina & Wilma hit us. Lack of electricity for days or weeks makes you realize how fragile our comfortable civilization is. You can't imagine how life changes without electricity. As you can imagine, it brings out the best and worst in people.

Originally Posted by detshen

Miami is very hot and humid. I would take michigan winter over a Miami summer anyday.

[Bluefly]

Originally Posted by GlassPipe

I hate the traffic and self important weenies that rule the place. Get rid of all that and I wouldn't mind it.

If you think traffic and self important weenies are bad in Detroit, I warn you to never EVER move to either of the coasts. Detroit will feel like a quaint village in Nepal.

Miami's poverty rate is about equal to Detroit's. Like New Orleans' French Quarter, the only difference is that Miami has a nice beach strip so all the fat tourists can get drunk and say how great the city is while ignoring the crushing poverty that is inexcusable in the wealthiest country in the world. It's no wonder our empire is fading.

I, personally, think that Detroit should stop trying to compete with other cities in conventional city ways. Even if Detroit does a complete 180, it's just going to be a second rate Cleveland or a place that's pleasant to be. Spoiled brats will always complain about the weather and water, even though there is more coastline in Michigan (with gorgeous beaches) than any state but Alaska.

I think Detroit should use its excessive land and blight to establish itself on the forefront of redefining the concept of urban beyond simple density. It could create dense clusters of very vibrant communities that become mostly self sufficient and utilize an extensive urban agriculture industry, such as was proposed through Adamah. With its school system all but failed, it could enact radical experiments that challenge the conventions of how children are educated. If the experiments fail, how is that any worse than now? At least the students would see that people are trying, which is lightyears beyond today.

Detroit should also really invest in establishing itself as the alternative urban music mecca in the same way Austin established itself as the alt-country mecca. Detroit's got an incredible music underground. It just needs to take it to the next level.

I just picture Detroit being something completely different than exists in the world today - and in so doing creating a culture of progressive innovation that attracts the next industrial revolution built upon sustainable technologies that don't need massive factories, but simply need smaller warehouse spaces like when the auto industry was coming of age. Unfortunately, most Detroit voters and, therefore, public representatives still think inside the conventional box.

Sorry to ramble.