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A whole lot of people leave for the excitement of a new environment. And for dreams of nirvana, which is a lot of fun to dream about. Yup, the weather is lovely in San Diego but face it, there are so many downsides as well. They appear as time goes on and become more upsetting.
Still, best of luck to you for a long, happy life there.
That's fine, but these people aren't moving to Detroit. For Detroit, it is mostly one way - out-migration, and very little in-migration.
That's fine, but these people aren't moving to Detroit. For Detroit, it is mostly one way - out-migration, and very little in-migration.
People often migrate in for work. My family did.
Detroit itself is a work in progress.
Anyway, lots of people come home to southeast MI, too. I know of very many young adults who
have done just that, especially after starting families. It's a better place for raising a family than many
parts of the country, especially if you have family here already.
And we have lots of water. I know of people who have left milder climes due to drought conditions, heat, expenses, wildfires, hurricanes, etc. No place is perfect.
Let's face it, Michigan has a whole lot going for it. It's not perfect yet, and certainly not well-known to everyone. And it's an absolutely gorgeous state. Not enough people know.
However the down side is the cold. Yes it is gorgeous I have never seen such greenery as when I moved here from the Arid southwest. I was astonished when I first saw the straits of Mackinaw.
It is also one of the most polluted places in the country. We are famous for automobiles and inner city decay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkeith
People often migrate in for work. My family did.
Detroit itself is a work in progress.
Anyway, lots of people come home to southeast MI, too. I know of very many young adults who
have done just that, especially after starting families. It's a better place for raising a family than many
parts of the country, especially if you have family here already.
And we have lots of water. I know of people who have left milder climes due to drought conditions, heat, expenses, wildfires, hurricanes, etc. No place is perfect.
Let's face it, Michigan has a whole lot going for it. It's not perfect yet, and certainly not well-known to everyone. And it's an absolutely gorgeous state. Not enough people know.
It is one of the most polluted places on Earth. I was, a licensed hazardous contamination first responder and listed on a national database in Washington D.C. You've no idea, I guess. I have worked at superfund cleanup sites here and there are many left, here. I used to have books with all of the contamination sites in Michigan listed in order by severity. Thick books.
The Rouge River is pretty bad and there are superfund designated sites in there. Not to mention the PCB contamination here ; Mercury, copper are high. That PCB chemical mentioned above stands for Polychlorinated Biphenyls. This stuff is Seat Cover fire retardant manufactured west of Bay City and shipped out of St. Louis , Michigan to Battle Creek where it found its' way into the water table and then to us.
Fish over 22 inches out of Lake Michigan should only be consumed once annually and not at all by children or pregnant women.
When I first saw a chemical contamination map of the United States it was laid out in concentric circles. As in a contour map, with circular contours. Except instead of elevations denoted by contours, the circles denoted contamination severity. The darkest color concentrated on this map encircled Detroit and Chicago. The farther on the map from Detroit and Chicago one looked- the lighter was the tint in this color map, denoting of course, less severe contamination rates.
The circles gradually became wider and wider until there was barely any tan coloring over Arizona. Detroit was brown.
A Old landfill was emptied out in Pontiac located right off of M-59 near Airport Road. Into a new one excavated directly next to it. The new one had been constructed to conform to modern standards of non-pollution of groundwater. Leakproof. In four waterproof layers with a leachate removal system to pump out anymore toxic leachate through a collection system and then taken out by truck and never more leached into ground water. Modern Landfills are called sanitary landfills. I will not get into this any further
except to say that in the old days a giant hole would simply be excavated and then waste of all sorts was dumped into this hole . Michigan has a high ground water level.
Inside this toxic mix down at the bottom of this M-59 landfill though, was heavy metals, strychnine, lead, copper etc. PCB's , Asbestos and many others, it was a superfund site. A no-mans land where everyone was covered from head to foot,respirators, eye goggles, and people were only recognizable only by body shape.
One fellow I knew, a husky, large young man whom was reduced to a bedridden state when he got lead in his system. I saw him two years later and he was only then recovering his health and vowed to never work at this Haz-Mat stuff again.
There are of course severely contaminated spots created by the illegal dumping of chemical waste, it happens anytime it can be gotten away with.
The last time I kept track of these contamination rates the Russians were approaching the Americans in terms of widespread contamination, particularly of petroleum extraction sites. By this time though, the Chinese I would guess have very likely have surpassed us in this dubious race.
The Saginaw Riverbed underneath the Zilwaukee bridge was another bad PCB contamination site. Foundry Sand, as black as coal, was found and removed during the construction of the Zilwaukee Bridge. There are places like these throughout the Metro area and Michigan. Sure. One other I remember was in Southfield- also - Battle Creek for its' size is a pretty severely polluted place.
We can't dig out every old landfill, just the worst ones.
Did you think that we could manufacture automobiles , airplanes and every other contrivance known to humans for one hundred years and remain a pristine place? It does not happen this way. The U.S. government is pretty bad and has a bad record of dumping hazardous waste at Military bases.
That is called naivete.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkeith
No, this is definitely not one of the most polluted places in the country; not even close.
It is one of the most polluted places on Earth. I was, a licensed hazardous contamination first responder and listed on a national database in Washington D.C. You've no idea, I guess. I have worked at superfund cleanup sites here and there are many left, here. I used to have books with all of the contamination sites in Michigan listed in order by severity. Thick books.
The Rouge River is pretty bad and there are superfund designated sites in there. Not to mention the PCB contamination here ; Mercury, copper are high. That PCB chemical mentioned above stands for Polychlorinated Biphenyls. This stuff is Seat Cover fire retardant manufactured west of Bay City and shipped out of St. Louis , Michigan to Battle Creek where it found its' way into the water table and then to us.
Fish over 22 inches out of Lake Michigan should only be consumed once annually and not at all by children or pregnant women.
When I first saw a chemical contamination map of the United States it was laid out in concentric circles. As in a contour map, with circular contours. Except instead of elevations denoted by contours, the circles denoted contamination severity. The darkest color concentrated on this map encircled Detroit and Chicago. The farther on the map from Detroit and Chicago one looked- the lighter was the tint in this color map, denoting of course, less severe contamination rates.
The circles gradually became wider and wider until there was barely any tan coloring over Arizona. Detroit was brown.
A Old landfill was emptied out in Pontiac located right off of M-59 near Airport Road. Into a new one excavated directly next to it. The new one had been constructed to conform to modern standards of non-pollution of groundwater. Leakproof. In four waterproof layers with a leachate removal system to pump out anymore toxic leachate through a collection system and then taken out by truck and never more leached into ground water. Modern Landfills are called sanitary landfills. I will not get into this any further
except to say that in the old days a giant hole would simply be excavated and then waste of all sorts was dumped into this hole . Michigan has a high ground water level.
Inside this toxic mix down at the bottom of this M-59 landfill though, was heavy metals, strychnine, lead, copper etc. PCB's , Asbestos and many others, it was a superfund site. A no-mans land where everyone was covered from head to foot,respirators, eye goggles, and people were only recognizable only by body shape.
One fellow I knew, a husky, large young man whom was reduced to a bedridden state when he got lead in his system. I saw him two years later and he was only then recovering his health and vowed to never work at this Haz-Mat stuff again.
There are of course severely contaminated spots created by the illegal dumping of chemical waste, it happens anytime it can be gotten away with.
The last time I kept track of these contamination rates the Russians were approaching the Americans in terms of widespread contamination, particularly of petroleum extraction sites. By this time though, the Chinese I would guess have very likely have surpassed us in this dubious race.
The Saginaw Riverbed underneath the Zilwaukee bridge was another bad PCB contamination site. Foundry Sand, as black as coal, was found and removed during the construction of the Zilwaukee Bridge. There are places like these throughout the Metro area and Michigan. Sure. One other I remember was in Southfield- also - Battle Creek for its' size is a pretty severely polluted place.
We can't dig out every old landfill, just the worst ones.
Did you think that we could manufacture automobiles , airplanes and every other contrivance known to humans for one hundred years and remain a pristine place? It does not happen this way. The U.S. government is pretty bad and has a bad record of dumping hazardous waste at Military bases.
That is called naivete.
So you're saying that the ground contamination is some of the worst on earth, if I understand you correctly. No doubt there was plenty of dumping and burying of chemicals which weren't disposed of properly. And some cities were effected a lot more than others.
I don't doubt you, but would like to see some data on how we compare to other highly industrialized US cities and contries. I know we had plenty of brown sites in NY state, too. Love Canal comes to mind; I lived in WNY back then.
Yes, Keith. I have been keeping track of these ground contaminants since I was in this line of work for some time.
I am sorry, but Have thrown out all of the data in the books I had on superfund cleanup sites when I cleaned out my library. Even then the data was so comprehensive it would be impossible to list it all here. I mean these were two books full of listings of toxic geographic sites with two hundred pages in each one. I remember one-- in Battle Creek off Raymond Rd. We closed another landfill in Battle Creek which was oozing leachate right onto people's backyards who were living alongside " Cereal City Landfill". That was simply horrible and also- the aging landfill was emitting Methane gas into the basements of these same houses. Waste Management had to buy the entire row of houses from the owners whom were affected. We closed it with a Bentonite Cap over the whole place. But. I am afraid it was too little too late.
Surprisingly the Pittsburg area was not included in the most polluted, but was outside of the worst contamination areas. I am sure the area is quite polluted but not as badly as here.
Sometimes we were in old auto plants which- as excavation proceeded, had to be monitored constantly as just to see if toxic ground gases were being emitted. There was always the chance.
Yes, we live on some severely contaminated ground. Sure.
I never had any documentation on how we stack up in terms of how we compare to other industrialized cities in the U.S. The only documentation I had was site specific to Michigan and there were no comparisons made except for the one nationwide map I made mention of here.
There is no reason to lie or misrepresent anything in my posts. What I described here is what I actually experienced and studied. This is from an insiders viewpoint. I have been retired for ten years though I must admit. Yes I did see this stuff, it is real. Ever try to visit the docks around southwest Detroit? That is a mess down there and Ford Rouge is not a pretty place either. There is a Russian company named Severstal which operates the blast furnaces at the Rouge now. If I can remember correctly. I never knew all the details. I was once thrown out though, escorted by security-out of one of the gates at Severstal when I was taking pictures. They did not like it very much.
Sometimes I wonder if I did not ingest anything accidentally while on site sometime or another, but after all this time I doubt I will ever suffer any side effects any more. I believe I am in the clear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkeith
So you're saying that the ground contamination is some of the worst on earth, if I understand you correctly. No doubt there was plenty of dumping and burying of chemicals which weren't disposed of properly. And some cities were effected a lot more than others.
I don't doubt you, but would like to see some data on how we compare to other highly industrialized US cities and contries. I know we had plenty of brown sites in NY state, too. Love Canal comes to mind; I lived in WNY back then.
I don't know where your data is from but it is inaccurate. Google?
My data came from Hydrological Engineering. Our problems are severe and these are not being addressed.
If you care to disbelieve well go ahead. I exaggerated nothing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scorpio516
No.
Michigan has 89 superfund sites.
Massachusetts, with 1/10th the area, has 40 sites.
New Jersey, with 80% of the area of Mass, has 150 sites.
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Sure, Michigan is pretty,
