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Unread 02-21-2007, 07:55 PM
 
8 posts, read 22,409 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bellarosa View Post
I have a solution for Detroit. The welfare recipients could actually get their own jobs, earn their own money, and actually pay their own taxes from their own hard-earned money to benefit their own community. Hard-working people in other communities should not be expected to pay taxes from their hard-earned income to support a community that only wants handouts.

And noone who is working hard to provide for themselves (instead of leeching off welfare) is going to pay taxes into a city government that does not use the money to improve the city. And the citizens of Detroit repeatedly vote in corrupt leaders who do not improve the city's infrastructure.

Any logical hardworking individual will move to a location, such as a suburb, where the taxes, which they pay from their own hard earned money, actually are used to benefit the people paying the taxes, again from their own HARD EARNED MONEY gained from a JOB.

Detroit doesn't have a tax base because the residents will not work and, therefore, are not generating their own tax base.

Hey!

You people sound like OLD... I mean maybe like 15 years older than I am. Come OLD people, open your eyes! Go to Detorit and you'll actually see how some of these people are willing to do Dirty work that PROUD people like you over charge for. For example, my father actually helps people that get welfare find homes, and at times he needs help to get homes repaired. People who live in the Detroit suburbs are willing to do jobs like painting and such for a portion of what companies in the suburb areas charge. These people are highly disadvantaged, and there is NO WORK in Detroit. The residents DO pay their taxes, perhaps a visit to the City Of Detroit Tax Offices will show you (and yes, I've been there).

The best solution is to LEARN from cities like Cleveland and Chicago. They had the same problems that Detroit is having. And besides, the people who RUN AWAY AND HIDE IN the suburbs aren't helping either. I'm sure your parents or some influential person in you life taught you to not to RUN AWAY from your problems. So that is kind of a solution also. Detroit is EVERYONES problem, including the people who live in the surrounding suburbs.

Oh, and yeah, maybe you do pay for somebody's welfare, but what if you were in their position? What if you needed it? What if you lost your job (to outsourcing...people in India get jobs by the way, since they are willing to work for less, and appreciate jobs). You Americans have your noses way up high in the air and are not concerned about anything but yourselves. It's a shame you'll be passing on those same qualities to your children since you're their role model.

And since some of these children are BORN to poverty, they have a difficult time trying to get qualified for jobs that your children will take. Very few will make it. Some of these famililies have to choose between eating, or going to school. They have welfare because they can't afford food, and such. Also, they have no role models. Some of those children learn to make money and survive doing things like selling drugs. I can't blame them. If you need food and clothes and heat, I'm sure you'd do anything too.

So basically, what I'm saying is your solution sucks, find a better way.
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Unread 02-22-2007, 11:06 AM
 
8 posts, read 22,409 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bellarosa View Post
To Zoomzoom:

Those are old times past. Anyone now willing to work to earn the money to afford to live in Grosse Pointe can now move there. Anyone. It just requires work. Unfortunately, a lot of the residents of Detroit do not want to work. So they stay in poverty and blame their problems on others, when they could just get up and work, earn a living, and make a better life for themselves.
Those times are past, and they were old times, and yes, you are correct, Anyone can move into Grosse Point today.

BUT.....

It's NOT true that the people of Detroit DON'T want to work. It's just that there aren't any jobs. So it's IMPOSSIBLE to make a better life for themselves. Detroit residents, especailly those who are "Black"; they have doors slammed into their faces all the time. Those who have positive role models, and were lucky DID make a better life for themselves. Detroit residents are caught up in an endless cycle of poverty, and only people that are better off than they are can provide them with opportunites.

And as far as blame...perhaps reverse discimination could work...I havn't yet formed an opinion about it, I'm in the process of researching the positive and negative points, but perhaps it could work to even out discrimination of minorites like blacks, women, and other such groups.
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Unread 02-24-2007, 06:15 AM
 
1,607 posts, read 6,783,164 times
Reputation: 855
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry View Post
RWF: My information comes from studies.
"Reality vs. Perceptions: An Analysis of Crime and Safety in Downtown Detroit." (2005)
http://www.cus.wayne.edu/content/pub...inalReport.pdf

"Urban community intervention to prevent Halloween Arson" (1997)
http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G1-19389119.html (broken link)

Suburban people torching their properties in Detroit for insurance money were largely responsible for Devil's night arson.

Next, you'll be telling everyone that Cobo Hall isn't safe because the Errol Flynns could come in at any moment.

That crime information is about DOWNTOWN. The downtown area is a very small portion of Detroit. Make a wrong turn so that you are not downtown and you better hope you have a quick out because it could be deadly.

That's the funniest thing I've ever heard- that it was the suburban people setting the fires in Detroit. What a hoot! In a city that's over 80 percent black, people didn't notice hundres of whites running through neighborhoods setting fires? LOL That's hilarious!!!

Not a chance! Take the rose colored glasses off.
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Unread 02-24-2007, 12:37 PM
 
Location: Hamtramck, Detroit, Michigan
60 posts, read 173,116 times
Reputation: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWingsFan View Post
That crime information is about DOWNTOWN. The downtown area is a very small portion of Detroit. Make a wrong turn so that you are not downtown and you better hope you have a quick out because it could be deadly.
If this is the attitude you bring to Detroit, I can see why you have such a bad time here. How could someone accidentally leave downtown? When has anyone died after making a wrong turn in Detroit?

Quote:
That's the funniest thing I've ever heard- that it was the suburban people setting the fires in Detroit. What a hoot! In a city that's over 80 percent black, people didn't notice hundres of whites running through neighborhoods setting fires? LOL That's hilarious!!!

Not a chance! Take the rose colored glasses off.
Detroiters don't think it's very funny. Not only did suburban people burn their former homes for the insurance money, far more just left their property to rot. Now you criticize the poor people left behind for not cleaning up after them? It is absolutely true that the behavior of suburban people is largely responsible for the decline of Detroit.
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Unread 02-24-2007, 07:26 PM
 
1,607 posts, read 6,783,164 times
Reputation: 855
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry View Post
It is absolutely true that the behavior of suburban people is largely responsible for the decline of Detroit.
Boy do you have that backwards!

My family heritage goes back a ways in the city of Detroit. Grandmother was even born and raised there. At that time it was nice, clean and white. What happened? Ask anyone from that generation and they will tell you the same thing - minorities moved in like crazy for factory jobs. When that happened the city went downhill in hurry. White people fled for the suburbs in record numbers to get away from the crime and decay. While whites flourished in the suburbs and still do to this day, the people in the city continued to help it decline to where it's in the state it is today. And people want those in the suburbs to go clean it up and fix it? Please. They made that mess, they need to either fix it or learn to live with it. Kind of like the saying "they made the bed, now they can lay in it."
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Unread 02-25-2007, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Highland Park Mi (heart of Detroit)
34 posts, read 375,585 times
Reputation: 43
Default Thanks Cherry For Your Post.

In your post you described the reason why Detroit is like it is. I believe that
the main thing that should be done is to improve better communications
skill between people who has ruin Detroit, and escaped to the suburbs and
the ones who read all this hate. Cherry, I also believe that those who did
leave Detroit was racist, and they used poor blacks,unemployment and
crime as a excuse to run. You can read between the lines by the way
they try to justify things, and yet you can not keep them from going
downtown.
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Unread 02-25-2007, 03:28 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland area
533 posts, read 1,585,042 times
Reputation: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWingsFan View Post
Boy do you have that backwards!

My family heritage goes back a ways in the city of Detroit. Grandmother was even born and raised there. At that time it was nice, clean and white. What happened? Ask anyone from that generation and they will tell you the same thing - minorities moved in like crazy for factory jobs. When that happened the city went downhill in hurry. White people fled for the suburbs in record numbers to get away from the crime and decay. While whites flourished in the suburbs and still do to this day, the people in the city continued to help it decline to where it's in the state it is today. And people want those in the suburbs to go clean it up and fix it? Please. They made that mess, they need to either fix it or learn to live with it. Kind of like the saying "they made the bed, now they can lay in it."

Blacks live in the suburbs too, you know. Whites also live in the city limits. Now this thread was started to ask how to improve Detroit. Yet you've turned this into a racial controversy. Now let's put you in check. Many cities have large minority populations, yet they are thriving. So why isn't Detroit? Because of people with attitudes like you. You GENERALIZE people because of, probably a few experiences with a person of that race. And all white majority places aren't perfect, although you'd love for them to be. All black majority areas aren't crime ridden.

Cherry stated that people from the suburbs came into the city to burn their houses for insurance money, or whatever. So yes, they DID help with the mess. That's why they should come and help! They're not the only ones to blame, but they still contributed to the problem. If you don't have any ideas to help improve Detroit, take your ignorant, opinionated attitude elsewhere where someone actually wants to hear you whine and generalize people of a different race. It's not wanted here.
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Unread 02-25-2007, 03:37 PM
 
Location: Hamtramck, Detroit, Michigan
60 posts, read 173,116 times
Reputation: 29
Brother William X,
I agree with you that the people who most vocally hate on Detroit are typically racists, and institutionalized racism is another large part of the story of why Detroit is the way it is today, i.e. highway programs that plowed under black neighborhoods, racist real estate practices, redlining by banks, and landlords that charged black families 3 times as much as whites to rent apartments.

But I want you to know that there is another side to the story of why many people left Michigan cities that isn't about race. My grandparents moved from downtown Grand Rapids to a suburban style development, which was made possible by their new car and the construction of M-37. The suburbs were quiet like the farms they grew up on, and within driving distance of my grandfathers job. My grandmother still talks about the excitement of building a new house and the year that they drove from downtown to the building site every weekend. They were one of the first families to leave the neighborhood and didn't give any thought to the people they left behind.
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Unread 02-25-2007, 05:59 PM
 
1,607 posts, read 6,783,164 times
Reputation: 855
All I consistantly hear over and over about why Detroit is in bad shape is "poor us"... people wanting pity. The people of Detroit created that mess and they should clean it up.

Blacks live in the suburbs? No, really? Of course I know that. BUT- it's in VERY small quantities. Just as it's a very small amount of whites living in the city of Detroit.

And most white people did leave for the suburbs because of race. But so what? What's wrong with white people wanting to live around white people? Why is it okay if mexican's want to live near each other, or blacks...but not for white people? My family left to get away from those that moved in and were taking over the city. And I'm proud of it, just ashamed of what the peopel that moved in there did to the city. They have turned it into a public disgrace.
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Unread 02-25-2007, 07:57 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland area
533 posts, read 1,585,042 times
Reputation: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWingsFan View Post
All I consistantly hear over and over about why Detroit is in bad shape is "poor us"... people wanting pity. The people of Detroit created that mess and they should clean it up.

Blacks live in the suburbs? No, really? Of course I know that. BUT- it's in VERY small quantities. Just as it's a very small amount of whites living in the city of Detroit.

And most white people did leave for the suburbs because of race. But so what? What's wrong with white people wanting to live around white people? Why is it okay if mexican's want to live near each other, or blacks...but not for white people? My family left to get away from those that moved in and were taking over the city. And I'm proud of it, just ashamed of what the peopel that moved in there did to the city. They have turned it into a public disgrace.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with white people only wanting to live around white people. But what I do find wrong is when people say "THEY made the city that way, its THEIR fault." They're not the only people to blame. Is it their fault that the manufacturing industry went down hill? Is it their fault that many jobs were lost? Not at all.

Nobody said it was okay for areas to be 100% of any race. It's wrong becuase stereotypes and generalizations begin to form. People have different views on things, I unerstand that. However, people should be tolerant of people of a different skin color. We're all humans. We're all Americans (most of us). Skin color shouldn't be a problem.
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