What can be done to improve Detroit? (Lansing: housing, rental)

[reconmark]

Originally Posted by westender

Where did you get that information? It's clearly wrong on its face. Detroit was vastly nonminority until the 1950s, and the majority of crimes were by white people against other white people, or, later, by black people against other black people. Generally different races were not cohabiting the same neighborhoods.

No, you are wrong, long before the 1950's by at least two decades prior blacks lived in the city and were the targets of hate groups as well as the police department that shot blacks for many menial offenses. At the bottom of this page I'll give you links to support this if you want the correct info.

Not only did you have the KKK in se mi that terrorized blacks, you also had the Black Legion. These were not benevolent social groups, the aim of these groups were to maintain jim crow and segregation through murder, violence, and intimidation of black people; some whites were also targeted but it was mainly if those whites had sypathy for the conditions of blacks both socially and in the workplace.

You may be speaking of the purple gang and other jewish and white gangs that committed violence against whites but that was predominately gang vs gang or innocent bystander.

Wikipedia's info base is from those who contribute articles and facts or comments, you really shouldn't rely on that one source of info to state the majority of violence wasen't white on black, do a broad search and get many sources for info.

Some links on the history of Detroit:

http://info.detnews.com/history/stor...ategory=events
http://info.detnews.com/history/stor...ategory=events
http://info.detnews.com/history/stor...ategory=events
http://info.detnews.com/history/stor...&category=life

[Cherry]

reconmark: thanks for sharing those links with others less familiar with Detroit history. Unfortunately racism and rioting has been a recurring theme in Detroit for over a century.

http://docsouth.unc.edu/neh/detroit/detroit.html

[Frankawitz]

Wow! I was under the impression that this post was to come up with ways to help Detroit, Man it sure went south on the race card. to bad, We see that every time this subject comes up it turns into who's at fault. I have lived in Detroit, I was young but I did live there(McDougall& Mack), My family both Irish and Polish owned businesses in the city and when the roits of 1967 hit well most of my family had their businesses burned out so some moved to Hamtramck and they rest move to suburbs, I would say most where scared of being killed or what ever, The thing is that with all the businesses that moved out they took all the jobs and tax revnue with them, Most of the folks who were left had very little money to work with so city services had to be cut and then when Colman Young duked the city out of more money it got worst, and it seems that no one wanted to change this cycle. Yeah downtown is the only place that the white people want to go to see the Red Wings or Tigers now that they are winning again, the Lions well I think Mr. Ilitch needs to buy them.
But back to the question of how do we fix Detriot people need to own up to the fact that we need a new line of jobs for the people, so why not build factories that produce products like Engines and carburators that burn E85 fuels since we have the auto industry here already have them develop a system that we could put into every car or truck on the roads today. then talk with the oil and gas industry to rebuild refineries to make E85 fuels and then talk with the Farmers since our second largest industry in this state is agriculture. we could have new companies coming here to develop their goods, we have universities that are rated the highest in the nation why not use them to develop new products, as for the city it's self we all need to give something back not just point fingers and blame the other guy or gal. I think Mr. King would flip out if he came back to see what happened to his Dream, With the way race has gone it isn't any better yes Black folks have more opportunity to get ahead but then they to leave the city behind to get out. I live in Macomb county and just in the last year we have had a big increase of Black Families moving here to get away from the city and a failing school system. People need to get involed which most just say "It aint gonna change anything" this is the problem. We need a person who can talk to all people across the board without looking at their skin color but intil this happens it will remain the same old same old. Detroit has lost so must over the years and when I think back how my God Mother and I use to go downtown we would walk to Hudsons and she would take me to Sanders for ice cream man I miss those days. But WE the People by the People need to stand up and come together if we are to get thur these trying times.
I know it's easier to say it's a lost cause but does that help No. We need real Leaders who say they will do something and stick to it, Not just tell the People what they want to hear, Like Kilpatrick said he would clean up the nieghborhoods then he dropped the ball. If he would have stuck to his plan of cleaning up there would be a big difference, He has torn down over 76 Historical buildings since he took Office, why not rehab these buildings? that would create jobs in itself. I own a business and I service the tri county area to help restore buildings not tear them down. I just don't understand the logic in that.

[reconmark]

Originally Posted by Frankawitz

Wow! I was under the impression that this post was to come up with ways to help Detroit, Man it sure went south on the race card. to bad, We see that every time this subject comes up it turns into who's at fault. I have lived in Detroit, I was young but I did live there(McDougall& Mack), My family both Irish and Polish owned businesses in the city and when the roits of 1967 hit well most of my family had their businesses burned out so some moved to Hamtramck and they rest move to suburbs, I would say most where scared of being killed or what ever, The thing is that with all the businesses that moved out they took all the jobs and tax revnue with them, Most of the folks who were left had very little money to work with so city services had to be cut and then when Colman Young duked the city out of more money it got worst, and it seems that no one wanted to change this cycle. Yeah downtown is the only place that the white people want to go to see the Red Wings or Tigers now that they are winning again, the Lions well I think Mr. Ilitch needs to buy them.
But back to the question of how do we fix Detriot people need to own up to the fact that we need a new line of jobs for the people, so why not build factories that produce products like Engines and carburators that burn E85 fuels since we have the auto industry here already have them develop a system that we could put into every car or truck on the roads today. then talk with the oil and gas industry to rebuild refineries to make E85 fuels and then talk with the Farmers since our second largest industry in this state is agriculture. we could have new companies coming here to develop their goods, we have universities that are rated the highest in the nation why not use them to develop new products, as for the city it's self we all need to give something back not just point fingers and blame the other guy or gal. I think Mr. King would flip out if he came back to see what happened to his Dream, With the way race has gone it isn't any better yes Black folks have more opportunity to get ahead but then they to leave the city behind to get out. I live in Macomb county and just in the last year we have had a big increase of Black Families moving here to get away from the city and a failing school system. People need to get involed which most just say "It aint gonna change anything" this is the problem. We need a person who can talk to all people across the board without looking at their skin color but intil this happens it will remain the same old same old. Detroit has lost so must over the years and when I think back how my God Mother and I use to go downtown we would walk to Hudsons and she would take me to Sanders for ice cream man I miss those days. But WE the People by the People need to stand up and come together if we are to get thur these trying times.
I know it's easier to say it's a lost cause but does that help No. We need real Leaders who say they will do something and stick to it, Not just tell the People what they want to hear, Like Kilpatrick said he would clean up the nieghborhoods then he dropped the ball. If he would have stuck to his plan of cleaning up there would be a big difference, He has torn down over 76 Historical buildings since he took Office, why not rehab these buildings? that would create jobs in itself. I own a business and I service the tri county area to help restore buildings not tear them down. I just don't understand the logic in that.

Thanks for bringing us back on topic. I'm guilty at times of going off topic, but sometimes I get fed up being told I'm the ONLY reason for the condition of the city.

My apologies.

In my opinion the only way to fix the city is to address the racial problem and then change the way inner city children are educated. Stop educating them to be employees and educate them to be employers. Instill the mindset that college is just a natural continuation of school, not 12th grade.

Look at other cities were ALL people are vested and value their communities and try to instill that in the future residents and leaders of OUR communities.

[Frankawitz]

Reconmark, The only way to teach children in the inner city to be business owners is to scrap the Public school system as it is. They way Public school is run makes only workers, they don't teach children how the world really works. Most of the kids who drop out of Detroit schools are the ones who find school a waste of their time. The schools need to bring a interest back to school make kids want to go to school. the subjects that are tought are nothing more then waste of time. teach them how Finances work how Businesses work how to balance a check book, how to get a Home loan, or even how to buy a house, the construction trades have for years have been unstaffed and no younger people are taking the trades up, instead we are seeing more Illegals coming here to take these jobs, when American kids have to look at being a Pro ball player to get out of the city. boy that says allot about the Public schools in itself.

[deb68]

I'm sick and tired of hearing about race issues!!! Yes I've heard from many out of towners that moved here that Michigan PERIOD is a very racist state!
I think it's time that everyone gets their noses out of the air and start turning things around.

Number one the first thing that needs to be done is get rid of the crimminals running the city (Mayor etc.) and get some new Gov't in office to help the state. Let's stop this buying of their position!!!!! We all know they bought their way in.

As for the people who live in Detroit and surrounding areas- you have good people and bad- that goes for anywhere. How many of you have really gotten to know your neighbor regardless of race-probably not many.

The real issue here is the me generation!!!!!!!!! if everyone would just take a look at how you personnaly treat people and actually care about someone else besides yourself- then maybe we can all get along and change things.
If everyone would just stop and look at the garbage that is laying around-pick it up and put it in the garbage- HELP CLEAN MICHIGAN - TAKE PRIDE- MAKE SOMEONE HAPPY- JUST SAY HELLO!- HELP A NEIGHBOR regardless of race!!! - TEACH SOMEONE how to use a computer, read, paint, plant, have HONOR.

If we can just help each other that will make a difference on a better place to live!!!!

And for those of you who think this is crap- then you are selfish and will not get any joy in living your life.

[bonni0827]

One way to improve Detroit would be to get businesses to build or move there and to get people to move back in the city. We need to find out why business do not want to move or build there and take it from there.

[Frank the Tank]

Originally Posted by bonni0827

One way to improve Detroit would be to get businesses to build or move there and to get people to move back in the city. We need to find out why business do not want to move or build there and take it from there.

As I've said in some other threads, this is the catch-22 for Detroit. The reason why businesses don't want to move to Detroit is that it doesn't have the knowledge workers that they're looking for. At the same time, knowledge workers don't want to move to Detroit because they can't find the jobs that they're looking for. It's a chicken-or-the-egg problem - one group won't come if the other isn't there already, so if neither group is there, where can you start, particularly when there are a lot of other locales that already offer both? That's the unanswered question right now.

You have to truly look at it from the business perspective. If I'm starting a business, I've got to ask this important question: why should I take a huge risk by starting a business in Detroit if (a) I can easily find the talent that I want in places like New York, Chicago, LA, or San Francisco and (b) even if those cities are too expensive, I can go to places like Texas, Georgia, and North Carolina that provide cost structures that are as low or lower than Detroit? Detroit needs to find a real retort to this that goes into hard business specifics as opposed to "charity" (i.e. "we really need help with all of the auto industry jobs being cut"). Otherwise, the current state of affairs will simply continue where Detroit is always skipped.

So, to all of you, if I'm this business owner that asks you the question above about Detroit, how would you answer?

[reconmark]

Originally Posted by Frank the Tank

As I've said in some other threads, this is the catch-22 for Detroit. The reason why businesses don't want to move to Detroit is that it doesn't have the knowledge workers that they're looking for. At the same time, knowledge workers don't want to move to Detroit because they can't find the jobs that they're looking for. It's a chicken-or-the-egg problem - one group won't come if the other isn't there already, so if neither group is there, where can you start, particularly when there are a lot of other locales that already offer both? That's the unanswered question right now.

You have to truly look at it from the business perspective. If I'm starting a business, I've got to ask this important question: why should I take a huge risk by starting a business in Detroit if (a) I can easily find the talent that I want in places like New York, Chicago, LA, or San Francisco and (b) even if those cities are too expensive, I can go to places like Texas, Georgia, and North Carolina that provide cost structures that are as low or lower than Detroit? Detroit needs to find a real retort to this that goes into hard business specifics as opposed to "charity" (i.e. "we really need help with all of the auto industry jobs being cut"). Otherwise, the current state of affairs will simply continue where Detroit is always skipped.

So, to all of you, if I'm this business owner that asks you the question above about Detroit, how would you answer?

I think your only partially right. If you wanted to move a business here you could find thousanda of qualified applicants by hosting a job fair and having interviews on the spot, that way you could lock in workers and would know if you had a sufficient number of qualified people before you even broke ground.

Also in many business all new employees need some type of training because so many employers now request a skill set that almost needs to be custom made.

I remember about 10 years ago Lucent Technologies landed a huge contract in the metro Detroit area and needed a couple hundred workers, they started interviewing and had all their people in about one week, I was one of those people and they moved me very fast in order to get me working.

Even with the dismal educational system there are many educated and skilled workers in se mi, I think many employers see the division,negativity here and rightly say why should they put up with this mess.

Remember when Compuware was moving downtown and some surburbanite worker vowed they would quit their jobs before going to work in that "city" well no new employer is going to invest in this area when people complain about these types of issues.

[permacultists]

Detroit is what other cities are going to be like after the coming oil crash - economically depressed and decaying within, with the exception of local citizen activists struggling to bring in new sustainable businesses.
We don't want to fix detroit because we will have the last laugh when other cities are killing themselves off during the coming blackouts. Detroit has a low population density and lots of water and open spaces for growing urban gardens. Why should we "gentrify" so that rich people can come in and develop the city with unsustainable businesses that will crash in a few years anyway? To all those who hate detroit - please leave and good riddance to you. I see the big SUVs as endangered wooley mammoths charging down the road on their last desperate breath. Michigan will be vacated even more after the coming oil crash (the Big 3), and then everyone else will wish they lived here because we can survive the crash. I would hate to be in an arid climate running out of water and die from heat stroke when the blackouts come.
If you don't believe me, just read about Peak Oil. Not but 1% of americans have any clue about what is going to happen, but realize this; the government is building big civilian prisons in anticipation of the collapse - to house the rioters. Also, they are running simulations to see how suburbia can be retrofitted, or not, after the coming oil shocks and they are planning for what will be worse than the Great Depression. Public transportation will not help during a blackout. The only thing that matters is whether you have open land to grow food, or wild edibles to harvest. It is better to take a step off the curb than fall from the 20th floor of a penthouse suite. Thus, Detroit will have the last laugh.