Is Grosse Pointe still an ideal place for relocation? (Detroit: for sale, month-to-month)

[Twehttam]

GFC,

I agree and disagree. I'm not from this area (my wife is), but have lived in other areas of the Midwest and, mainly, the PacNW. While living in Seattle there was definite classism. For example, those who live in Seattle-proper versus those in Bellevue versus those in Tacoma, etc. It's this way everywhere as people need to justify to others that they are doing well or that they've made a better investment, etc. Maybe it's moreso in the Detroit-metro, but it's everywhere. The jist of it is you need to visit each area, spend TIME (not an hour) in each, and then make your own call (while also taking in as much secondary feedback as possible). My wife and I had this luxury during our move, others may not, but I recommend it.

Hemmie, I can follow up with a few answers to your GP questions but will leave Birmingham responses to more qualifies members.

If you live in Grosse Pointe Park, there is a movie theater for GPP residents only in one of the resident parks (GPP has two parks). It's not a 12-screen cineplex, but the movies they show are fairly new. It's a nice GPP perk. In addition, you're 10-15 minutes away from a large theater on Gratiot and about 20-25 minutes away from another near Oakland Mall (I-75 and 14-mile Rd). There are others as well. People comment and comment about how isolated GP is, and while it doesn't have a huge mall smack dab in the middle of it, there are many small shops, restaurants, bars and 3 Kroger grocery stores IN Grosse Pointe (along with other markets and convenience stores).

[hemmie]

Thanks ColdJ and Twehttam... those are very helpful... others?

Twehttam, I'm familiar with Seattle - can you draw any comparisons of GP & B'ham to Seattle neighborhoods? Also, have you been making headway in making friends with your neighbors? Do you feel that your personalities, political leanings, global outlooks etc. fit in with GP generally?

Thank you!

[Twehttam]

Hemmie, I'd say GP is like Montlake while Birmingham is like Mercer Island.

It's been just a couple months, but our immediate neighbors are great and we interact with them a lot. Being from the PacNW I tend to lean left, and while GP may have a Republican reputation, at least one of my next door neighbors jives with my POV. It has not been a problem for me at all.

[domodomo]

I would add another advantage to Grosse Pointe is that if you are communting downtown you have multiple routes to choose from. Jefferson, Mack, 94, etc. There is quite a bit of roadway construction, so you want to have multiple options. We moved from Austin, TX which I loved, but my wife likes Grosse Pointe better because of the parks, ablility to walk to the village, etc.

[guyfromchicago]

I appreciate the input/discussion. I hope that people do not misunderstand my previous comments. Everybody knows that the Detroit area has some economic malaise issues (which actually is helpful for people moving here in that real estate prices are consequently depressed/more affordable even in "upscale" locales). I also realize that the city of Detroit is not all bad. I'm in Detroit several times a year for business/ social functions (weddings, etc.). I'm glad that there are some positive changes happening Downtown, etc. That said, every non-Detroit area visitor I know expects a scary city and more often than not thay tell me that Detroit was even worse than they anticipated (the dilapidation, empty store fronts, burned-out cars, abandoned buildings, overall bombed-out war zone effect, the scary/creepy vibe ----these things are all real.). As much as people in Detroit (understandably) like to paint their city as one with some problems, but with lots going for it, I can't honestly see anything appealing about it (although I really REALLY want to). I hate to say this, but is GP becoming so relatively inexpensive because Detroit's problems (especially people moving out) are creeping into it, or is there some kind of invisible "Berlin Wall" that protects it from Detoit's real serious problems. I've notice online that homes in the area of Detroit that border the Grosse Pointes are pathetically cheap (e.g. $15-30k---or less in some cases [!!!], for seemingly nice, move-in ready Post War houses). How can this not give one pause?

[Dexterguy]

Originally Posted by guyfromchicago

I appreciate the input/discussion. I hope that people do not misunderstand my previous comments. Everybody knows that the Detroit area has some economic malaise issues (which actually is helpful for people moving here in that real estate prices are consequently depressed/more affordable even in "upscale" locales). I also realize that the city of Detroit is not all bad. I'm in Detroit several times a year for business/ social functions (weddings, etc.). I'm glad that there are some positive changes happening Downtown, etc. That said, every non-Detroit area visitor I know expects a scary city and more often than not thay tell me that Detroit was even worse than they anticipated (the dilapidation, empty store fronts, burned-out cars, abandoned buildings, overall bombed-out war zone effect, the scary/creepy vibe ----these things are all real.). As much as people in Detroit (understandably) like to paint their city as one with some problems, but with lots going for it, I can't honestly see anything appealing about it (although I really REALLY want to). I hate to say this, but is GP becoming so relatively inexpensive because Detroit's problems (especially people moving out) are creeping into it, or is there some kind of invisible "Berlin Wall" that protects it from Detoit's real serious problems. I've notice online that homes in the area of Detroit that border the Grosse Pointes are pathetically cheap (e.g. $15-30k---or less in some cases [!!!], for seemingly nice, move-in ready Post War houses). How can this not give one pause?

[SIZE=3]I basically agree with everything that you have said, it is sad the way that people thin of Detroit. And those thoughts sadly spread throughout the entire region. I can’t even get my uncle or relatives to go Downtown with me anymore because they are stuck on the idea that Detroit is a terrible, dangerous place. I have been telling them for years now, about 2003 (when the GM wintergarden and river walk was built) that Detroit has been improving tremendously and that they would probably be stunned if they saw the huge improvements in downtown.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I believe that the houses along the Grosse Pointe/Detroit border have also been the same prices compared to the houses right across the street in Detroit. So that really has not changed to much, what has changed is that the houses in Detroit have dropped so much that this is obviously going to affect how much a Grosse Pointe house will go on the market for.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]

[Dexterguy]

^^Sorry everyone about the text, I have to type these posts in a word doc. otherwise the computer will eat up my writing, I trying to fix it.

[usroute10]

The answer is no. The GP communities are not going to put up with what Detroit residents in that neighborhood are willing to put up with. The police presence is very strong in these communities, and the GPs have not gone downhill.

[Cato the Elder]

I've lived in Detroit (Birmingham, Royal Oak), Boston (Backbay and Somerville), NY (Park Slope and Upper Westside), Philly (Queen Village, University City), Chicago (Lakeview, Naperville, Arlington Heights, Deerfield), SF (Laurel Heights), LA (Santa Monica), London, Rome, Athens, etc. If you want a holistic city life to the nth degree, as you easily experience in the cities I've mentioned above, the Birmingham area and maybe Ann Arbor are the places to be in SE MI. It's not just the Somerset Collection that makes it so. You can truly find anything you or your family needs in that area - remote control helicopter club, skydiving club, AMC club, bouzouki lessons, tai chi, Thai cooking lessons, Kendo lessons, Metallica concerts, Swahili class, etc. There just aren't enough opportunities, interests, space, and people in GP to foster this. IF on the off-chance you need to go into the city, it's not that much farther than someone coming in from GP. You can easily get into the city in 20-30 minutes. It's similar to LA though in that you rarely go downtown except for maybe a game, concert, or convention.

Originally Posted by hemmie

We're having the exact same questions. We were pretty set on GP but are now seriously considering Birmingham. I have some specific questions that have been discussed, but maybe some additional opinions would be illuminating:
- what exactly is the commute time from Birmingham to Wayne State (I've heard anywhere from 15 minutes to 50 minutes - what's the truth during rush hour?)
- how isolated is GP? (how far do you have to travel to go see a movie? how diverse are the restaurants?)
- just how open ARE the GPs are to new people? to new opinions? to global outlooks? or, put another way, just how hostile are the GPs to outsiders or people whose grandparents weren't from there or people who don't dress the way they do? (can you tell I have been reading old threads???)
- why are home prices in Birmingham proper still SO high (while housing in GP is very low right now and likely still falling)?
- what do you get for your very high taxes in Birmingham? Taxes in GP are sky high, but you seem to get a lot for your money, which is appealing.

Thanks so much in advance...

I did the 14 Mile/Woodward to WSU commute for 2 years. Fast drivers (like me) can do it from driveway to parking deck in 15 minutes (it was exactly 16 miles for me) taking Woodward, I-696, I-75, Warren exit. Slow drivers will take 25 minutes. I left in the morning at 8am and left WSU by 4:30 - no problems. If you leave at 8:30, things can get backed up near campus as most of the staff arrive a little before 9am for their day. Likewise, if you leave after 4:30 in the afternoon, things can get bad. Even in the worst case scenario (snowstorm, accident), it took maybe an hour and this happened 3 times in my two years there. Metro Detroit traffic is a joke compared to most cities -don't believe anyone who has never sat in CA traffic for three hours and never sees the constant accidents. I saw maybe 2 or 3 accidents during my two years of commuting into the city.

Birmingham taxes are brutal - no other way to describe it. It funds arguably the best MI public schools, parks, street maintenance, etc. Downtown Birmingham is like downtown Santa Monica, including Montana Ave, but smaller. It even has a Google office. The GP commercial corridor is like Hancock Park in LA or Baltimore Ave in Philly. There's a Trader Joe's and...not much else - couple restaurants, Starbucks, Caribou Coffee. It's serviceable, but by no means vibrant. One might even all it depressing depending on your point of view as it's neither a quaint Main St downtown from yesteryear nor a modern downtown like Birmingham, A2, Royal Oak. For quaint downtown, I put Plymouth and Rochester way above GP.

[minibrings]

Personally I found GP somewhat isolated. And I am not a big fan of Birmingham -- but if you have kids it would be a good choice. I prefer Franklin.. I have MANY happy memories of going to the cider mill and enjoying fresh cider and donuts. I moved to Michigan from San Francisco and I liked that part of Oakland county best. West Bloomfield, Franklin. It was almost country (coming from San Francisco).

I doubt you could go wrong with either chose and it should boil down to your commute.

BTW.. I have since moved to NYC (Upper West Side), Connecticut, NNJ, New Zealand, Australia and now Toronto. I find that I do make that occasional trip to Detroit willingly -- to visit the old friends and to stop at the Detroit Institute of Art which has just been renovated -- still one of my favorite places to spend a cold winter day! I found enough culture in Detroit to satisfy me, I just had to get in the car and drive (I was used to public transport in SF). I found great old neighborhoods such as Palmer Woods. I was actually taking friends from Oakland County and showing them the city that they grew up to next door!

I am headed into Detroit for the auto show this weekend and I hope the Mexican village area is still there as Toronto is severely lacking in good Mexican food and I am in dire need for a real Mexican fix (I'd even go to Xoximilco).