Is Grosse Pointe still an ideal place for relocation? (Detroit: real estate, crime)

[guyfromchicago]

I currently live in Chicago (Lincoln Park) with my wife and kids. We love the city, but will most likely have to move to Metro Detroit b/c of work. I'm a native of the Detroit-area, but haven't lived there since high school (I'm now 41). We're city people, but obviously the city of Detroit is not an option (too depressed, dangerous, socioeconomic implosion, etc.). I always liked GP ---the mature trees, vintage homes, sidewalks, pleasant atmosphere, etc., but I'm not sure about the wisdom of moving there over Oakland County (Birmingham/Bloomfield Hills, etc.). Is the GP area in decline? Compared to Lincoln Park(Chicago) everywhere around Detroit now seems crazy inexpensive real estate-wise, but the housing deals in GP are kinda' scary. (For example, our realtor emailed us details on a georgeous 9-bedroom 1920s mansion in GP Farms listed at the same price we paid for our 4 bdr./3.5 ba. 1880s townhouse here in Chicago ---INSANE!). Also, what's up with the lack of restaurants (upscale or otherwise?) in GP, and I noticed that the public schools don't have really outstanding average MEAP scores (we're OK with private schools, but want good public ones as a backup). You get the picture. We love the houses in GP, but I'm having real second thoughts about buying a home there. Any opinons?

[Cliffie]

The West Side has always been MUCH friendlier than the East Side, if you ask me. As in, it's like a different country. The pointless hostility of Grosse Pointers makes me never want to set foot there again. G Pte Park is a lot more depressed than kit used to be, but as far as I know the other Pointes are OK visually and socioeconomically, and of course a ot closer to the water. If you need to live on the east Side to reduce the commute, I recommnend the city -- once you cross the line the people magically become nice again. Ditto St. Clair Shores although the houses are a lot humbler.

[Dexterguy]

I have always loved the Grosse Pointes (specifically the Farms, Shores, and Woods). But as other people have said it can have some pretty rude and snobby people. Grosse Pointers absolutely hate outsiders.

But the Pointes are without a doubt a very beautiful and nice suburb. The schools are still some of the very best in the entire state. If you don't like public schools, then you can look into private schools, there is the Grosse Pointe Academy and Catholic schools.

If I had a choice bewteen the Pointes and Oakland County suburbs such as Bloomfield Hills, Bloomfield Twp, etc. I would probably chose the Pointes because I love Lake St. Clair.

[Twehttam]

I disagree entirely with Cliffie's view above. Here's a post I made last week regarding GP: http://www.city-data.com/forum/detro...st6878666.html If you need any direct help, feel free.

[usroute10]

Grosse Pointe is an ideal place for relocation. It has GREAT schools and GREAT ARCHITECTURE. Within the Grosse Pointe communities (there are 5), there are two walkable commercial districts that have restaraunts. However, this is the Detroit area, and we don't have rapid transit that links destinations, so you are going to have to drive to a lot of places. Nearby St. Clair has many restaraunts along its "Nautical Mile" commercial strip, and you are only 15 minutes from Downtown and Midtown Detroit, where there are plenty of places to eat.

Another older community that has a nice little downtown and GREAT schools is Plymouth, in Wayne County. It can be expensive, but not as expensive as Birmingham.
It is 20 minutes from Ann Arbor, which has a great downtown, and 35-45 minutes from Downtown Detroit.

You need to consider commute time to your job, when you choose where to live. The Grosse Pointes are in the southeastern corner of the metro off by themselves. Plymouth is in the far west side of the metro.

Also, there are still 900,000 residents in the city of Detroit. We don't all live in fear for our lives. Not every corner of its 140 sq. miles is dangerous. Not by a long shot.

[Coldjensens]

Grosse point is wonderful. Go see for yourslef.

[GMonkey]

If you need to be on the East Side for commuting, I'd def go with GP. I personally prefer Birmingham/Bloomfield area, but the commute from W to E can really suck.

[hemmie]

We're having the exact same questions. We were pretty set on GP but are now seriously considering Birmingham. I have some specific questions that have been discussed, but maybe some additional opinions would be illuminating:
- what exactly is the commute time from Birmingham to Wayne State (I've heard anywhere from 15 minutes to 50 minutes - what's the truth during rush hour?)
- how isolated is GP? (how far do you have to travel to go see a movie? how diverse are the restaurants?)
- just how open ARE the GPs are to new people? to new opinions? to global outlooks? or, put another way, just how hostile are the GPs to outsiders or people whose grandparents weren't from there or people who don't dress the way they do? (can you tell I have been reading old threads???)
- why are home prices in Birmingham proper still SO high (while housing in GP is very low right now and likely still falling)?
- what do you get for your very high taxes in Birmingham? Taxes in GP are sky high, but you seem to get a lot for your money, which is appealing.

Thanks so much in advance...

[guyfromchicago]

Thanks for all the advice. One thing that I noticed growing up in the Detroit area and from I can tell from friends, family, people responding to this blog, etc. is how judgemental people are about where other people live (people in Grosse Pointes are mean snobs, people Downriver are "white trash", people in Oakland County thinking they're really special because thay have one upscale mall and some higher than average per capita income stats, etc.). Maybe it's because Metro Detroit is so socioeconomically segregated that it creates so many "us" and "them" stereotypes. Maybe it's because the city is such a mess that people relate only to suburban real estate agent-type boasting. If people travel, live/spend time in other places (I lived in LA, NYC, France and Chicago) they find this silly and petty (the rest of the world thinks Detroit is a horrible crime and grime nightmare with a failed economy and its suburbs will be a reflection of this) OK, I know I'm venting here, but also what's up with all the "rankism" (e.g. Novi's better than South Lyon, but not as good as Northville and not in the same league as Birmingham, "Old Money" Grosse Pointers are better than "nouveaux" parvenus in Oakland County and vice versa, etc.). GET A LIFE PEOPLE! The fact is real estate in the Detroit area is so cheap now that one doesn't have to be rich to live anywhere, so why all the attitude? It's just suburban Detroit, not some world class bation of sophistication and wealth. Anyway, thanks again

[Coldjensens]

Originally Posted by hemmie

we're having the exact same questions. We were pretty set on gp but are now seriously considering birmingham. I have some specific questions that have been discussed, but maybe some additional opinions would be illuminating:
- what exactly is the commute time from birmingham to wayne state (i've heard anywhere from 15 minutes to 50 minutes - what's the truth during rush hour?)

15 minutes is not the truth. 50 is high but it could take that long on snowy days. It will vary with weather and traffic. If i were doing that commute, i would leave 40 minutes to be sure i arrived on time.

- how isolated is gp? (how far do you have to travel to go see a movie? How diverse are the restaurants?)

different people will give you different answers to this question. There are some resturaunts. Do you have a problem with a resturaunt or theater where you are the only white people present?

- just how open are the gps are to new people? To new opinions? To global outlooks? Or, put another way, just how hostile are the gps to outsiders or people whose grandparents weren't from there or people who don't dress the way they do? (can you tell i have been reading old threads???)

i know about 30 people who live in g.p. All of them are nice normal down to earth people. They shop at target and meiers just like anyone else. There is some old money in g.p. So probably some snobbery. It all depends on who you meet. Birmingham is more new money and has a reputation for snobbery. However there are tons of wonderful people in birmingham too. Birmingham is usually described to me as the city filled with 60 y/o businessmen and their 30 something trophy wives. However althgouh you will see quite a bit of that in birmingham, it is certainly not a majority. There are simply too many people in both places to generalize about all of them. There are certianly snobs in both places. There are just as certainly great down to earth people in both places. Everyone's experience will differ, it all depends on whom you enCOUNTer and what you are looking for. If you are looking for snobbery, you will probably find it in either place.

- why are home prices in birmingham proper still so high (while housing in gp is very low right now and likely still falling)?

I think that there was more automotive related money in gp. I am not sure though. Gp being surrouinded by detroit which is growing more and more unpopular has taken a harder hit than areas more distan from the city. Gp is also older. It is not as much the in place to live. Birmingham is the place for the newly rich.

- what do you get for your very high taxes in birmingham? Taxes in gp are sky high, but you seem to get a lot for your money, which is appealing.

Thanks so much in advance...

between the two, the people that i know who live in gp all love it there. No one has anyhting negative to say about it. About half of the people that i know in birmingham love it. The others dislike it, or like the city but dislike the atmosphere.

No questions schools and services in both communities are execellent. Crime is basically nil. Right now, birmingham is probably the more prestigious address, although gp residents might dispute that.

You are in an enviable position choosing between those two cities. You will have a hard time making a bad choice.