From AKC: New Texas Bills Unfair to Responsible Owners and Breeders (surgery, pugs)

[latetotheparty]

Originally Posted by Va-Cat

Since your profile Misfitz shows you to be from LA - I'd like to ask what in the world you know about Tx politics and our issues here in Texas? We are trying hard to limit the mass invasion of BYBs and puppy mills that are popping up all around our state. Both of these bills address those issues. The restrictions are needed and appropriate for the situation here. Please spare me the song and dance about the poor "one litter a year" breeders. They are few and far between. To All Texans, please don't take my endorsement of these bills or Misfitz's condemnation of them as fact. Do some research and make up your own mind as to what is best for our state. I did my research and yes - I support both of them!

wonder if they're heading to texas from here.... breeders here are still dumping dogs at an alarming rate.... and just last week over 70 were confiscated by the Missouri Humane Society in St. Louis.... and this is in spite of the fact that some of our state senators have taken it upon themselves to oppose the will of the people in this state and attempt to gut the puppy mill bill that was passed by voters last November....

[mrs1885]

I think it makes total sense. Put your dogs inside. Period. Problem solved. Didn't cost you a damn dime. Of course, you'll have to get off your butt and housebreak the dog. An irresponsible owner of course won't like that idea. I see no reason why ANY dog should be allowed outside and unsecured / uncontained.

[Va-Cat]

Originally Posted by latetotheparty

wonder if they're heading to texas from here.... breeders here are still dumping dogs at an alarming rate.... and just last week over 70 were confiscated by the Missouri Humane Society in St. Louis.... and this is in spite of the fact that some of our state senators have taken it upon themselves to oppose the will of the people in this state and attempt to gut the puppy mill bill that was passed by voters last November....

I read about what your state government is doing and you'd better believe that a lot of money is flying under the table and into re-election funds and pockets!

As to where the Texas puppy-millers are coming from.... Yup Missouri is one of the areas. Commercial dog breeder licenses have exploded in number over the last 2 years in Texas. They get chased out of one state and look for another one that has less restrictive laws. I just hope we can get legislation in place to keep them moving on out of my backyard!

[latetotheparty]

just read an article about this mess..... one of the state senators behind this, well, his dear momma is a breeder in the salem, mo area.... IMAGINE that.....

i did send an email to my state senator and got a very nice reply the next day.... said in essence that over 60% of the voters in Jefferson County had voted for Prop B, and that he was one of those voters, and that he was doing everything in his power to ensure that the will of the people is followed.....

was quite surprised by that 60% figure.... jefferson county is still pretty rural.....

[Va-Cat]

Originally Posted by latetotheparty

just read an article about this mess..... one of the state senators behind this, well, his dear momma is a breeder in the salem, mo area.... IMAGINE that.....

i did send an email to my state senator and got a very nice reply the next day.... said in essence that over 60% of the voters in Jefferson County had voted for Prop B, and that he was one of those voters, and that he was doing everything in his power to ensure that the will of the people is followed.....

was quite surprised by that 60% figure.... jefferson county is still pretty rural.....

LOL - I'm pleased that your rural folk understand and just because its rural doesn't mean "bumpkin" Now lets just hope that the voters kick the butt of any senator that decided he knows better than they do

[misfitz]

Well, it’s not my condemnation, it’s AKC’s. I posted here so we could discuss, which we’re doing, so great! Sorry, Mods, I didn’t realize I could only quote a few sentences. Will be more careful about that!

Sorry in advance for the long post. I try to be concise, but I usually fail.

AA

"Commercial breeder" means a person who possesses 11 or more adult intact female animals

Possess means to have custody OR control over.

I interpret that to mean any dog on the premises counts, and ALSO any dog that Suzy Q. Breeder legally owns, even if it isn't living with her.

11 intact females doesn’t mean they are all being bred, or ever will be bred. They might be seniors, former show dogs that are now happy couch-warmers. Say that Suzy Q. Breeder has 4 of these in the house.

They might be showing. Campaigning for a championship can take a several years. Often these dogs don’t live with the breeder full-time, they live with professional handlers and travel around the country to shows. Or they are co-owned, and live with the co-owner. Say Suzy Q. owns 4 of these.

So now we’re up to 8 already. Only 3 left of the allowed amount of intact female dogs. The law says that any dog 6 months or older is considered an adult, and thus counts towards the limit. So if we, I mean Suzy, has only one female that’s currently part of the breeding program, and 2 6-month old female puppies, she’s now at her limit.

Other reasons for having more dogs around are, it’s hard to tell if they will be show quality until they mature, which can be anywhere from 2-5 years, depending on the breed. Health testing can’t be done until then as well. So these dogs that are “growing out”in dog-show terms, count towards the limit. There's a school of thought that it's best to spay/neuter after the dog is grown, or at around 1 year old. So puppies destined for pet homes, that will be spayed eventually, will also count towards this limit.

Often breeders will keep in touch with puppy buyers, and board their dogs for them, or take them back if the owners can no longer care for them. These dogs will also count towards the limit. If another owner's female is being bred to Suzy Q.'s male, and is staying with Suzy for a week or so, she also counts towards the limit.

So as I see it, it's pretty easy for a small-scale hobby breeder, who may only breed one litter every few years, to fall under the "commercial breeder" numbers.

and is engaged in the business of breeding animals for direct or indirect sale or for exchange in return for consideration.

Which I would take to mean if you sell one puppy, ever, you meet this qualification.

So now, it seems that Suzy Q. Hobby Breeder must undergo a criminal background check in order to get a license to breed her dogs. Well, actually, the license is to OWN her dogs, regardless of whether she breeds them or not.

She will also have her name listed in a public directory of “Commercial Breeders”.

REGISTRATION OF CERTAIN EMPLOYEES OF COMMERCIAL BREEDERS. The commission by rule may establish registration procedures for any person whose duties and responsibilities include the handling of or caring for an animal in a commercial breeder ’s facility.

Which I interpret to mean that if Suzy Q. hires the neighbor’s kid to help her socialize puppies, the neighbor’s kid is now subject to regulation.

In conducting an inspection under this section, an inspector may not enter or access any portion of a private residence of a commercial breeder except as necessary to access animals, documents, records, or other property relevant to the inspection.

That just confuses me, what do they do if the dogs live in the house?

[latetotheparty]

any intact female is a potential breeder.... suzy q can SAY she is only using them for show or that they are retired from showing until she is blue in the face..... they have the capacity and ability to produce litters of puppies..... deliberately or accidentally.... and if they are retirees, and are not going to be bred, why not have them spayed??

[Va-Cat]

Obviously the AKC wants as little regulation as possible. If they had stepped up to the plate and took a more active roll in requiring responsible breed practices, government intervention wouldn't be necessary. As I said in my first post, Texas has seen an alarming increase in applications for commercial breeding licenses. These laws are needed so we don't become the next "Puppy Mill Capital" of the US. There has been a huge increase in awareness in Texas of puppy mills. Austin, and El Paso have both passed local ordinances against the retail sale of companion animals and this state legislation takes the next step to safeguard our state from abusive and unethical breeding facilities and practice.

[misfitz]

Originally Posted by latetotheparty

any intact female is a potential breeder.... suzy q can SAY she is only using them for show or that they are retired from showing until she is blue in the face..... they have the capacity and ability to produce litters of puppies..... deliberately or accidentally.... and if they are retirees, and are not going to be bred, why not have them spayed??

Spaying is major surgery. If a dog is elderly, why put her through the stress of that? I'd argue that putting an elderly dog through anesthesia and major surgery, just because the owner doesn't want to worry about separating her from the boys, isn't in the best interest of the dog. Especially for breeds like Pugs and such, for which anesthesia always carries a big risk.

Just because a dog is intact doesn't mean it's going to have puppies. It's possible to keep the boys and girls separated, people have been doing it for years. One does have to think about it and be attentive, but many people are quite capable of that.

I don't see an unfixed dog as a ticking time bomb. In the hands of someone who's going to let them run loose, well, yeah, but if the owner keeps the dog in the house, takes precautions and is responsible, I don't think an oops litter is inevitable.

[subject2change]

Misfitz, lots of laws can cause problems for a few people who weren't doing anything wrong, while at the same time they do a lot of good overall. I'm wondering, what law would you write to prevent people from operating puppy mills?