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Old 10-24-2011, 02:30 PM
 
Location: Montreal -> CT -> MA -> Montreal
12,150 posts, read 11,160,403 times
Reputation: 15570
Quote:
Originally Posted by subject2change View Post
Charlie, just wanted to say that dog aggression and human aggression are two completely unrelated things. A human can definitely get hurt trying to come between two fighting dogs that are too upset to notice what they are biting. This is what you all need to be careful of. But the fact that a dog attacks another dog in no way means it would attack a human. Maybe you can understand better by thinking of a dog that hates cats. There are some dogs that can't be trusted around cats at all, but nobody thinks, oh that dog might attack another dog, or a person, because of that. People understand the difference there. It's the same with dog aggression vs. human aggression.
^^ So smart.

I'd rep you if I had any left to give around. In fact, I'd rep you twice if that was allowed.
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Old 10-24-2011, 02:44 PM
 
Location: midwest suburbia
5,844 posts, read 4,480,204 times
Reputation: 6943
PF, nobody here has jumped on the OP. I repped him for caring so much about his dogs and trying to figure out the best thing to do. If we stated things we thought he could do differently, it was because that was why he posted his question. And could you cool it with the caps and exclamatian points?
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Old 10-24-2011, 02:46 PM
 
Location: midwest suburbia
5,844 posts, read 4,480,204 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DandJ View Post
^^ So smart.

I'd rep you if I had any left to give around. In fact, I'd rep you twice if that was allowed.
Thanks!
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Old 10-24-2011, 03:05 PM
 
4,919 posts, read 9,361,889 times
Reputation: 5708
Quote:
Originally Posted by subject2change View Post
PF, nobody here has jumped on the OP. I repped him for caring so much about his dogs and trying to figure out the best thing to do. If we stated things we thought he could do differently, it was because that was why he posted his question. And could you cool it with the caps and exclamatian points?
Are you part of the Forum grammer police or are you a moderator?

if you read the dozen or so topics on pitbulls, almost everyone claims that these dogs are never the problem that anything they do is always the fault of the owner being irresponsible. Some have claim that there has NEVER been a single case of a pitbull ever turning on its owner and any time it happened it was not the dogs fault but the irresponsible owners fault. I decided that maybe they are correct and so I'm defering to their know it all expertise and telling the OP that by the postings on CD, they are the problem and the dogs don;t need no tarining or behavorist. I mean, why should the OP spend mopney on these things when the fault is with them as irresponsible dog owners since pitbull do no wrong ever? Or, was all that talk just nonse=nse and in fact there are times when a pitbull (or any bred for that mantter) could do bonkers despite the best loving home they are in with the most caring owners possible. Please don;t tell me that those people who have been saying pitbulls are angels and owners are devils are wrong. I mean they said it so many times, I find it offensive that you are getting on my back for repeating what so many have said for so long.

To the OP, I stand by my words based on what so many pitbull experts have posted on this forum that your dogs are fine, its you that needs to get straightened out for being an irresponsible owner. Hiowever, I opersonally think most of those defening pitbulls have no idea what they are taklking about... So, pitbulls by their very breed are subject to irrational and aggresive tendencies. What causes them has more to do with natute than training. A Pitbull, like any breed, can turn from being a wonderful loving familiy member to a child or other dog killer with little noticable warnings. Their very natural traits is what makes these turns so serious because they have the naturak ability to inflict serious damage. You will need to decide if this was just that cojo moment or if this is a latent trait waiting to explode again.

A behavorist or a trainer well knowledgable with Pitbulls (not to be confused with a pitbull loyalist who really knows nothing) can help you determine if your seeing nature takeing over or if this was that never to be seen again flip out.
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Old 10-24-2011, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Phoenix,AZ
760 posts, read 454,142 times
Reputation: 3035
This is my take and I have had the same thing happen with my dogs..just not so bad...
First, you see it but you don't get it....your dogs are GREAT friends ..but at the same time since they spend most of their time away from you outside, any time they do get to spend with you they are competing for your love and attention. Then, YOU SET THEM UP TO FAIL by putting them in direct competition with each other for a reward AND your attention. This was fine when they were puppies but they are adults now and everything counts. Yes they were working out dominence issues because you put them there...You forgot to teach them YOU are DOMINANT. Anytime you have more then one dog you have a pack and someone needs to be in charge and that person needs to be YOU.
You NEVER "play fetch" with 2 dogs unless they have been trained to play as 2, which you obviously haven't done.
First tho you must take control of the situation from the very start...put both dogs on leash...being held by 1 person..A second person goes about twenty feet away. Both dogs are on leash and in sit. The first dog is taken off leash, put in sit and called to come..when the dog comes it is immediately put in sit and rewarded warmly.At no time should you allow your dog to jump on you... That dog is called back to the first person and the same thing is done..then do it with the second dog...do this exercise until both dogs 1.do not strain on the leash at any time. 2. only come when called, 3.do not jump on either person. 4. act like they are quite bored with the exercise. Try the exercise off leash when all the conditions above are repeatedly met.
Fetch...this also takes 2 people...put both dogs on leash and in the sit position... let one dog off leash but stays in sit...throw the ball and command fetch..ONE dog runs for the ball the other stays on leash, in sit. When the ball is retrieved the first dog is leashed and put in sit. The 2nd dog is let off leash but in sit... same thing over and over again...When the dog not fetching is not straining on the leash to fetch that dog is rewarded warmly..when the dog returns with the ball that dog is rewarded warmly...This is done over and over until both dogs stay in sit until commanded to fetch and both dogs stop straining on the leash to fetch. But, in all reality you may never be able to play fetch with both dogs off leash.
And I'm going to throw this out there too...if a dog is dog aggressive
and even with re-training was still aggresive I would seriously consider having the canines filed down. It would give me peace of mind 24/7 that my dog could never harm another animal.
Having said THAT..I will also say that I love my dogs..they are my babies. BUT, they weigh a collective 200 lbs so I am very much in control of all of them all the time. I fully realize that they are dogs and as such if something unfortunate happens I am prepared to take immediate and if necessary lethal action. Not here to make enemies thats just the truth as I see it.

Last edited by Chanygirl; 10-24-2011 at 04:45 PM..
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Old 10-24-2011, 03:39 PM
 
Location: midwest suburbia
5,844 posts, read 4,480,204 times
Reputation: 6943
Charlie, sorry for calling you "him"! I forgot for a minute!
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Old 10-24-2011, 03:44 PM
 
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
7,603 posts, read 8,147,350 times
Reputation: 6365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
dear friend why did you go to the pound and get 2 pit bulls? did you say kids in the home?
what you are seeing them do to each other one day they may do to your kids and maybe you.
stop it. there is a reason the pound is full of pit bulls.
a big part of it is ignorant attitudes like yours.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by PacificFlights View Post
Charlieb7, you don't need to file down the teeth, you don;t need to waste money on a dog behavorist, a dog trainer is not needed, don't seperate and rehome the pets, all that is absolutle nonsese and fails to address the number one point & issue all the "professional" or "knowledgable" pitbull owners have been saying here for a long time.
It's Not The Dogs - IT"S ALL YOUR FAULT!!!!!!!
Do aquick search on CD's dog forum about topics on pitbaull and you will rwad over and over again that pitbull are not aggressive, they are not mean, they do not attcak - and when it does happen it always the fault of the owner and never the dog. So to follow any suggestion about getting a dog trainer or behavorist is dumb since the dogs are fine and its all your fault anyway. You need a people trainer to train you to be a responsible pitbull owner (whatever that means) as has been suggested over and over again on this forum. So do your own reading and you see that your dogs are 100% normal and sweet loving animals and if they did anything aggressive, IT'S ALL YOUR FAULT!!!!!!!

oh pullleaze..... ... the op has no idea of the dog's histories and how they were raised, trained and treated prior to their surrender to the pound .... owner surrenders almost always lie or stretch the truth or conceal.... all to make themselves feel better for dumping their problems in someone else's lap.....
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Old 10-24-2011, 04:31 PM
 
4,919 posts, read 9,361,889 times
Reputation: 5708
Quote:
Originally Posted by latetotheparty View Post
oh pullleaze..... ... the op has no idea of the dog's histories and how they were raised, trained and treated prior to their surrender to the pound .... owner surrenders almost always lie or stretch the truth or conceal.... all to make themselves feel better for dumping their problems in someone else's lap.....

When has any of the pitbull loyalist ever said that a condition was attached and acceptable to their claim of its all the owners fault?

they said that the pitbull is never at fault and its always the owners fault. They even went so far 9as I already mentioned0 that there are no cases where a loving family had a pitbull attack. It was always something to do with the owner, not the dog. Now, I'm hearing that there exist these conditions to that statement. Well they never said that and were standing firm that its always the owner and not the dog.

So, is it fact or fiction that there are cases within the USA where loving caring and responsible owners of pitbulls have been victime of attacks by their otherwise loving pet? I say there are because there are reports (even on some pitbull sites) of this happening, but on that other thread, the pitbull loyalist said that if any attack did occur it was the result of irresponsible owners, not the dog. Which is it? (remeber, I;m not the one who took that one-way only position, the pitbull loyalist said it, so if they were wrong, they need to explain their stance one way in one thread and their change of stance in other threads.) I'm not blaming the OP and I;m not going to create lame "you should have" after the fact to blame the OP, but I;m confused why when it is and isn;t the owners fault.
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Old 10-24-2011, 04:48 PM
 
2,228 posts, read 669,176 times
Reputation: 867
You are right that it is the humans that are the problem. Even with my old pomeranian/mix and new Llasha/Poodle mix there are the exact same issues (or were). Luckily, they make more noise and can't really damage each other but the ONLY time there were issues were when I was playing with the two of them and new Llasha would be jealous and attack old pom. I almost got the jealousy stopped (or at least the behaviour stopped) by "taking down' the Llasha to her side and holding her down for a moment while the pom gets to be "over" her. This is a dog whisperer tactic and has begun to work, but I wouldn't try it with two strong pitbulls. You can NEVER play with the two of them together inside the home or backyard as that would cause protective instincts to kick in. I would think the only thing you will be able to do is to keep on and get rid of one. This isn't as much a dog training issue as a dog physcology issue, so you might want to get the book that Ceasar Milan The Dog Whisperer puts out regarding "bully dogs".
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Old 10-24-2011, 05:09 PM
 
Location: In the middle...
1,240 posts, read 1,005,075 times
Reputation: 1742
Lightbulb Get your facts straight!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by PacificFlights View Post

When has any of the pitbull loyalist ever said that a condition was attached and acceptable to their claim of its all the owners fault?

they said that the pitbull is never at fault and its always the owners fault. They even went so far 9as I already mentioned0 that there are no cases where a loving family had a pitbull attack. It was always something to do with the owner, not the dog. Now, I'm hearing that there exist these conditions to that statement. Well they never said that and were standing firm that its always the owner and not the dog.

So, is it fact or fiction that there are cases within the USA where loving caring and responsible owners of pitbulls have been victime of attacks by their otherwise loving pet? I say there are because there are reports (even on some pitbull sites) of this happening, but on that other thread, the pitbull loyalist said that if any attack did occur it was the result of irresponsible owners, not the dog. Which is it? (remeber, I;m not the one who took that one-way only position, the pitbull loyalist said it, so if they were wrong, they need to explain their stance one way in one thread and their change of stance in other threads.) I'm not blaming the OP and I;m not going to create lame "you should have" after the fact to blame the OP, but I;m confused why when it is and isn;t the owners fault.
Get the story straight! The OP dogs attacked one another. They were rescues. They HAVE NOT attacked a person or the family. Come on, now! Read the post!!!

***No people have been harmed in the making of this post.***
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