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With 3 plus million companion animals euthanized each year, the last thing this country needs is more companion animals flooding the shelter system where half are killed for lack of homes.
I hope you will reconsider your breeding business venture.
There is a demand for new puppies that have been bred. I know this for a fact. Sure, these folks can just go to a shelter and get a dog. But they don't want to. This demand is where the OP is trying to play. Just because the recession has caused folks to give up more dogs, doesn't mean that more people are willing to get dogs at a shelter.
I think you are giving bad business advice. The OP only needs to sell the dogs once. The dog has a 50/50 chance of being given up in the future... but the OP has already completed his part of the transaction and it looks good on the books.
As for the excess in dogs, that's a different issue. I suggest more people neuter and spay (which is the real issue) and they legalize dog meat. While off-topic, these are solutions for that problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJBest
Did you single me out on daycares because you know I own some?
I didn't get the vibe that the OP has no clue about dogs. I assumed that he just left the details out when it came to fixed cost expenses. Maybe I am wrong. I admittedly know little about breeding dogs. (We bought dogs from a neighbor who bred them). But I did say in an earlier post, that the OP should follow the rules.
There is one fundamental difference between a daycare and puppy mill in terms of business. A puppy is a commodity. It is expected for there to be loss, damage, depreciation, appreciation, etc. This is not the case with children in a daycare.
The thought occured to me that if someone were to post in the renting section about buying 10-11 junk properties, breaking them up into smaller units, figuring what rent they would get if all units were rented 100 % of the time (ie no such thing as a "vacancy rate") and as far as cost goes, only considering the mortage but nothing else (like insurance, utilities, deferred maintenence, legal fees etc), the long time landlords and property managers would be all over it like white on rice. So really the boohooing about this not being in the "how to get rich quick" subforum is misplaced. I suspect the mods moved it because no one there has a clue about this type of "business."
What do you think about buying 10 purebred female Maltese dogs for $700 a piece and 1 male for $500 (the females always seem to cost a little more).
So that's $7,500. Then stick them all out in your garage and breed them. You can expect a couple litters per year and each one will give you about 3 puppies. So that's about 60 puppies generated in a year.
Gross receipts of $36,000 (assuming they sell on average at $600), minus let's say $2,000 in food and the $7,500 initial investment in the parents. So that is over $25,000 in profit.
If you want to scale up the operation, build a warehouse thing in your backyard and breed HUNDREDS of dogs. Install massive heaters in there to keep them warm in winter and feed them out of cattle troughs.
Some may say a "puppy mill" like this is cruel, but not if you take care of them and make sure they are healthy. It is just like any other business.
The USDA will shut you down.
There are new regs concerning dog breeding.
What you describe is a puppy mill.
By what you have said you are no where near ready to breed any dogs.
You don't know how to breed them or who is to breed and or when.
Males go for more than females.
2 litters a year is asking a lot from a caged dog.
Your numbers don't add up?
Vet bills?
Did you know you can't sell a pup until it is 8weeks old and it has to have a health cert.
Just keep this venture as a idea because you will loose money and have pups you can't get rid of.
Now that everyone has crapped on your idea
let me ask you this.
Why should I buy a pup from you?
What papers do you need to have for these pups?
and how or who do you get then from?
What papers, ribbons, awards or training do your dogs have that will make your pups stand out from all the rest?
ho ya, you will need a permit from the USDA.
They will inspect your facility, personally.
How do I know.
I've been breeding GSD's for 20years.(I also grew up working in my grandparents kennal)
I hold a breeders lic from the USDA.
I'm breeder in good standing with the AKC
a member of the SV & USCA
You don't go in to being a dog breeder to make money. Few do on a regular bases. All of your money will go right back into your business if you wish to keep it afloat.
Ps most of our pups start at $3000( and go up in price). for a 8wk old pup, litters range from 4-10 pups, We have 4 SchHIII titled femailes with Breed worth ratings in the single digits all import blood lines, titled in Germany, yet some years we make money some we don't.
It takes a lot of money to compete in this industry.
I don't see you making a penny (legitimately)
The dog pound is already full of unwanted cheep animals the last thing the industry needs is another puppy mill.
Last edited by snofarmer; 12-30-2011 at 10:29 AM..
the problem here NJBest...
if we look at this purely 100% logically and unemotionally and remove the "living thing" and "shelter dogs dying" aspect of this entire thread and sriously LOOK at the actual numbers...
in order t produce a product that is worth selling...youll need to invest alot more money than youll ever see returned.
in order to make a profit off a venture like this youd HAVE to produce en mass and mis out the expesnive steps, therfore...selling sub quality merchandise...
you just cant make a profit breeding dogs IF your doing it right.
if your producing a good quality puppy your spending alot more to prove, and continue to ensure the health, condition, conformation, abilities, than youll EVER see returned on yoru investment.
this kind of breding is the equivalent of selling cars that have been gluedtogether with crazy glue and duct tape...
SURE you can get away with it...
you could probably make some deacent mney too...
but what hapens when that product falls apart?
your absolutly right in that in theory, a bad product wouldnt sell and therfore in this kind of situation the op would have to forcus on producing good product to stay in buiesness...
howevr years of experience has proven this to not be true...there are thousands of puppy mils and petstores still in buisness, not because the "product" is good, but because the public in general are dumb as rocks and impulse buy...pet stores rely on impulse purchases...and puppy mills rely on it too.
if peple actually saw where pet stroe puppies came from...in person (a video doesnt even begin to convey...theres an energy, a smell that you have to feel in person)
the short and sweet of it is...
when all emotion is removed form the equation...
it is simply impossible to make a PROFIT in this "business" if you are producing a truly quality product.
repuatable breeders breed for a reason, they breed because they LOVE the bred their invovled in, and want to preserve or improve something about it...
for example a rotty breeder breeding specifuclaly for dogs that can protect a flock, heard sheep and pull a cart...
or a Hound breder trying to better a lines hunting, tracking and holding abilities...
fixing gentic flaws, or strutrual defaults ect...
to be incredbly frank...good breeder breed for vanity...
we dont care about the money...if we did wed all stop doing it cause theres no money to be made doing this "right"...were quite happy to break even on a litter...
we do it instead because we want recognition for producing the best "product" we like to be told how amazing out dogs are, howinlove their families are, what a great hunter, herder ect the dog turned out to be...we like to know that all the hours we put into showing, testing and proving our dogs and the HUNDERDS of hours we put into researching blood lines structure and gentics to figure out the best stud for our female has all been worth it...we like to get pictures and be gushed over, and hear from new clinets they were refered from such and such because he was SOOOO happy with his puppy...we like to hear form people who have our dogs for 13+ years about how amazing, and healthy and wondrufll they have been their entire lives ect..
a Good breeder breeds for recognition...not for cash!
Why not breed children for adoption? If you impregnate twenty women per year and sell the infants for 50k each that's one million dollars. If it gores well have a thousand and feed them out of troughs. You'll make fifty million. A lawyer will make sure it's all legal.
If you sold to people who were absolutely unable to adopt you could probably double your earnings. That's one hundred million dollars.
Why not breed children for adoption? If you impregnate twenty women per year and sell the infants for 50k each that's one million dollars. If it gores well have a thousand and feed them out of troughs. You'll make fifty million. A lawyer will make sure it's all legal.
If you sold to people who were absolutely unable to adopt you could probably double your earnings. That's one hundred million dollars.
the problem here NJBest...
if we look at this purely 100% logically and unemotionally and remove the "living thing" and "shelter dogs dying" aspect of this entire thread and sriously LOOK at the actual numbers...
in order t produce a product that is worth selling...youll need to invest alot more money than youll ever see returned.
in order to make a profit off a venture like this youd HAVE to produce en mass and mis out the expesnive steps, therfore...selling sub quality merchandise...
you just cant make a profit breeding dogs IF your doing it right.
if your producing a good quality puppy your spending alot more to prove, and continue to ensure the health, condition, conformation, abilities, than youll EVER see returned on yoru investment.
this kind of breding is the equivalent of selling cars that have been gluedtogether with crazy glue and duct tape...
SURE you can get away with it...
you could probably make some deacent mney too...
but what hapens when that product falls apart?
your absolutly right in that in theory, a bad product wouldnt sell and therfore in this kind of situation the op would have to forcus on producing good product to stay in buiesness...
howevr years of experience has proven this to not be true...there are thousands of puppy mils and petstores still in buisness, not because the "product" is good, but because the public in general are dumb as rocks and impulse buy...pet stores rely on impulse purchases...and puppy mills rely on it too.
if peple actually saw where pet stroe puppies came from...in person (a video doesnt even begin to convey...theres an energy, a smell that you have to feel in person)
the short and sweet of it is...
when all emotion is removed form the equation...
it is simply impossible to make a PROFIT in this "business" if you are producing a truly quality product.
repuatable breeders breed for a reason, they breed because they LOVE the bred their invovled in, and want to preserve or improve something about it...
for example a rotty breeder breeding specifuclaly for dogs that can protect a flock, heard sheep and pull a cart...
or a Hound breder trying to better a lines hunting, tracking and holding abilities...
fixing gentic flaws, or strutrual defaults ect...
to be incredbly frank...good breeder breed for vanity...
we dont care about the money...if we did wed all stop doing it cause theres no money to be made doing this "right"...were quite happy to break even on a litter...
we do it instead because we want recognition for producing the best "product" we like to be told how amazing out dogs are, howinlove their families are, what a great hunter, herder ect the dog turned out to be...we like to know that all the hours we put into showing, testing and proving our dogs and the HUNDERDS of hours we put into researching blood lines structure and gentics to figure out the best stud for our female has all been worth it...we like to get pictures and be gushed over, and hear from new clinets they were refered from such and such because he was SOOOO happy with his puppy...we like to hear form people who have our dogs for 13+ years about how amazing, and healthy and wondrufll they have been their entire lives ect..
a Good breeder breeds for recognition...not for cash!
This post should be directed at the OP. Not me. I am not looking to get into the business.
However, your bring up some good points that are related to the OPs post (as did snofarmer). I hope the OP will consider the points you both made.
Why not breed children for adoption? If you impregnate twenty women per year and sell the infants for 50k each that's one million dollars. If it gores well have a thousand and feed them out of troughs. You'll make fifty million. A lawyer will make sure it's all legal.
If you sold to people who were absolutely unable to adopt you could probably double your earnings. That's one hundred million dollars.
Or for eating for that matter..... We can bring in all sorts of irrelevant things that are *alike* in terms of how we do things as a society. But we'll always play the double-standard game. It's okay to eat pig, but not horse, dog or human? Not that I seriously would, but if you're going to take the moral route, you have to be consistent. Not put up a double-standard.
to be quite honest, theres very few animal industries that make a good profit (theres a reson small scale farming is dying...in order to make a profit you have to mas produce and people who actually love this kind of work dont want to be those kinds of people...
(you ever seen what a chicken battery farm looks like?! or what a veal farm looks like? or how most daiy and meat cattle being sold to mass markets are kept?
were flooded with "happy cows" in feilds in california and beef cows being herded over wide open range in montanna, and perdu chicken primping and prepping for the camera...
but the reality is those chickens have thier beaks chopped off and are cramed into 1sqft cages...those dairy cows are often almost udder deep in their own waste, and beef cattle are raised on feed lots barley ig enough to move (because it keeps the beef more "tender") veal calves are chained to sticks on an aproximatly 18" chain and fed junk...
you want that beef raised on montana pasture, be prepared to pay tripple for it and the rancher will still be lucky if he can pay his feed bill this year...
want that fresh pasture raised cram, be prepared to quadruple store milk prices and the dairy famer will still be struggling to afford to keep up his equiptment...
want that fre range pastrue fresh chicken, be prepared to triple the price per lb and the famrer will still be lucky if he can afford to take some of that chicken for his own table...
its impossible to raise animals humanley, produce the best product possible, and still make the big bucks...
theres a reason true farmers continue farming...
and theres a reason TRUE farmers are a dying breed...
its hard work, its long hours, theres no vacation time and youll be lucky to make a few bucks...
same goes for puppies, kittens ect.
if you want to make money in the animal industry quite honeslty youve got a few options
1: KOI, buy em little and grow em out...if you educate yourself on what to look for, pick carefully you CAN mae hundereds of dollars on koi youve grown out at home...
youve got the expense of set up, running filtration initial stock and feed, but theres no health testing, no soclization needed, no training or vet checks...and if you buy a little 3" koi at the pet store for $5 keep it for a few years you can get about $20 a pop for a 6-10" fish...
2: breed feeder rodents...
once again they breed rapidly dont need much space and there will always be a market for them. they dont need any truly special vet care of health testing (because lets face it the cancers feeder rodents are prone to arnt contageous) and they have a shor tlife span combined with large litters...
food enclosure and such,you dont have to sell them for alot but on a large enough scale if youve got a market...this could fetch a nice profit for minimal imput and effort...
3: tank raised tilapia...like the koi, easy to do, cost of tanks and running equiptment but no socilization, grooming ect needs...they grow pretty quick and fresh tilapia sells for a nice price...
thats about it...those are your best bets for making a profit in the animal business!
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