People down on "Mini Aussies"? (border collie, shepherd, labs)
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I looked at a "mini aussie" today.Been reading up on them and many..
People seem to be pretty negative about them.
Anyone have a view?I guess in some cases poor breeders..
Are responsible for creating this breed possibly causing health issues.
well think about it, the aussie is fairly consistently a medium/large breed...
so in order to get a MINI aussie 1 of 2 things had to happen...
1: mix in a small breed to bring the size down...
mixing breeds for cosmetic only reasons is looked down upon by GOOD breeders plain and simple...
or 2: they breed RUNT (the smallest in the litter) to another runt continuing the process to get the "mini" version...the problem with this method is 1:runts are typically the weakest puppies genetically, and 2: runts are NOT within show standards and GOOD breeders are breeding towards a specific standard for the breed...meaning that it would have been irresponsible breeders breeding dogs that dont look like they should, are genetically inferior, and potentially have any number of health issues, JUST to get a smaller dog.
now personally i dont like aussies in any way shape or form, they are insanely high energy and minis are even higher on the energy (i worked with a few at the doggy day care and what i say about the minis is they took the energy level of the standard and squeezed it into a smaller packeage...it is as if there going to explode...aussies NEED a job, be it agility or herding sheep, i dont suggest them for the "average" family no matter what size.
but i have no real problen with the creation of the minis as long as the breeders are doing apropriate health testing, pen hip, OFA, Cerf, Optigen ect on their lines and that they are following a breed standard...and otherwise good RESPONSIBLE, RESPECTABLE breeders.
The Miniature Australian Shepherd, North American Shepherd, North American Miniature Australian Shepherd, and/or Toy Australian Shepherd breeds are not recognized as a variety of Australian Shepherd by ASCA. The club considers such dogs to be a distinct and separate breed and will not accept them into its registry.
I've been around the standard Ausie breed a lot and considered getting one but because of their energy level and size I decided not too.
There are some real distinctions in the breed it's self as with many breeds there are "working lines" and "show lines" the working lines tend to be much smaller than some of the show lines.
The AKC size standard for the Australian Shepherd:
Quote:
Size, Proportion, Substance
Size--The preferred height for males is 20-23 inches, females 18-21 inches. Quality is not to be sacrificed in favor of size. Proportion--Measuring from the breastbone to rear of thigh and from top of the withers to the ground the Australian Shepherd is slightly longer than tall. Substance--Solidly built with moderate bone. Structure in the male reflects masculinity without coarseness. ******* appear feminine without being slight of bone.
The Mini size standard:
Quote:
SIZE: Height for dogs and ******* is 14 inches up to 18 inches at the top of withers. Quality not to be sacrificed in favor of size within the guidelines of this breed standard.
Now if you go to the actual Ausie web site:
Quote:
SIZE: The size specifications do not decrease overall range, but do acknowledge a differentiation between males and females. A two-inch differentiation is generally recognized as necessary for maintaining size. In establishing the three-inch span for each sex, a statistical study with sample size of 85 dogs was performed. The study revealed the size spans chosen were ideal with the spans encompassing 95 percent of the sample in a normal bell curve distribution with the greatest number of dogs falling in the middle. The statistician informed the Committee that our size ranges were the most ideal and the distribution the best he had seen in an animal-related study. He cautioned us, however, that to eliminate the other five percent falling outside of the range on either side would eventually cause a disruption in the distribution as those individuals are necessary in order to maintain the range. Thus preferred sizes, with no disqualifying sizes, are stated. Also, disqualifying sizes are unnecessary as agility and working efficiency rely more on sound structure than size.
You'll notice NO size range in their standard.
Historically, this breed has had a huge size range. Some breeders prefered the smaller "handier" size and bred for that vs some of the larger ones. This is pretty typical of many breeds - Shelties come in all sizes and each litter might have one that goes out side the size range on both ends no matter if they are very well bred or not.
The Standard Aussie club was having a problem with the NAME mini Aussie so recently the Mini Aussie club had a vote on a new name to distinguish them from the Standard Aussie in order for them to get AKC recognition.
The new name will be "Miniature American Shepherd" and it will be actually MORE correct than Mini Aussie as the standard Aussie did not come from Australia but was developed right here in the USA, I have no idea what they were thinking with Aussie in the name to begin with
Soooo moving forward, the Mini American Shepherd is working towards AKC recognition with their new name so as not to "offend" the Australian Shepherd Club. This breed being developed from the "smaller" Aussies and this is not unheard of...Poodles come in 3 sizes as do schnauzers...all being developed from one breed.
As with ANY breed there will be good breeders and not so good breeders. What little contact I've had with the Mini breeders, they seem to be really striving for the "best of the best" to develop their breed. BUT, I tend to really do my research on any breed and the breeders to find a "good one".
I for one will be looking at how they develop into an AKC breed as MY GOAL is to find a suitable smaller dog but not too small to compete in companion events; Rally/Obedience and Tracking.
I've only heard of them recently....my daughter loves Australian shepherds...
they seem to be beautiful dogs.
That said, between my english bulldog and her boston terrier mix I think we have our hands full at this point (must stay strong!!!)
i feel like i own a work of art. she is gorgeous.
i have heard that the mini's are basically a product of breeding the runts. they seem to have enough of a following though that i would expect there to be breeders who ensure quality dogs.
I think Australian Shepherds are one of the best looking dog breeds. There is something "icky" about a mini version of one. They were meant to be the size they are, if you want a smaller dog, get a smaller dog. I know breeding and mixing and matching has got us all the breeds we have today. But essentially shrinking a breed is irresponsible to me.
Plus, compared to the more popular Labs and Goldens, Aussies are relatively small as it is.
Where do you think Miniature poodles and Schnauzers came from? Yes, sometimes breeds do down-size and for the better. I have been around a lot of Mini Aussies and love them. They are a working breed, same as a Border Collie, so do have energy for a job. But they are obedient and smart and loyal as well.
I've only seen a few of these one beautiful but with an unstable very shy skittish temperment, and the rest being extremely poorly bred looking...mutant like, crazy hyper, with bad skin.
Sorry, I love Aussies but wouldn't feel comfortable recommending these little dogs to anyone from the examples I have seen.
i have heard that the mini's are basically a product of breeding the runts. they seem to have enough of a following though that i would expect there to be breeders who ensure quality dogs.
Oh dear...you DO own a work of art! How beautiful!
There's one in my agility class - she's a rescue. She is a wonderfully social and intelligent little dog - a real joy to be around. But she has some health problems, including highly sensitive ribs that make it difficult to pick her up.
My problems are the same as there would be with any "breed" that was quickly developed by breeding for a very specific physical quality. I think breed crosses actually make sense if you are taking the absolute best of each litter to create the next generation. But when you're breeding for size or color or other attributes, you tend to overlook the flaws that you might also be introducing.
In particular with mini Aussies, I think people may be attracted to their size without understanding the intelligence and energy that comes with it.
I've liked the ones I've met so far, but I probably wouldn't ever seek out one from a breeder.
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