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Old 09-22-2013, 10:10 AM
 
Location: Northern California
970 posts, read 1,832,446 times
Reputation: 1390

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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Help Desk View Post
Wife feeds the kibble, it's sweet potato and salmon.

Help me with the raw meat thing. What should I add? I currently add coconut oil, grass fed butter, cod liver oil, oregano oil, iodine and Concentrace minerals.

They also like blackberries, cherry tomatoes and a few other veggies.
Of of curiosity, why are you adding so much oil to the food? I wouldn't add the cod liver oil at all since it is high in vitamin D (which is already in dog food). Too much vitamin D can cause health issues.

Also, why the iodine? Commercial pet food has iodine in it. I can see adding it to a raw diet but it seems unnecessary if you already feed kibble unless your dog has a pre-existing problem.
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Old 09-22-2013, 01:21 PM
 
10,604 posts, read 14,214,683 times
Reputation: 17203
Here ya go

Questions about raw diet? Anyone do this?
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Old 09-23-2013, 06:55 AM
 
Location: Mountains of middle TN
5,244 posts, read 14,031,515 times
Reputation: 6063
Totally agree with the satin balls recipe. We used it for a Walker that we pulled from a shelter that was due to have puppies any second. Once she whelped she was sickeningly skinny. I know most dogs are, but this was much worse than normal. My foster put her on the satin balls recipe and she gained that weight back so fast, even though she was nursing 11 puppies!

Prior to satin balls, I used the Natural Balance rolls. I'd dice them up and add to a mix of dry and canned food. The dogs all seemed to love it and they gained weight really quick.
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Old 09-23-2013, 09:31 AM
 
Location: The Help Desk
255 posts, read 544,530 times
Reputation: 291
Quote:
Originally Posted by passwithoutatrace View Post
1) Of of curiosity, why are you adding so much oil to the food? I wouldn't add the cod liver oil at all since it is high in vitamin D (which is already in dog food). Too much vitamin D can cause health issues.

2) Also, why the iodine? Commercial pet food has iodine in it. I can see adding it to a raw diet but it seems unnecessary if you already feed kibble unless your dog has a pre-existing problem.
As I had said, 75% of my dogs food is raw, but as to your questions;

1) The 'D50' for vitamin D is well over 3 million units (3,563,000) which isn't even available if I gave them the whole bottle of Cod liver oil in one meal.

They get around one tablespoon of each oil, which is far from excessive at any stretch. Countering an excess of omega-6, which all commercial dog foods are out of balance on, is my goal.

2) Iodine, if you've ever priced it, is hideously expensive and not plentiful enough anywhere without supplementation. Iodine helps displace bromine, fluorine, chlorine and other toxic halogens, not to mention radioactive iodine 131, from accumulating. Again, their iodine dosage is fairly low compared to what might be necessary to create a 92% passing in their urine, which would be considered an acceptable dosage.
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Old 09-24-2013, 07:03 AM
 
10,604 posts, read 14,214,683 times
Reputation: 17203
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Help Desk View Post

As I had said, 75% of my dogs food is raw, but as to your questions;

1) The 'D50' for vitamin D is well over 3 million units (3,563,000) which isn't even available if I gave them the whole bottle of Cod liver oil in one meal.

They get around one tablespoon of each oil, which is far from excessive at any stretch. Countering an excess of omega-6, which all commercial dog foods are out of balance on, is my goal.

2) Iodine, if you've ever priced it, is hideously expensive and not plentiful enough anywhere without supplementation. Iodine helps displace bromine, fluorine, chlorine and other toxic halogens, not to mention radioactive iodine 131, from accumulating. Again, their iodine dosage is fairly low compared to what might be necessary to create a 92% passing in their urine, which would be considered an acceptable dosage.
No, you actually never said 75% of your dogs food is raw. You said you put weight on a malnourished dog with raw meat once. Even in THIS post you say you're trying to counter things in commercial food.

Quote:
Dogs don't need grain, nor do they need meat cooked. Who cooks for wolves?

My rescue smartly gained ten pounds eating raw hamburger and raw turkey.
And you said your wife feeds kibble. We logically assume you are talking about the SAME DOG.

Quote:
Wife feeds the kibble, it's sweet potato and salmon.

Help me with the raw meat thing. What should I add? I currently add coconut oil, grass fed butter, cod liver oil, oregano oil, iodine and Concentrace minerals.

They also like blackberries, cherry tomatoes and a few other veggies.
You should not be randomly supplementing with all this stuff, especially a dog eating kibble. How are you doing a guaranteed analysis when even the dog food states "minimum" not exact levels? Even Dr Jean Dodds, the nationally recognized expert DVM in thyroid and epilepsy says we shouldn't even supplement kibble with KELP because of the iodine. Isn't there also Iodine in the Concentrace minerals and you're give MORE??

You realize dog have lots of thyroid problems anyway, right?

This is hilarious though, considering all the people bashing VETS for not selling and promoting ALL TYPES OF DOG FOOD and sticking to just HILLS, a stable predictable brand. Let alone all the things people randomly throw on the plate. Like they have all day long to spend analyzing labels of hundreds of cans and bags of food etc.

Last edited by runswithscissors; 09-24-2013 at 07:36 AM..
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Old 09-24-2013, 10:42 AM
 
380 posts, read 592,349 times
Reputation: 755
Quote:
This is hilarious though, considering all the people bashing VETS for not selling and promoting ALL TYPES OF DOG FOOD and sticking to just HILLS, a stable predictable brand. Let alone all the things people randomly throw on the plate. Like they have all day long to spend analyzing labels of hundreds of cans and bags of food etc.
Since you know it all, and spend so much time shouting people down on here with your provincial, condescending, biased beliefs; bragging about how much your clients' condos cost, why don't you explain how it is not a conflict of interest that *a percentage of* Vets are selling ANY mainstream commercial pet food when they won't even acknowledge that the species they examine each day are carnivores?

Just where is the "Medicine" in these ingredients, which would benefit a facultative carnivore in ANY way, and/or justify a "prescription" along with the high price?

Whole Grain Corn, Powdered Cellulose, Corn Gluten Meal, Chicken Liver Flavor, Chicken By-Product Meal, Soybean Mill Run, Chicken, Dried Beet Pulp, Soybean Oil, Lactic Acid, Caramel (color), Calcium Sulfate, Potassium Chloride, Flaxseed, L-Lysine, Choline Chloride, vitamins
w/d Canine Low Fat-Glucose Management-Gastrointestinal with Chicken - Dry

Do you even know what a carnivore is? Apparently not.

Why don't you explain how either a facultative or a strict (obligate) carnivore is supposed to chew this stuff, let alone derive any nutritional (let alone medicinal) benefits? Do you have ANY idea how their teeth are shpaed? That they have No flat molars to grind?
Or that their jaws cannot move sideways like ours can?
Why don't you try swallowing a Capt'n Crunch one day without grinding it up with your molars, OR moving your jaws sideways?

NOTE: NO meat, when this is "prescribed" for a strict (obligate) carnivore!
Corn Gluten Meal, Pork Fat, Whole Grain Corn, Soybean Mill Run, Dried Egg Product, L-Lysine, Chicken Liver Flavor, Potassium Citrate, Lactic Acid, Dicalcium Phosphate, vitamins (L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), Vitamin E Supplement, Niacin Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate, Vitamin A Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Su
y/d

Suggest you educate yourself and at least take the whole story ( Incestuous Pet Food Regulation Allows Consumers to Feed their Pets Ring Dings and Krispy Kremes ) into consideration before speaking as though you wrote the book on pet care, just because you sold products while taking the word of the reps as Gospel and, as you repeatedly remind people, service rich clients.

I encourage pet owners to look to Veterinarians such as AHVMA Home Page ; Dr. Elizabeth Hodgkins -- who testified before the Senate in 2007 Elizabeth Hodgkins, DVM - Expert Opinion on Pet Food Industry -- ; Dr. Martin Goldstein Dr. Martin Goldstein | Dr. Marty, America , and Vets like them who care more about animal health than making corporate quotas & goals. AHVMA Home Page
Another resource people may wish to look into: Sample Diets for Dogs and Cats
People are wising up, thanks to Veterinary professionals such as this one, speaking out on behalf of their patients:
How Do Vets Recommend Pet Food? (Part 1: Industry) | petMD

How Do Vets Recommend Pet Food? (Part 2: Education) | petMD

How do vets recommend pet food? (Part 3: In Practice) | petMD
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Old 09-24-2013, 10:45 AM
 
11,270 posts, read 8,443,069 times
Reputation: 20477
Total health check? h/w neg? If he's young don't sweat it. Get some probiotics in him to help boost his digestive system?
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Old 09-24-2013, 07:24 PM
 
Location: North Western NJ
6,591 posts, read 20,828,510 times
Reputation: 9586
personaly op id pick 1 or the other...raw OR kibble, the 2 don't mesh well nyway with ifferent digestion rates and theres abtsolutly no need for kibble if feeding a balanced prey model raw, and if full time raw is too much work and pre-packaged raw is too expensive go with a GOOD kibble and stop randomly throwing oil, mixed mineral poders and such in there...if your feding a GOOD food, you don't need all the extra oils and junk, if your feeding prey model raw they get all the oil chondrotitin minerals and supliments form the veriety of meat bone and ORGANS...

too much iodine causes SERIOUS health issues...

and theres absolutely no need to be adding multiple teaspoons of ANY fats to any diet...if your feeding primarily raw they will be getting plenty of fats and good healthy omga 3's fomr the natural fat and skins of the meat and should be fed fish a couple times a week...

Sounds like your making a mountain out of a mole hill and if the dogs still underweight its NOT WORKING...

1: pick 1 and stick with it, raw or kibble...stop playing "whats on the menu today" your ust making it harder of rhis body to adjust an absorb nutrients correctly
2: STOP adding allthat STUFF...if you feel the ned to add, a tablespoon of a good oil (preferably wild salmon) and a teaspoon of kelp powder or a single multi-vit is ALL you need
3: for the weight issue...upp feeding amounts and/or frequency, or add satin balls...simple.
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Old 09-24-2013, 07:55 PM
 
10,604 posts, read 14,214,683 times
Reputation: 17203
Quote:
Originally Posted by HOF4256 View Post
Since you know it all, and spend so much time shouting people down on here with your provincial, condescending, biased beliefs; bragging about how much your clients' condos cost, why don't you explain how it is not a conflict of interest that *a percentage of* Vets are selling ANY mainstream commercial pet food when they won't even acknowledge that the species they examine each day are carnivores?

Just where is the "Medicine" in these ingredients, which would benefit a facultative carnivore in ANY way, and/or justify a "prescription" along with the high price?

Whole Grain Corn, Powdered Cellulose, Corn Gluten Meal, Chicken Liver Flavor, Chicken By-Product Meal, Soybean Mill Run, Chicken, Dried Beet Pulp, Soybean Oil, Lactic Acid, Caramel (color), Calcium Sulfate, Potassium Chloride, Flaxseed, L-Lysine, Choline Chloride, vitamins
w/d Canine Low Fat-Glucose Management-Gastrointestinal with Chicken - Dry

Do you even know what a carnivore is? Apparently not.

Why don't you explain how either a facultative or a strict (obligate) carnivore is supposed to chew this stuff, let alone derive any nutritional (let alone medicinal) benefits? Do you have ANY idea how their teeth are shpaed? That they have No flat molars to grind?
Or that their jaws cannot move sideways like ours can?
Why don't you try swallowing a Capt'n Crunch one day without grinding it up with your molars, OR moving your jaws sideways?

NOTE: NO meat, when this is "prescribed" for a strict (obligate) carnivore!
Corn Gluten Meal, Pork Fat, Whole Grain Corn, Soybean Mill Run, Dried Egg Product, L-Lysine, Chicken Liver Flavor, Potassium Citrate, Lactic Acid, Dicalcium Phosphate, vitamins (L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), Vitamin E Supplement, Niacin Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate, Vitamin A Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Su
y/d

Suggest you educate yourself and at least take the whole story ( Incestuous Pet Food Regulation Allows Consumers to Feed their Pets Ring Dings and Krispy Kremes ) into consideration before speaking as though you wrote the book on pet care, just because you sold products while taking the word of the reps as Gospel and, as you repeatedly remind people, service rich clients.

I encourage pet owners to look to Veterinarians such as AHVMA Home Page ; Dr. Elizabeth Hodgkins -- who testified before the Senate in 2007 Elizabeth Hodgkins, DVM - Expert Opinion on Pet Food Industry -- ; Dr. Martin Goldstein Dr. Martin Goldstein | Dr. Marty, America , and Vets like them who care more about animal health than making corporate quotas & goals. AHVMA Home Page
Another resource people may wish to look into: Sample Diets for Dogs and Cats
People are wising up, thanks to Veterinary professionals such as this one, speaking out on behalf of their patients:
How Do Vets Recommend Pet Food? (Part 1: Industry) | petMD

How Do Vets Recommend Pet Food? (Part 2: Education) | petMD

How do vets recommend pet food? (Part 3: In Practice) | petMD

LOL "shouting people down"?

You may want to read the post:

Quote:
Wife feeds the kibble, it's sweet potato and salmon.

Help me with the raw meat thing. What should I add?
I currently add coconut oil, grass fed butter, cod liver oil, oregano oil, iodine and Concentrace minerals.

They also like blackberries, cherry tomatoes and a few other veggies.
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Old 09-25-2013, 11:03 AM
 
Location: On the corner of Grey Street
6,081 posts, read 8,376,654 times
Reputation: 11570
Well. Glad my question asking about my skinny rescue dog turned into a big debate...
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