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Old 09-24-2014, 06:33 AM
 
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BTW, I just finished an overnight with three Chihuahuas with one who constantly tries to bite your feet and non stop bark. Very insecure, fearful. The pack leader is constantly trying to get her to settle. Pack leader meaning the other CHI NOT THE HUMANS!! LOL

Instead of wasting my mental energy sparring with her I just carried a baby gate barrier all night and morning. LOL

And YEP, the OWNER causes it all by doing nothing but soft energy high voice "consoling", petting , clinging to her on her lap and other ways of NURTURING that unstable fear.

Sweet lady. Not a dog rehabilitator. LOL.

The dog is supposedly afraid of thunder and lightening so during my second meet and greet to familiarize myself with the dogs with the people there yesterday before leaving....I sat STILL on the bed in FRONT of the dog who was up by the headboard. Not talking not moving. To let her feel my CALM RELAXED TRUSTWORTHY energy.

The lady kept INTERFERING "GOOD GIRL, OH IT"S OK, OH SHE"S SCARED blah blah blah".!!!!!!!!!!!!

Leaning over me...etc.

I go "HEY this is OUR bonding time she's perfectly FINE and she's ignoring the storm".

HER: "NO, she is terrified of rain and she IS BEING A GOOD GIRL, you need to cover her with pillows when she's like this".

WTH. I just silently FACEPALM. And smile with my poker face. hahaha

Not only was the dog not scared or shaking; she was sniffing towards my pocket for a treat where I had placed some that the OWNER insisted I "give"earlier. Stressed dogs never eat.

Last edited by runswithscissors; 09-24-2014 at 06:59 AM..
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Old 09-24-2014, 06:41 AM
 
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OH and another sign that the dog is serious is a CLOSED MOUTH and staring.

I NEVER EVER acknowledge a dog who is sitting/standing and staring at me with a tight mouth. You want a relaxed slightly open mouth. NOT panting; that's excitement. YAWNING is releasing tension. Tailwagging, too.

If my meet and greet is a dog with that tight mouth and staring I can be pretty sure it's a biter and just go through the motions having the owner put the dog on a leash next to them.

I'm not there to rehab them I'm there to WALK and FEED haha. And the times I've offered to try and work with them in advance of needing me the owners don't go along with it so I end the meet and greet then decline the job.
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Old 09-24-2014, 06:55 AM
 
Location: East Millcreek
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Terrific info and insights, thanks for putting the time into that. I'm going to watch him more carefully. You raise a couple points of great interest. one major point worth elaborating on

Quote:
Anyway, your energy holding that collar is going down to him. Of that I am SURE. It's why people have problems on walks when they see a human or another dog being walked and they inadvertently tense up and the dog feels it and reacts in kind.

If I wanted to learn about your dog I would ask you to open the door and do nothing and let HIM do his thing.

I would just stand there doing nothing for a minute and expect him to sniff me and either turn and walk away OR in some cases especially like a LAB start nosing me and intruding on my personal space. I don't speak, give eye contact or touch them.
The reason we hold the collar is for the benefit of the visitor. We tell them that he's fine, just wants to sniff, so we're letting him go. Then he goes and sniffs. Just letting him out (which has certainly happened) scares the bejessus out of most people just from his appearance. If he's allowed free he also does exactly he does exactly as you describe. He might nose you a little, too, never thought about the meaning of that.

Quote:
IF he gets between you and the guest AFTER THE GREETING...like when you say, walk into the kitchen, that's a SIGNAL he feels he has to protect you. CIRCLING the guest is BAD. It doesn't sound like your dog does either of these things. BUT maybe WATCH.

Does he sit between you and the guest in the living room? For example. If so, I would NOT approach you.
We joke that he has mastered prepositions - in, out, on, off and BETWEEN. He has an uncanny knack for finding the exact place in the house or room that is most "between" whoever is there. Doesn't matter if it's family or strangers. It's like he positions himself for maximum strategic advantage. If people move around he'll reposition himself. If people are walking around, in or out, he tries hard to be in FRONT. He's not aggressive about it, just big and strong and he pushes (or maybe that actually IS aggressive?). If we're hiking and he's off-leash and somebody else comes along he'll always want to rush ahead to give them the sniff. Fortunately he's well trained and disciplined enough to take direction. He'll heed a command to stay and stops dead even if he sees a deer (not 100%, i admit, but 85% of the time).
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Old 09-24-2014, 07:08 AM
 
10,604 posts, read 14,126,728 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kletter1mann View Post
Terrific info and insights, thanks for putting the time into that. I'm going to watch him more carefully. You raise a couple points of great interest. one major point worth elaborating on

The reason we hold the collar is for the benefit of the visitor. We tell them that he's fine, just wants to sniff, so we're letting him go. Then he goes and sniffs. Just letting him out (which has certainly happened) scares the bejessus out of most people just from his appearance. If he's allowed free he also does exactly he does exactly as you describe. He might nose you a little, too, never thought about the meaning of that.

We joke that he has mastered prepositions - in, out, on, off and BETWEEN. He has an uncanny knack for finding the exact place in the house or room that is most "between" whoever is there. Doesn't matter if it's family or strangers. It's like he positions himself for maximum strategic advantage. If people move around he'll reposition himself. If people are walking around, in or out, he tries hard to be in FRONT. He's not aggressive about it, just big and strong and he pushes (or maybe that actually IS aggressive?). If we're hiking and he's off-leash and somebody else comes along he'll always want to rush ahead to give them the sniff. Fortunately he's well trained and disciplined enough to take direction. He'll heed a command to stay and stops dead even if he sees a deer (not 100%, i admit, but 85% of the time).
PERFECT!

IMO he's a classic GSD. That's why I was able to call it.

OF COURSE he is positioning himself for maximum advantage in case of EMERGENCY LOL.

He is also waiting for someone to drop the car keys or leave the checkbook out and he can be perfectly independent!

Pushing is dominance. Impolite. He's just good at it. SUBTLE.

It also depends on the energy of the visitor; he will take advantage and and react if they are weak energy.

Not sure how he'd be with me. Also depends on how YOU are. Ideally, he'd ignore me and go sit somewhere. AFTER the first sniff or two.

I believe in approaching HIS home respectfully just like another dog would. BUT THEN my energy says "I'm here now; go chill out".

-------------------------------------------------------
My BF's father was dog sitting and all 4 dogs got in the yard and completely ignored everything he "requested". THREE guys were there trying to finesse them to come back inside including one guy holding a bone in his mouth laying on the grass. (WTH).

They called me because they were desperate AND embarrassed.

I was laughing my BUTT off. Four 65 year old "tough" Italian guys and the dogs won every single time and were laughing at the humans.They didn't know you address yourself to the LEADER and the others will follow. All I had to do was direct the leader and BAM. But I had to BE the strong energy not beg.

BTW I kept adding to my post so re-read it. ^^^

YOUR DOG knows EXACTLY what he's doing. And he will do EXACTLY as you request it sounds like to ME.

Just tell him to WAIT when you let people IN. DONE.

Do whatever you want with the stealthy stalking. Just make sure he gets all that exercise all the time so he doesn't make up "jobs" that we don't need him to INVENT! LOL (neurotic jobs). HE IS DOING THAT NOW halfway.

Time to let him give it up a little IMO.

THANKS for the fun conversation!

ETA: You shouldn't have to hold his collar since he is so well trained in OUTSIDE. He is being territorial and thinking it's HIS house first. I would probably stop that if it were me and give him a NEW JOB TO LEARN. POLITE CONCIERGE NOT SECURITY GUARD.

Last edited by runswithscissors; 09-24-2014 at 07:19 AM..
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Old 09-24-2014, 07:26 AM
 
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BTW you could probably stop that stealthy stalking simply by putting YOURSELF between him and the guests and directing him to go chill. Or even saying nothing.

THAT'S WHAT A PACK LEADER DOG WOULD BE DOING.

And with another dog it could be a fight. A fight for pack leader position.

Right now you're number two hahaha.

OH and he is supposed to SNIFF BRIEFLY then GTFO . LOL

NOT make a career of it.

CONTINUING to sniff alot IS dominance, again. In the dog world, whoever is the RECIPIENT of butt sniffing first is the WEAKER ONE.

When you want to control a meeting between two dogs you always let the weaker one sniff the butt of the stronger one. It's subliminal. And you NEVER introduce fact to face only face to butt.
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Old 09-24-2014, 09:14 AM
 
Location: East Millcreek
2,397 posts, read 5,218,430 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runswithscissors View Post
PERFECT!

IMO he's a classic GSD. That's why I was able to call it.

<<<snip>>

YOUR DOG knows EXACTLY what he's doing. And he will do EXACTLY as you request it sounds like to ME.

Just tell him to WAIT when you let people IN. DONE.

Do whatever you want with the stealthy stalking. Just make sure he gets all that exercise all the time so he doesn't make up "jobs" that we don't need him to INVENT! LOL (neurotic jobs). HE IS DOING THAT NOW halfway.

Time to let him give it up a little IMO.

THANKS for the fun conversation!

ETA: You shouldn't have to hold his collar since he is so well trained in OUTSIDE. He is being territorial and thinking it's HIS house first. I would probably stop that if it were me and give him a NEW JOB TO LEARN. POLITE CONCIERGE NOT SECURITY GUARD.
We'll try this. He learns amazingly fast and LOVES to learn new jobs. You're sure right about the job thing. GSD's with clear jobs are great. We've had several and all were well trained despite very different personalities. The trouble starts when they're left to make up their own jobs (weak or inexperienced owners). Thanks for the conversation!
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Old 09-24-2014, 12:20 PM
 
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That'll be fun. It WILL be a test of wills...it's an exercise in mental control. And self discipline. Training is easier. Go find something and do whatever...

I don't know too many serious type GSDs who will simply fetch a ball over and over again for no reason.

They'd prefer to see if they can trick you into going in the pen instead of them I'm pretty sure if they could close the latch with us in there they would.

So this'll be interesting. Remember just stay calm and assertive and follow through. Talking makes them more excited.

He gets released when he SUBMITS meaning gets out of the high energy zone into the "oh, ok I'll wait here if you insist" zone. It might take a minute. Just because he agreed to sit there doesn't mean you were successful IF HE'S STILL ALL WRIGGLEY. So don't quit too soon.

And remember to tell the guests to simply walk in, shake hands with you say hello and IGNORE HIM COMPLETELY.

I'd LOVE to see them be able to walk right by and he follows YOU behind them until he's invited to socialize. It's an exercise. It'll tire him out and they can give him a payoff ...whatever that might be. His favorite toy or something. IF he has one. Lots of them couldn't be bothered! OH or the BELLY RUB. I forgot you said he likes that. So THAT can be the reward for calming down at the door.

Same thing leaving. NO barking or intercepting the visitor at the door hahaha.

Have fun. Post back if anything interesting happens. Maybe use a well known family member NOT the MAILMAN LOL
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Old 09-24-2014, 02:07 PM
 
Location: East Millcreek
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Yes, will post back. This is doable.

When he was a pup we'd put his food bowl on the floor and taught him to sit still and "stay" before he could eat. Then we'd give the signal that it was OK to start eating. This certainly taught him something about self discipline. We still do it from time to time. He totally gets the idea of having to sit quietly when there's something he wants to do.
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