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Old 01-10-2015, 08:45 AM
 
5 posts, read 6,668 times
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I've recently adopted a puppy from the animal shelter. I have had the puppy for 8 days. When my family went to the shelter the puppy was located in a kennel (5x10?) alone. It was not barking, came to the front of the kennel and sat quietly and then allowed us to pet it. My daughter ultimately choose that puppy out of all the others. The dog has had it's 1st set of shots and been dewormed. It is a large breed puppy- German Shepherd and Collie? and he weights 10 pounds. He is very large already. He is 10 Weeks old.

Ok, I can NOT get this puppy to crate train. During the day the puppy goes out like every 20 minutes(when he is awake), all day long. He is still young so he us up for 30-40 minutes and then sleeps for an hour or two. He started going to the door to go out on day 2, but you have to be RIGHT there to take it out, but he has the general idea. He is given ample time to potty and knows the "done" command. He will sit when he is done and ready to go back inside. At night I have an extremely structured schedule that the puppy attends. At 8pm all the food and water are taken up and the puppy is continually taken out. At 11pm it is bed time. I have been sleeping on the couch to crate train, so EVERY night I take the puppy out to potty, then it goes directly into the crate. All lights except a night lite are off, T.V is off and all sound off. I sleep a hands space away. If dog whines or barks I issue the "Shhhhhh" command, or if barking a lot the "No" command. Once quiet I quietly give a "good". I do not speak to the puppy otherwise. I have used this same method for 15 years. I usually have a dog or puppy "broke" by day 3. (Broke being not up more than 2X a night) But this puppy will not break. It is up every hour and whines like it is being beaten. It HATES the crate, It will jump and bang and claw and try to chew at the crate. (Plastic airline type crate)

I am at my witts end. I've had almost no sleep in a week. I am not a pro. dog trainer, but I do have a lot of experience with dogs. I don't know what to do! Anyone have an alternative idea? I am a stay at home mother, so I devote insane amounts of time with the dog, it is NEVER alone and I watch It like a hawk. I am trying to train it in the most humane and effective way. But I am seeing that this is NOT working. Any ideas? I can't let the dog roam loose and potty in the house, and I don't have a room I can lock it into for the night that I think it won't chew up or destroy.

I have a German Shepherd and he is free range. He became so when he was completely housebroke and dependable. (about 6 months) He was trained to free roam in the same way, except instead of a crate he was left on leash at night with me on couch, then me on couch with no leash, then just him roaming as he wished. It was about a 4 day process. He's rarely had an accident. I can't do this with the new puppy yet as it is NOT housebroken yet, and I can not house them together because my older dog does not like to share his crate space(when crated) and will cause a fight that the puppy is going to lose.

I am open to ideas on how to resolve this so we can both get some sleep. Thanks.
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Old 01-10-2015, 09:10 AM
 
Location: Houston, TX
14,559 posts, read 8,386,623 times
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I have had Great Danes 22 years. Being a giant breed, I know all about training huge dogs to use the potty outside. Large and giant dogs are usually slower to potty train than small dogs. I used to be addicted to the crate training method for potty training, but have since discovered it may not always be the right one to use. So when I have a new Dane puppy (my younger deaf Dane is 2), I only crate them at night to help them sleep. During the day, I just put them outside frequently: after they eat, after they wake up from naps, and frequently throughout the day. Also, remember that puppies will have potty accidents, no ifs, ands, or buts. Your puppy is just 10 weeks old. He is still really young, so you shouldn't expect too much from him yet. I didn't expect my puppies to be reliably potty trained until they were 7-8 months old at least, and I never used harsh punishment. When they had an accident, if I caught them in the act, I would just tell them no. If I didn't catch them, I just cleaned it up. The accidents gradually decreased in frequency as they learn to control their bladder and bowels better. Too much crating isn't good for them because that can feel like punishment in itself. I hope this helps.
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Old 01-10-2015, 09:17 AM
 
Location: Paradise
2,456 posts, read 1,991,356 times
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I have had two dogs that simply would not crate train. They would work themselves up so much that it really bordered on cruelty. Once I was sure they were reasonably housebroken, I didn't put them in a crate anymore.

Give your pup a little more time. Try the leash trick you mentioned and I think it will work out better for you both.
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Old 01-10-2015, 03:13 PM
 
1,638 posts, read 2,591,559 times
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Do you feed meals in the crate? Special treats and toys given in there? Your dog has to learn to "love" the crate, as a place where good things happen.

I'm actually encountering issues with my rescue dog, 8 months old now. She is reasonably housebroken, I'm considering just testing her with "run of the house". She settles more quickly out of the crate than she does in it when I leave. Some dogs just don't take to it.

Have you asked your vet for advice?
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Old 01-10-2015, 03:23 PM
 
5 posts, read 6,668 times
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I don't feed in the crate, but yes to special treats only in crate. The puppy is ONLY crate trained at night, and ONLY during the day if I have to go to the store. I am not looking for a perfectly housetrained dog, just one that will go to crate without a fight, and sleep for a reasonable period of time, like 3 or 4 hours at a span at this age I think would be reasonable.
The dog is NEVER punished for accidents, I simply say "NO" sternly and take the puppy directly outside and then say "potty", same as if no accident had occurred.
I am pretty good with dogs and training but this one has me stumped. I can't let him free roam until he is housebroken so he must crate.......
Never had this reaction in such a young dog because all my other dogs love their crates (although we don't use them with the older dog as he is already housebroken)
IDK, I am trying to give him more time as I think he will eventually come around but it is a slow go. lol
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Old 01-10-2015, 03:55 PM
 
Location: Santa Barbara CA
4,704 posts, read 10,124,181 times
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When I got Dash he was 1 yrs old and if I put him in the plastic crate he would panic. I tried feeding him and giving him treats in it which helped some but the first hour or so in a crate at night he would be anxious and panting, drooling. He would eventually settle down but the fact he was so anxious was a problem and unlike Jazz who would run and get in her crate at night or anytime she felt anxious as it was her safe place, I had to bribe Dash with food. I also had a wire crate that we took to agility so I got that out and he was fine in it. Some dogs like the wire crates more then a plastic crate. Dash got to the point he would go to the wire crate go in and lay down if I told him to go to his crate. Dazzle also prefers the wire to a plastic one but he is also fine in the cloth one I got to take to agility ( it weighs a lot less then the wire crate so is easier to carry any distance).
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Old 01-11-2015, 08:55 AM
 
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX
1,980 posts, read 6,016,531 times
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IMO it sounds like you're doing a great job so far but just have one of those puppies that needs a little more attention than most. When we house train our dogs as puppies we use the same methods and I'll actually lay next to the very large pen at night as it calms them down somewhat since they can see me and reach out and touch me.

Having said that though I know about the sleepless nights. Have you spoken to your Vet about a very light sedative you can give them to at least calm them down some during the training period, and to be used only at night to help with this? With our latest Pups during their neutering recovery we needed something to keep them calm since they are normally VERY active! With neutering our Pups experienced more desire during the recovery period to go out and of course that increased nightly trips outside. Our Vet provided a very low dose of acepromazine and it worked well. Once their neutering recovery was over (one had an extended recovery due to complications in surgery) we stopped giving them the acepromazine and went back to regular training.

Naturally you will need to have extra padding, pillows, etc., on hand since some small leakage might occur. During that period I was doing Puppy Laundry daily and swapping out their bedding and pillow covers regularly.

One thing for those reading. We don't crate our dogs since they are family members. However using a large wire pen during house training works real well! It has yet to take us more than a couple of weeks to get them house trained using this method. Our new Pups only took 10 days with this method. They are only penned at night and when in the house and we can not watch them. Obviously during the day they are out in their 1/2 acre fenced back yard digging holes and pruning trees.

Last edited by escanlan; 01-11-2015 at 09:36 AM..
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Old 01-11-2015, 09:02 AM
 
460 posts, read 691,103 times
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You're not going to like my answer because it probably goes against everything proper, but when my dog was a puppy, I just put him in the bed with me. He snuggled between us and slept like a baby. I'm not suggesting it, I'm just confessing what I did.
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Old 01-11-2015, 09:19 AM
 
Location: Wake County, NC
352 posts, read 572,194 times
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This is great advice as I'll be welcoming a puppy home in March. I have raised dogs all my life, but I don't remember raising the two dachshunds as I was only 5 and not responsible for their training at the time. Once I was out on my own, the youngest was only a 6 month old shepherd mix and didn't do much complaining at night. My second one was an 8 months old Siberian Husky who also was a quiet dog (except on the rare occasion she'd let out a bark which would shake the house). This will be my first puppy. We are getting a collie. ...This will also be my first collie. I'm super excited about it, but I'm nervous since this is also my first puppy to raise with a family of 6 year old twin boys and I haven't had a dog in the house since about 3 years ago.
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Old 01-11-2015, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX
1,980 posts, read 6,016,531 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepman91919 View Post
You're not going to like my answer because it probably goes against everything proper, but when my dog was a puppy, I just put him in the bed with me. He snuggled between us and slept like a baby. I'm not suggesting it, I'm just confessing what I did.
LOL LOL!

With our last three they were Lab, Blue Heeler, Chow mix litter mates. My Wife and I did that when they were pups. We did not know how big they would get, but as Pups the three of them fit between us on a queen sized bed. It worked great for bonding with them but as they grew I wound up in the other room at night! LOL After a while though they preferred mostly to lay on their own pillows at night.
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