Active smart dog breed for city living - Border Collie, Toller, Aussie, Dalmatian, Pit Bull, Jack Russell? Help! (shepherd, labrador)

[lcfas]

What breeds would you recommend for an active 24 year old living in a very urban environment?

Here are qualities that are important:
- Can live with a cat and another dog
- Loves to be trained and would do agility and lots of tricks
- Not over 65 pounds or under 10-15
- Could run with me, longer than 6 mile runs and hikes
- Would prefer a dog in the herding or sporting groups but open to any suggestions
- Velcro dog, lives for attention. Doesn't need to love strangers, but not overly suspicious either
- Relatively healthy (so no GSDs or labs)
- Would swim in water
- Most importantly, could live happily in the city and all that comes with that - kids, dogs, trucks, trains, sounds, stores, all different kinds of people and stimulus, etc
- Not looking for a shelter dog. this time around i want a pup from health tested working parents

[TheKiwi]

I don't recoment Border Collies or Aussies if you're looking for a "velcro dog" because they aren't very cuddly usually. They'll actually squirm away from affection. Don't get me wrong, they love their family. But they'd rather watch over you than cuddle with you. This is common of herding dogs.

I'd recommend the following for you:

- Boxer (don't run them when it's too hot out, as they can overheat due to their smushed faces)
- Terriers: Jack Russell, Airedale, Wheaton, American Staffordshire Terrier

Here's how they stack up on your list:

- Can live with a cat and another dog - This will depend on the dog. Just depends on how you socialize the dog.
- Loves to be trained and would do agility and lots of tricks - All of the above that I recommended are smart dogs who will do tricks if you teach them right.
- Could run with me, longer than 6 mile runs and hikes - All of the above work for this.
- Would swim in water - Will depend on the dog, but the breeds above usually like water.
- Most importantly, could live happily in the city and all that comes with that - kids, dogs, trucks, trains, sounds, stores, all different kinds of people and stimulus, etc - This is why I also wouldn't recommend a herding dog. They instinctually look at things like children and other dogs as something to herd. The busy environment is better suited to a dog like a Boxer or Terriers who are usually very good dogs socially if raised right.

I think a Boxer would be perfect for you. They are lovers, good with other dogs and people, and very smart and friendly. They have great amounts of energy and also do well in apartment settings.

[greenie72]

Originally Posted by lcfas

- Relatively healthy (so no GSDs or labs)

- Not looking for a shelter dog. this time around i want a pup from health tested working parents

I think these two points cancel each other out, as long as you're really doing your homework on breeders and not getting one from a backyard breeder.

I have an 8 year old purebred English Labrador from a reputable breeder with papers going back generations. Certified healthy eyes, elbows, hips. All confirmed by x-ray since we got him, and he doesn't have a gray hair on him.

Besides them, what about Vizsla or Weimaraner? I don't know about their health but they are certainly energetic. Weims are described as velcro dogs.

[greenie72]

Also, I love Border Collies. They meet all those requirements.

[nomnom]

I live in an apartment and I would never recommend an Aussie not even a mini one. I did little bit of research on Aussies and it seemed like they would be okay in an apartment but as soon as I got one, I would never recommend one for apartment living mainly due to their barking and whining.

I also have a shepherd mix and I would not recommend any breeds that is all about the smell (i.e., hounds). It takes me 20 minutes to go around one block because I have to stop every so often so that my dog could sniff this and sniff that and follow the scent to here and there. I even tried to run with her when she was younger and she would just stop to smell.

For apartment living, older puppy - a puppy that is fully vaccinated - might be better. I am stuck in my apartment with my mini Aussie because she won't be fully vaccinated until 16 weeks.

[ansible90]

Originally Posted by nomnom

I live in an apartment and I would never recommend an Aussie not even a mini one. I did little bit of research on Aussies and it seemed like they would be okay in an apartment but as soon as I got one, I would never recommend one for apartment living mainly due to their barking and whining.

I also have a shepherd mix and I would not recommend any breeds that is all about the smell (i.e., hounds). It takes me 20 minutes to go around one block because I have to stop every so often so that my dog could sniff this and sniff that and follow the scent to here and there. I even tried to run with her when she was younger and she would just stop to smell.

For apartment living, older puppy - a puppy that is fully vaccinated - might be better. I am stuck in my apartment with my mini Aussie because she won't be fully vaccinated until 16 weeks.

I had a LhasaPoo who had to sniff everything on our walks. I wanted a nice brisk walk for exercise and found myself dawdling, waiting for the silly dog. Don't think there was a drop of hound in her. It was just her.

[hiero2]

In my experience, a LARGE part of you finding what you are looking for is going to be contingent on you taking the dogs for that run - like at least 5 days a week. That is going to be critical. And at least half of that run is going to have to be about letting the DOGS do their thing somehow. Not many dogs are going to be happy JUST tagging along for 6 miles.

IMO, you should reconsider labs, but I agree about GSD. All the collie types - Aus, border, English, Shelty, can do well in the circumstances you describe. If the exercise is guaranteed. But they might not, and it is more up to the individual dog than the breed, I think. I have known Aus and Shelty who do well w/o the exercise regimen, and do ok. And I've known other dogs who were terrors if they were w/o.

Shelter dogs. IMO, more important that you get them young, e.g. 4 mo., than worry about shelter vs purebred. Adult dogs (=>8 mos) are getting tied into routines, habits, expectations. Life templates are, for the most part, in place. You've still got some room to work with @ 8 mos, but the clock is ticking.

Not to say you can't work with dogs older than 8 mos. You can. I am right now. It is just more time-consuming, and a much slower process. And some things may take years to overcome.

The working collie types have the advantage, for you, of fitting your weight profile. And their abilities fit your stated needs. They pick up stuff pretty well.

I would suggest you read Jean Donaldson's "Culture Wars", and Suzanne Clothier's stuff (if you can find it), and Ian Dunbar. I think they may give you a slightly new perspective on what working with dogs is all about - and if you do get some gold nuggets from these trainers/authors - you may change what dog you decide to take into your life.

The routine you describe could be "heaven" on earth for a dog - if you understand what the dog is thinking, and what the dog needs.

Good luck!

[hiero2]

Originally Posted by nomnom

I live in an apartment and I would never recommend an Aussie not even a mini one. I did little bit of research on Aussies and it seemed like they would be okay in an apartment but as soon as I got one, I would never recommend one for apartment living mainly due to their barking and whining.

I also have a shepherd mix and I would not recommend any breeds that is all about the smell (i.e., hounds). It takes me 20 minutes to go around one block because I have to stop every so often so that my dog could sniff this and sniff that and follow the scent to here and there. I even tried to run with her when she was younger and she would just stop to smell.

For apartment living, older puppy - a puppy that is fully vaccinated - might be better. I am stuck in my apartment with my mini Aussie because she won't be fully vaccinated until 16 weeks.

I had to add a comment, because of the sniffy dogs. Hounds - basset, beagle, others - are BIG on smell, in a dog world where ALL the dogs are a 1,000 times bigger on smell than ANY human. For those dogs, smelling rules their world - only food will compete for interest. I have to laugh! "YEAH! They don't run with you because the smells are WAY more interesting!!!" I've had a couple very lovely hounds. Who would never be "good citizens", because their instinct just wasn't designed that way. But, they can be lovely, loving, and great pets, if you understand what they need, and work with it.

We lost a sniffy last spring. Her priorities were smelling, running, and eating. Oh, and barking. Everything else, including me/us, came in WAY down the list of priorities. When she didn't get enough running and smelling in her life, she was a BRAT. When she did, she was trainable, and a lovely dog. Everybody who met her thought she was cute, and she had a basically positive and vigorous attitude towards life. So, even being a brat, she brought smiles to the day! Her vigor carried her thru 14 good years.

2nd - I wanted to add that some of the herding collie types are high drive. Meaning they will have a high need to be doing. Not doing any particular thing - just DOing. Due to their instinct, of course, some things will be more likely - guarding and barking, prey drive and chasing cats, etc. If they get a little outlet for the things THEY think are important in life, all these things can be controlled by us, their humans.

[Threerun]

A basenji. But only if it wants to run with you, lol.

[Prosze]

I like the Vizsla suggestion. Very active, affectionate and they don't stink. A lot of breeds fit your criteria, though.