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Old 09-25-2016, 10:49 PM
 
Location: Sugarmill Woods , FL
6,235 posts, read 5,898,133 times
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Think about what is fair to the dog!
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Old 09-26-2016, 06:02 AM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
14,729 posts, read 10,622,245 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by froglipz View Post
Think about what is fair to the dog!
Chilling out in some guy's apartment while he works is a lot fairer than being stuck in a shelter or being euthanized.

I just had some idiot on here, who I hope was just trying to troll me, convey to me that they think it would be better for the dog to "stay in the shelter, where at least they will be loved by someone who understands their needs" than go to this person's definition of a less than perfect family. Their rationale is that "if they loved the dog they would pay for a dog walker at least once or twice a day." Are you freakin' kidding me?!?!?!? It's better to live in 24 hours a day in a cage or be put to death than lay around on a couch for 8-10 hours a day by yourself?!?!? I am very, very, very glad not too many dogs have their fate in the hands of such a "dog lover".

Sheesh. People who get so caught up in an agenda that they can't evaluate situations on a scale of positives and negatives drive me absolutely batty.
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Old 09-26-2016, 08:54 AM
 
4,022 posts, read 2,609,521 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by froglipz View Post
Think about what is fair to the dog!
Most people that have dogs work. I've worked full time and have happy well-adjusted dogs. My co-workers have had dogs and their dogs are happy and well adjusted. You just have to have the right set up or have someone come and take them out once during the day.

What is not fair for a dog is to crate it for 8 hours a day, every day. If your plan for a dog is to crate it every day while you're at work, you shouldn't have a dog.
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Old 09-26-2016, 09:00 AM
 
Location: SW Florida
10,287 posts, read 4,862,753 times
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I was lucky that I adopted an almost perfect Chihuahua 3 1/2 years ago. She was 8 years old when I got her and she learned to use pee pee pads as I lived in an upstairs condo. She got a 15 minute evening walk (she had a heart condition so she couldn't do long walks). However I was rarely out of my home for more than 6 hours at a time.


To the OP: a lot depends on what kind of dog you get. I would not recommend a puppy or a high energy breed if you will be gone most of the day. A small dog can be trained to use pee pee pads so it is not having to hold it all day long. And please take it for at minimum one walk a day so it can enjoy the smells, sights and sounds of being outside.
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Old 09-26-2016, 09:02 AM
 
Location: Southeast Idaho
4,659 posts, read 15,777,016 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowan123 View Post

What is not fair for a dog is to crate it for 8 hours a day, every day. If your plan for a dog is to crate it every day while you're at work, you shouldn't have a dog.
I work part time (5 or 6 hours a shift) as my husband is an over the road driver, 95% I'm their only care giver. That said, I've got an 11 year old female Border Collie mix and a Blue Heeler/Border Collie male who is a little over a year old. Yes, the youngster is crated, for his protection and actually loves his crate. If I didn't crate him, there's no telling if he might get over stimulated, cross a line and upset his sister.

As I've got intense breeds, they are run daily! I've got a dog's backyard; green grass, one apple tree and completely fenced, however I have house dogs so they stay inside while I'm away from the house.

The rare times I'm scheduled an 8 hour shift, my lunch hour is dedicated to them; 20 minutes to drive home, 20 minutes for them and 20 minutes back to work. If the roads are icy, I'm fortunate enough to have a trusted friend to come over and let them out.
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Old 09-26-2016, 12:27 PM
 
4,022 posts, read 2,609,521 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cleosmom View Post
I work part time (5 or 6 hours a shift) as my husband is an over the road driver, 95% I'm their only care giver. That said, I've got an 11 year old female Border Collie mix and a Blue Heeler/Border Collie male who is a little over a year old. Yes, the youngster is crated, for his protection and actually loves his crate. If I didn't crate him, there's no telling if he might get over stimulated, cross a line and upset his sister.

As I've got intense breeds, they are run daily! I've got a dog's backyard; green grass, one apple tree and completely fenced, however I have house dogs so they stay inside while I'm away from the house.

The rare times I'm scheduled an 8 hour shift, my lunch hour is dedicated to them; 20 minutes to drive home, 20 minutes for them and 20 minutes back to work. If the roads are icy, I'm fortunate enough to have a trusted friend to come over and let them out.
I understand the need to crate occasionally, especially with a puppy but IMO crated all day 5 days a week (even with a mid day break) plus whenever you're not at home is not fair to a dog. I'd put a kennel in the back yard so at least the dog could move around in good weather or put him in one room and the other dog have the run of the house. No matter how much a dog loves his crate, that's a lot of time to be crated and let's face it being crated has to be boring. IMO it's not fair for a dog to be crated that much.
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Old 09-26-2016, 02:55 PM
 
Location: Santa Barbara CA
4,714 posts, read 10,178,066 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowan123 View Post
I understand the need to crate occasionally, especially with a puppy but IMO crated all day 5 days a week (even with a mid day break) plus whenever you're not at home is not fair to a dog. I'd put a kennel in the back yard so at least the dog could move around in good weather or put him in one room and the other dog have the run of the house. No matter how much a dog loves his crate, that's a lot of time to be crated and let's face it being crated has to be boring. IMO it's not fair for a dog to be crated that much.
Jazz who was a border collie X cattle dog mix had the run of downstairs and was able to got outside to my small fenced area. I had to set up an ExPen opened side to pet door with a top on it and heavy planters around it so she could not push it around as she would go over a fence to go try to find me. It was an area big enough to do what she needed too but not so large she wanted to stay out there. It was her bathroom .For years she would come home from a walk and run out the pet door to use her bathroom . Being I was gone 12 hrs she did need a place to pee so this worked great.

When she was younger I moved everything of value upstairs to my guest room unless it was up high enough and put baby locks on cabinets in the kitchen as before I did she would open them and pull out all the pots and pans and scatter them around the kitchen. When she matured and I added Dash to the mix I was able to return things to the down stairs and had no problems so it was just during her long puppy hood.

She LOVED her crate and slept in it as a puppy with the door closed when I slept I would never keep her in it for long periods as she needed to move about and be able to play with her many toys. The crate was there and door off so when I was getting ready for work she would go lay in it and when I walked out the door I gave her the command she longed for and that was "Go find them" referring to the stuffed bones I had hidden all over the downstairs.

She invented a game where she and Dash would find the bones clean half the stuffing out of them.When I got home and had breakfast the minute I was done one by one she would bring me the bones. I would push out what remained and make them do tricks for it until they were all empty. There were 6 bones total. After she died breakfast time was hard as I missed that game as it was part of my life for so many years. Dash and even later Phoenix understood the rules that they were not allowed to pick up the bones and bring them to me so they would run and dance in excitement around a bone waiting for the Queen Jazz to come pick it up then race to me with her to see what trick they had to do.

If you lived with Jazz you lived with rules as she had all sorts of funny games that the other dogs joined in but had to follow her rules. That is the fun thing about intelligent dogs they can find ways to entertain themselves and given the right environment they do not have to be destructive things! When I was busy around the house she always made me laugh as she would be involved in one of her silly games as she waited for me to finish what I needed too.

When people visited and witnessed some of her games they would ask me how I taught her that well I did not teach her any of them they were 100% her games her rules.

Being at work does not mean a dog can not be moving around a home and even having some fun that does not create damage. It might mean changing some things around the home to create a safe place for the dog or coming up with solutions to problems such as my use of the expen so she could pee outside yet not jump my fence.
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Old 09-26-2016, 03:10 PM
 
Location: Kansas
19,185 posts, read 15,018,492 times
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The idea of "holding it" for hours doesn't sit well with me and anyone out of the house most of the time, why get a dog. Yes, the fate of some dogs in shelters isn't good, but many of those end up there because people who didn't have the time or didn't put in effort to make a situation work put them there when they weren't a cute puppy anymore. Some people are so ignorant that they believe the dog will just housebreak themselves and stop chewing things up thus the number of dogs in the shelters that are not housebroken and who chew things up.

Not all dogs can "hold it" for hours on end. I had a friend whose dog would vomit when it couldn't get out to pee/poop. I have seen that in other dogs. Sad.

The Importance Of Letting A Dog Urinate - Boo Boo's Best
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Old 09-26-2016, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Canada
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I have a border collie. My lifestyle with my dog now is that I work from home 3 days a week, commute to the office 2 days a week. However, when I first got Izzy as a puppy I was working 5 days a week outside the home. I took the first couple of weeks off to allow him acclimate to his new home, as well as to start training him. And at the time I still had my older dog, Kaya, which I believed helped Izzy immensely into adjusting to his new life.

For the first few months that I had Izzy - until he'd matured enough to not have to go outdoors every 3 or 4 hours - I was leaving work at lunchtime and travelling home to give him a bathroom break, stretch his legs (he was crated for the first year) and to have some playtime. However, once I felt Iz was mature enough to handle a full day at home without me there, I stopped going home at lunchtime. And Iz transitioned easily. Kaya died when Izzy had just turned one year old, and yet I had no problems with him staying alone. His fears escalated when we lost Kaya - very noticeable when we went for walks...he'd looked at her as his protector, I think - but he still adjusted easily to being home alone. He'd been acclimated to a certain lifestyle, and (importantly) as a highly active dog breed, he'd been taught to have an "off" switch. He knew that after we returned from early morning fun time, breakfast was scheduled, and then he'd chill and relax while I went off to work.

For those who work all day outside the home, I think what has to be looked at is this:

- the age of the dog, how long is reasonable for being able to go without a bathroom break
- whether the dog is truly alone, or if are there any other pets that can offer company
- crate training for the dog's (and the home's) safety for the first several months, esp. if it is a puppy
- the is owner willing to concede to paying someone to come into the home once or twice a day in the beginning if they cannot do so, to ensure the dog gets bathroom breaks (if needed) and interaction
- training the dog (not only to be able to adjust to being alone for several hours a day, but also to adapt to a crate as a puppy...crate training in itself can be a great success or a huge failure, depending upon how it is approached)
- and this one is a biggie (imo): the owner is willing and able to commit to a schedule that is good for the dog (i.e., a minimum 1/2 hour outdoors playing/walking/exploring/running off leash at least twice a day, no exceptions)

In order for a dog to be able to stay home alone while the owner works, the dog's needs must first be met - feeding, walking, playtime, expending energy(!) before the owner leaves, and after the owner returns (amount of all this needed depends on the individual dog). If the owner can leave the house with a dog who is fed, watered, pee and poop done, and energy / human interaction done, then typically, the dog should be fine to be left alone - within reason - until the owner returns. Satisfy the dog first, train the dog, and upon return home, meet the dog's needs again. This is a huge key (imo) to having a happy, healthy dog who can stay home by himself without stress or anxieties building up. My guy is a high energy breed, but he also stresses extremely quickly - yet on the days when I return from work I am met by a smiling, "okay, it's time to go out now" happy dog.

I don't believe that a person who works away from home cannot offer a wonderful home to a dog, just so long as the person is willing to put in the time and effort for the dog, both before and after work. And since all dogs are individual, that person must be able to recognize when something is too much for that individual dog (or puppy) to handle, and when help may need to be brought in, especially early on in the puppy's (or adult dog's, if the new acquisition is not a pup) life. Dogs don't need to be coddled, to have someone there for them at all times, but they do have to have their needs met, they do need to be introduced to a certain lifestyle gradually, and they do need training in order to adjust, when first brought home. It's a matter of structure, balance, and the human being able to not only train the dog, but to recognize when something either isn't working, or is an unrealistic expectation.
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Old 09-26-2016, 04:00 PM
 
Location: Texas
43,549 posts, read 52,647,623 times
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I had a dog for a few years with no one at home from 9 to 5. She did fine. She napped, chewed toys, whatever. But that was after she was a puppy. When she was a puppy, we had someone come over mid morning, one of us would come home mid-afternoon or late lunch, etc. To help potty train and because puppies eat 3 times a day for a while.

I have never left a dog older than a few months old (basically when they can hold it all night) in a crate.
Once they are potty trained (around 4-6 months), we throw the crate in the garage and they get penned/gated/doored off into certain parts of the house.

Once they are good dogs (1-2 years old), they can be unsupervised all over the house wherever they want. I would never leave them in the yard unsupervised.

These are all collies, so YMMV.

p.s. I got a second dog for the first time about 8 years ago. The older one died after 3 years, but I saw how much better it was to have 2 dogs, so we got another dog a year later. Two is great for the dogs. Someone is always home now, but 2 is still better.
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