My Dog Growled at Me (ridgeback, labrador, bite, poop)

[Mikala43]

My 14 month Rhodesian mix crawls up on the couch at night. I know how to stop that if I want to.

He lies on my side, so when I get up in the morning he is in my spot. He is usually sound asleep when I push him over so I can sit down. A couple times he has growled. I ignore and shove him over. I take it as his being grumpy at being woken up. It's a light, one time growl, like he forgot he was talking to me and not the other dog. When I move him over the growling does not continue.

This morning he laid his teeth on me. Not hard at all, not even as hard as when he plays, I didn't jerk my hand away, but told him to get off the couch if he can't be nice, and he did.

These are the only times when anything like this has occurred. Normally he is very sensitive if is getting scoldings, very receptive to my commands and we have a good bond. I can take food out of his mouth, or whatever with no problem and it is clear both dogs know that Mom is boss.

So I'm torn on the appropriate response. 1) I'm cranky when woken up and can't be help responsible for my immediate reaction , 2) Part of me thinks I should scruff him and give him major scoldings, 3) part of me thinks ignore it as I am comfortable that he is not going to ever bite me and continue to ignore it and shove him off my spot.

I know some people are going to freak out because he did touch me with his teeth (put them on my hand gently and left them there).

What say you all?

Edit: the growl has been more of a grumble. It's not a throaty growl AT me, it's a grumble as he moves

[TFW46]

I'm so sorry this is happening, Mikala.

Unfortunately, the time to correct this behavior would have been the first time he growled at you. Now it has escalated and will be much more difficult (and much more dangerous for you) to eliminate. And, sorry to say, I'm afraid that he will bite you. He's already progressed from growling to laying his teeth on you. Why are you confident that he'll never bite you?

I'm not "freaking out" but I was a dog trainer for 25+ years and saw this problem often. And you have a Rhodesian mix, a dominant breed anyway, and a male dog who's starting to mature, regardless of whether he's been neutered or now (I'm sure you're intelligent enough to have had him neutered).

First, please dont anthropomorphize his behavior, in this or in any other situation. The fact that you're cranky when first awakened doesnt allow your dog to be cranky to you when he's first awakened. Dogs have to live by certain rules and one of those rules is that they never, ever challenge the boss.

Since your dog's behavior has escalated, what you need to do depends on how knowledgeable you are about dogs. You seem to be knowledgeable about a lot of life issues, but dog training and looking at the world through a dog's eyes is a unique talent. What I'd do and what you should do are probably two very different things. I'd suggest contacting a good dog trainer for help. Good luck!

[OttoR]

Oh hell no! I've had Rhodesians in the past and these are not dogs for inexperienced/first time owners or those not comfortable being in charge. The first thing I would recommend is getting your dog into a BALANCED training class (and do your homework, every single day). Second, start implementing leadership tactics, every day consistently -http://www.dogtrainingbasics.com/becoming-pack-leader/ (note that includes not having the dog on your bed). Third, start utilizing "place" command and long downs. Kalahari Rhodesian Ridgebacks -taming your tiger with the longdown - FWIW, I have done this with dozens of dogs and never taken 5 weeks to accomplish it. By the end of the first week, the dogs are doing 30-45 minute long downs. You can not "fur mommy" these dogs and not expect them to take advantage of the opportunity to run the household. Your Rhodesian is now training YOU and letting you know that HE is the leader of the house and the boss of you; HE sleeps where he wants to and you are not to disturb him. This morning, you didn't listen to the first correction he gave you so he had to give a firmer correction. Next time, he may be even firmer until you get the message that he is in charge. Nip that sh*t in the bud NOW (it should have been started at 8-10 weeks old and you wouldn't be having this problem).

[Mikala43]

I hear you TFW! And I wondered if I was anthropomorphizing......

I'll talk to my trainer.

And that's why I'm asking, so I am confidant that my response is right when I do respond.

I can set him up for failure by rudely moving him over every morning, so I can create the opportunity for the proper response.

My tendency seems to be towards over disciplining so I am trying to adjust, and perhaps overshot my goal with this.

Next time he does it I can scruff him and remove him from the couch with a "no!" and send him to his crate.

[Mikala43]

Ok, just wanted to make sure, like I said, I have a tendency to be what I feared was being overly firm (ironically reading here made me doubt myself).

I can correct both behaviors quickly (and no, I will not beat my dog or anything).

He was raised with very firm rules and obedience (nothing physical) and I have been inundated with "positive training" so I started going easier on him.

Guess I over compensated.

[Rowan123]

The growl wouldn't necessarily bother me but the teeth would. You did the right thing in having him get off the couch immediately. If he does it again, I'd do the same thing.

When mine have done something like that they immediately get a firm and loud NO from me and they stop it. As long as he's not trying to be dominant in other ways, it should be fine. I do think a "firmer" hand is in order but I don't think anything radical needs to be done (and may be counterproductive).

[slyfox2]

The leader of the pack thing has been proven to be false with dogs. The original research was done on wolves thrown together in zoos; follow up research on wolves in the wild showed a warm family arrangement. However, people who like to be dominant over everyone, dog or human, may still believe it because it matches their view of the world.

However, I would not tolerate either a growl or a teeth, and the dog would be in immediate timeout(crate with blanket over it). And I would not permit the dog to sleep with me for at least two weeks as a consequence.

I had a dog that started to do that, and eventually I had to put him down(a purebred Labrador). He got more and more possessive over what he thought was his, which was actually given to him by us.

I would go back immediately to hand feeding, and tethering him to you, requiring a “sit” for everything he gets from you(and other tricks). He needs to be reminded who is feeding him and who is providing his welfare. You can do this without punishment.

[Mikala43]

Just to be clear, the inmates are not running the asylum.

It was the couch, not the bed. Dogs are not allowed upstairs. No baby gate or anything, the just know that the stairs are off limits.

So I went upstairs twice, and Dante climbed on the couch next to dad. So the couch was completely taken, so twice I sat on him (not full weight but enough to be quite rude...), and not a peep out of him, but a few licks. Told him to get down and he did. Later sitting on the other couch he asked permission to come up and insisted on hugs.

So yes, I do think he is cranky in the morning. So tomorrow I will push him aside to get my seat and with the slightest grumble he is getting a strong "NO" and will be evicted from his spot.

I know Rhodesian's are strong willed, but he is very well behaved. I'm with him all day, so he is constantly eyes on me and responding to my commands. No treats without earning them.

[OttoR]

Originally Posted by slyfox2

The leader of the pack thing has been proven to be false with dogs. The original research was done on wolves thrown together in zoos; follow up research on wolves in the wild showed a warm family arrangement. However, people who like to be dominant over everyone, dog or human, may still believe it because it matches their view of the world.

However, I would not tolerate either a growl or a teeth, and the dog would be in immediate timeout(crate with blanket over it). And I would not permit the dog to sleep with me for at least two weeks as a consequence.

I had a dog that started to do that, and eventually I had to put him down(a purebred Labrador). He got more and more possessive over what he thought was his, which was actually given to him by us.

I would go back immediately to hand feeding, and tethering him to you, requiring a “sit” for everything he gets from you(and other tricks). He needs to be reminded who is feeding him and who is providing his welfare. You can do this without punishment.

Yeah, we keep hearing that from the PP camp, however I always subscribe to “show me your dog.” I’ve yet to see a dog in a “pack leader” home that wasn’t well behaved and mentally balanced, secure in knowing they had a strong leader. On the other hand, I see many “fur babies” that are obnoxious spoiled brats, dragging owners down the street, trash talking dogs and people passing by, having “anxiety” issues, destructive behaviors, nuisance barking, and running the house. Personally I prefer living with a well-behaved, relaxed dog that I can take anywhere without an issue so I’ll stick with those “outdated theories” that have been working for generations. The proof is in the dog and my dogs get positive comments on their behavior everywhere we go.

[bondaroo]

Originally Posted by OttoR

Yeah, we keep hearing that from the PP camp, however I always subscribe to “show me your dog.” I’ve yet to see a dog in a “pack leader” home that wasn’t well behaved and mentally balanced, secure in knowing they had a strong leader. .

I work in a shelter. I see plenty of dogs that have been trained by heavy handed people who think you have to dominate a dog physically and mentally. The dogs are are insecure, defensive and sometimes dangerous. And that's why people dump them - so that people like me can try to re-train them to make them safe to be in a household.

Some dogs will be fine with heavy handed treatment. Those are the ones people keep and brag about how their dog "knows their place" in a "pack leader" environment. Congrats to them, they got lucky and have a tolerant dog.

You can be assertive with your dog (like it sounds Mikayla is being) without buying into the dominance bullpoop.